Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Back when I had the MY99 I fitted a Dawes when they first appeared on the scene and the performance increase was excellent compared to the price.

Can you still put a Dawes on a MY01 Bugeye? Is the performance increase worth it? Any known issues?

Cheers
Richard.

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

From reading through some other threads it looks like the Dawes is as easy to fit as on previous models and that, as before, you're recommended to get a boost guage installed.

Power increases probably wont be as good though since the MY2001 has a third cat in it.

Ninnybobs

I think you hit the nail on the head there Scotsman.

I fitted a Dawes to my Bugeye just after it was new and set it just under 1 bar. This gave a noticable increase in drivability.

Martin

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Martin - did you just have the Dawes and nothing else?

Ninnybobs

Scotsman,

At that stage I had a full decat exhaust, panel filter as well as the dawes device

Martin

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Ah - thanks.

wrxtankie

Not much after 1 bar and you will hit the fuel cut your head will hit the windscreen as it happens lol

chris_c201

Scotsman....

You gonna fit this? I'm thinking about it too... currently stock apart from panel filter altho planning a decat down-pipe and an STi backbox in the new year..

Maybe a dawes set to about 1.05 bar and a boost guage as well......

Let me know how you get on if you fit this, curious to hear your thoughts!

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Hi Chris

I'm probably leaning more towards decatting the downpipe, getting an STI backbox as well but rather than a Dawes I'd go for a Tek2 remap by Andy F. I wouldn't need a boost guage then and the price difference wouldn't be that great (plus I'd get
a better map).

Saying that, I've only owned the car for a couple months and I told myself (and my wife by mistake!) that I'd keep it as standard for a while. However, it just doesn't feel as spritely as my old modified Classic (as you'd expect).

So, I'm going to 'try' and hold off as long as I can before doing any modding.

Did you notice any difference from putting the panel filter in?

Richard.

Neilo

I did this with just a center decat, panel filter and a boost guage, the results were quite good really, gave me nigh on PPP power, for about 150 quid combined

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Ohh... tempting!

So you just kept the normal catted downpipe and backbox (what year was your car?)?

Neilo

it was an 03, i did have a different backbox too, sorry i forgot to mention that. I had the dawes set at 1.1bar, never had any fuel cut issues. Had it checked out on delta dash and it wasnt causing any knock that wasnt already there (as in background knock)

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Ah - thanks.

Good idea checking it out with DeltaDash - did that as well when I had a dawes on my old classic (before the remap).

Neilo

when i say it gave me PPP ish power, i had it RRd before i did the dawes thing and the car made 247bhp, @ 0.95bar, so the extra 0.15bar boost and center decat should have raised that to 260 ish...

Andy.F

A dawes has its place but is more suited to the earlier TD05 range of turbos than it is the TD04 of the 97 onwards cars.
The reason for this is that it can only be set at one boost level which will be the target throughout the rpm range.
A TD05 is capable of supplying for example 1.1 bar flat throughout the full range, the TD04 turbo is not, or at least not efficiently.
Typically a TD04 turbo'd car on a dawes set for maximum power will make poor torque, or vice versa, if set for good torque the top end will suffer due to overheating of the charge at anything over 0.9 bar. An Ecutek remap on a TD04 is likely to have a considerable profile to the boost map throughout the rpm range.
One other thing to watch on the 01 onwards WRX, if you still have the uppipe cat take care how much boost you hold at high rpm, if it starts to melt then its bye bye turbo as the bits fly off This also applies to when remapping them, luckily the 01 onwards WRX has an EGT sensor for the ECU to control this temp pre turbo and that can be monitored on the laptop.

Andy

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Thanks Andy - I think if I'm going to do it then I'm going to do it properly and go for the remap - I certainly found the Tek remap on my old Classic better than the Dawes I had on it.

Richard.

chris_c201

Richard,

I would say the panel filter is worth doing, slightly crisper throttle response although i changed to optimax at pretty much the same time so hard to pin point where it came from...

The main reason i would say it is worth it though is you can hear air getting sucked in clearer and the turbo whistle sounds slightly louder as well.... again it may just be my imagination as i was specifically "listening" for it afterwards...

For £35-45 and literally about a 30sec job i think its worth it...

As for the dawes device, cheers for the advice Andy, i'll prolly give it a miss as it was more of an afterthought to the decat downpipe / backbox route anyway. Good to have a definitive opinion on it from someone that knows a "little" about scoobs, lol.

New Plan - Next year, decat down-pipe, STi backbox, boost gauge (for aesthetic reasons really!)

Following year (if i can hold off that long) - Decat up-pipe and re-map.....

Richard, if you get any of the above done keep me posted on your impressions!

(darn modification bug bites big time eh!)

Chris

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Will do Chris and likewise if you get anything done before me.

DIPSY

Scotsman get a tek3 remap by Andy f makes a difference.I had a my2000 uk turbo full hs system panel filter had tek2 exchange ecu the car felt worse.Then frew Awd in Perth got a tek3 remap by Andy f what a difference it made to the car and thats down to the top class ecu mapper ie Andy F

Scotsman

iTrader: (3)

Given the limited amount of mods I plan to do initially, Andy doesn't think a Tek3 would be 'that' much better than his Tek2 at this stage.

He's certainly the man to go to though and I'm lucky to live close by!

Andy.F

Kevin, the Tek2 is an "off the shelf" map that tuners can compile themself.
All I'll say is your Tek2 came off a different shelf

Andy

Milamber

iTrader: (2)

and sphincter opens wide too

easyrider

Theres nothing wrong with putting a Dawes on-Ive allways been very sceptical about remaps over manual boost control, especially with the ECU's on the newage scoobs-If you do a search, you may find that some people prefer them over remaps due to the better power delivery. The OBD2 ECU's are so adaptable with raised boost, that you shouldnt have any probs unless you go too high on the boost.In the 2 years that ive had a Dawes on my MY02,ive monitored it closely(AFR's,knock,peak/held boost,EGT's),and it copes well with a decat up/downpipe(kept center cat),freeflow rear box,dawes set to 1.15bar-peaks at 1.22(fuel cut is at 1.25bar).All tested with hot/cold weather, hard driving, normal around town stuff and gentle cruising.The only time det becomes an issue is when an induction kit is added as this runs a bit too lean,which causes the odd spike but nothing horrendous-(ive kept my airbox as std to err on the side of caution).
As said before, the main thing that needs changing weather remapped or MBC, is getting rid of the up pipe so it doesnt trash the turbo.

Set at 1bar it has the edge on a newage STi, at 1.15 bar its a fair bit quicker.

Although i know Andy really does know his stuff, I personally dont totally agree with his comments about a Dawes with a TD04, as for every day driving i think it works great because it really highlights the fast spoolup of the TD04-lets face it , how often do we drive around at 6k revs everywhere.Even on a std TD04'd car, its turbos working overtime above 5.5/6k.

Personally, even on a remapped car, i would have a Dawes on it, as i love the way it brings the power in, i would always at least monitor it for det though.

Hope this helps in your decision making.

Gary.

Andy.F

Everyone will have their own opinion Gary. There is however a bit more involved in a remap than whacking up the boost ! Some of the remaps I have done have actually involved reducing the boost.
On the new age cars there is an excellent boost control system in the ECU that lets you for example adjust the boost profile by rpm, throttle position, ramp rate, overshoot and gear selected.
Time spent sorting this out can improve on-road performance to a level way above a dawes.
As I said, the dawes has its place, I actually use one on my race car with the Apexi but would prefer a Denso ECU's control system anyday.
Thats just the boost control side of the remap, knock control/recovery, air fuel ratio and ignition table adjustments all allow for improved performance over just tweeking up the boost.
I have some std/dawes/remap roaddyno runs from my own car during development that show the difference quite well.

Andy

easyrider

I appreciate all of what you say, as compared to what you know-i know very little about these things.
What i was getting at is the fact that you CAN just turn the boost up (within reason)and get very good gains with these ecu's , and be safe doing so.
To be honest, i would love to be able to learn how to do mapping, as it sounds very interesting.Sounds like it must be a bit of a minefield trying to get it right.

Any ideas on if/when you are going to try to beat your own records?

Great work you're doing there.

Gary.