scoobyster

Hi all

This must be a good place to ask...

I've just started an MSc in Automotive Engineering, half of this is a research project and dissertation and I'm struggling a bit to come up with a good idea. I want to do something experimental and/or analytical, definitely no control systems and preferably not too much computer simulation. Turboing my car would be a goodun but I doubt I'll get away with that I'm mainly interested in stress analysis (particularly innovative methods - photoelasticity, thermostrains, etc) and also composite materials.

Any bright ideas come to anyone's mind? Some thoughts I've had are looking at alloy wheels and why/how they buckle and how to combat this thru design, I'd use some experimental stress analysis method to do this. Another idea that I'm favouring at the minute is looking at composites for use in wind turbines, specifically to try to reduce their visual impact and I might look at noise too though a lot of work has already been done on that side of things. I realise that's moving away from the automotive side of things, but I think it might be interesting and worthwhile.

Any ideas/thoughts/views would be much appreciated.

Cheers,

Ben

David Lock

I would love to be doing a project on alternative fuels - biodiesel and stuff like that.

But that seems about a million miles away from your thinking so best of luck anyway! dl

KiwiGTI

How about some sort of forced air system that supplies additional power. How much would that save on fuel over a 100 mile journey and reduce the load on the car making it perform better etc

(To generate electrical power just to clarify)

Brendan Hughes

Whatever you can do to save fossil fuels, whether by alternative power generation or weight-saving / aerodynamics, may well be appreciated by manufacturers in the future.

greyarea

Dear Ben,

A couple of thoughts

First, whatever project you do will require a supervisor, I suggest that you identify potential supervisors and discuss any idea you have with them. The supervisor will know what level and type of resources are available to support your project.

Your research project is a means to learn and demonstrate specific skills in more depth than just from lectures. If you choose stress analysis as a field then you will need to learn/know computer simulation. You could use FE analysis to model the buckling of alloy wheels and investigate design changes. I would expect that you could do it cheaper and quicker through simulation than a repeated design/manufacture/test cycle. You would need some experimental data to validate your simulations. Your supervisor would be able to advise you on the availability of appropriate software and experimental facilities.

Good luck with your course.

James

warrenm2

How about using a turbo as a generator and removing the alternator, free power!

Brendan Hughes

Don't start your project or dissertation until the week before it should be due in.

Should give you plenty of material to work on then.

fast bloke

einstein might disagree

ru'

How about investigating scooby oil change procedures???


Seriously though, do something as simple as you can get away with!

warrenm2

It wasnt einstein that formualted the theory conservation of energy! He did relativity theory!

Its free power because otherwise it would be wasted, and you dont have to put more energy in, whilst getting more energy out

rr_ww

I cant imagine the great Engineers (Though of course you're hoping to become a Scientist) this country has produced, had to sit on a website and ask "What do you think I should do?"

Honestly! The rubbish our Unis churn out nowadays! All with 2:1 Grades. Think they are Gods gift to employers, but have no common sense on anything.

Need to have things spoon fed all the bloomin time!

scoobyster

Thanks for the replies, some interesting ideas. I really like the idea of bio fuel but I'm not sure if my chemistry is up to it, will have a think.

I quite like the turbine-alternator idea too, wouldn't be cheap though and would adding a restriction to the exhaust be better or worse than taking power from the crank? Maybe better with good design, I guess that's the research question! Will consider it, cheers.

James, I need a rough idea of what area I'm going to research before I approach potential supervisors, I have a tutor who I'm discussing ideas with at the moment. The uni favours Ansys for FEA, I've never had to use it but my mates that have despised it so I'm put off.

I'm actually being more imaginative than most by coming up with my own (or getting you lot to..!) idea rather than picking from a list of options (which are the dull leftovers as the undergrads picked the gooduns months ago). I already have a BEng so I'm a great engineer already

warrenm2

If your already a BEng you'll know the answer to "would adding a restriction to the exhaust be better or worse than taking power from the crank" - why do you think turbo cars exist?

fast bloke

1. you could be right, so who was it then? Certainly wasn't Lavoisier who was mostly responsible for the law of conservation of mass. Then Einstein worked out that mass and energy are equivalent, which made Lavoisiers law stating that mass is not created nor destroyed through the process of a (normal) chemical reaction, along with the nuclear discoveries of the time lead to the proposal of the conservation of energy. - I'll be glad to be educated who it was

2. unlikely - there would be a much greater load on the turbo, so the source of energy would be depleted much more quickly (crap fuel consumption)

fast bloke

or "Is turboing better than supercharging?"


Step 1 - define better

Brit_in_Japan

Try to identify something which will be attractive to companies when you leave uni. What are the hot topics for auto companies?

1. emissions - any technology which would reduce emissions will be of great interest to companies. They have to meet increasingly strict emissions regs so any new tricks will be of interest to them
2. alternative fuels/hybrid vehicles
3. materials used in novel applications, to reduce weight, cost, improve performance. E.g. what's the feasibility of making plastic/composite wheels instead of metal. Pros/cons. Involves stress, strength, toughness, manufacturing costs etc Could be some nice experirments, if you can find someone to make some wheels for you.....
4. Any manufacturing technique which has the potential to save them time or money

Whatever you choose, make sure you have an interest in it and that you don't bite off more than you can chew. It's all very well coming up with a good idea but if you need 2 or 3 years to do the job properly then you're going to struggle, unless you want to roll it into a PhD.

Good luck.

warrenm2

1. Appartently first stated in modern form by German surgeon Julius Robert von Mayer

2. Can you get all the electrical needs from the turbo generator - probably not. Will having a turbo generator extracting power from exhaust gases decrease performance of the engine - hardly at all, the only loss will be due to increased back pressure and a rise in pumping losses - which will be very low compared to the power extracted. Dont forget approx 35% of the fuels energy goes down the exhaust

scoobyster

Hello again.

Thanks for the replies. I'm going to go with a variation on the turbo idea seen as it's stirred up some debate I'm going to look at oil-free turbos using foil bearings, NASA have already done some work on this and are hoping to develop an oil free gas turbine engine.

I assume (need to do some reading up) a normal turbo must slow below 10k rpm (lower limit for shaft to be suspended in air) fairly regularly in normal use (off boost/idling), so even with NASA's 100,000 cycle foil coating (see link above) it's not going to last all that long before the foils wear out.

I'm told the Electrical Engineering dept at Sheffield have already done some work on turbine-alternators, I'll have to get hold of the paper(s) and look into it.

Anyone happen to have an old TD04 or similar lying around? A knackered one would do, I just want to take it to bits and have a look! Also, maybe I might get away with turboing my car (Impreza GL/Sport) as part of the project after all

Thanks again for the helpful replies.

Ben

David Lock

Have a happy 20 years then

rr_ww

I dont see the advantage of an Oil free Turbo on a Car engine. Its not like you have to lug around Oil solely for the Turbo is it.

And how come you have a BEng, but no idea how a Turbo looks like inside!

scoobyster

Lol, cheers David. My theory is I can do it a bit at a time and just stop in September, whether it's 'finished' or not. I'll start out with research obviously then work on the high temp coatings for the foils, at least that's new-ish research so will be worthwhile, then move onto the aerodynamics and practicalities and experimental testing

My BEng is in Aerospace so I know about axial gas turbines but have never done any work on centrifugal turbos before. Advantages of oil-free car turbos that I foresee are no cooking of your engine oil, no turbo timing issues, potentially extended life of the turbo, less loss in the bearing, plus no faff or weight of supplying with oil.

johnfelstead

The use of ceramics in engine components would be an interesting area to persue.

warrenm2

Sheffield info here

Best idea would be to combine with an electrical supercharger - like visteon are doing (but only to supplement an existing turbo and eliminate lag) see here and here.

I always thought ceramics would be good implemention of an Aspin valve as well....