dominicm

I'd just like to know what people think is the best proven option for a FMIC as I'm not sure which one to get?

Cheers

Dom.

bigsinky

I run a Pace FMIC as it come supplied with a new thin radiator and dual fans. you also don't have to hack away large pieces of front bumper to get it to fit. it also sits well back in the engine bay so stones and the like don't wreck the fins as much.

cheers

big sinky

Adam M

I would seriously try asking that on bbs.22b.com as you may get a more focussed answer.

The answer is that there is no answer because any design of fmic will be a compromise between cooling and flow efficiency. Some make fewer sacrifices than others due to improved and higher tech core designs. Some require you to hack bumpers etc.

My personal choice is a development of mark aigins.

It comes with rad but currently will not work with air con equipped cars.

I aim to get round that problem on my car with a custom aircon rad.
We ran the hks fmic on the dyno with my 2.5 engine and suspected that the hks was strangling the airflow adn thus limiting the power.

You can see the results in this thread.

it is difficult to quanitfy the gains directly as we also changed the headers at the same time, but regardless of this the power (which is directly related to airflow) was way way way up on the hks at the equivalent point in the graph. It was also at a point where the leaking from the headers would not have been an issue as the feedback conrol of the wastegate would have accounted for the leak by this point anyway since it was at full boost.

the graph shows it all, but bear in mind that peak torque after the change went up to 561lbft, and althought the highest power we achieved on the dyno with this set up was 1bhp lower than with the hks intercooler, it did arrive some 2000rpm sooner.

would have tested it further but the block let go . Oh well, next time!

dominicm

Big sinky,

How is your car set up and how much is your max boost and also how much pressure does it lose?

Adam,

Sounds like you kept Mark busy, very very impressive figures!!
My car mods so far are:
full decat, Zorst
K&N
uprated pump and reg
550 injectors
Link mapped by BOB
Bosch coils etc.
TD05

I want to see about 350bhp and over 300lb/ft, at the moment I'm about 320bhp and just below 300lb/ft and I think the standard slanty 'cooler is the next step, then I might look at a turbo!

Do you think the HKS is adequate for the above!!!

Dom

Adam M

Must admit to not thinking the hks had a problem until I saw what the other intercooler unleashed.

It is rated to 500bhp so I can't see it being the weak link in your system for a long time.

I have heard equally good things about the aps and hyperflow front mounts.

Am a fan of the mrt which mark ran some time back. It is smaller but its construction is bar and lpate which makes it a more sturdy design.

Alan mcraes car ran a cusco and that also seems to produce excellent results.

The pace is great due to shorter length pipework, but the core is small in comparison to the others I have mentioned and in my opinion doesn't make use of the space available to it. It does mean you need not cut the bumper but then so does the lateral performance (marks) unit.

Both these non bumper cutting designs seem to have the advantage of considerably shorter pipe lengths which should reduce pressurisation lag.

Andy.F

The APS and Hyperflow have both run well recently in the UK on 400+bhp cars, charge temperatures were kept well under control, they are approx £800 IIRC.

It may be worth your while looking at the FMIC group buy that is running just now, the prices (at under £400) are excellent and the quality is first class.

Beware of fitting too large an intercooler as you can overcool the air and reduce performance due to poor atomisation of the fuel.

Andy

Adam M

according to what I had read from the likes of ahmed bayjoo, cosworth tuners have found ideal intake temperature with regard to atomisation to be 40 degrees.

Andy's point is valid, but then a larger core could give the same cooling as a smaller core but in the process its larger size may allow it to be more open and thus produce a lower pressure drop.

This means the turbo doesn't have to work as hard to achieve the same pressure at the intake manifold as with a smaller but more restrictive core. You end up with the same charge temp and pressure but in one case the turbo is doing more work in the first place which is not as good a situation.

bigsinky

dominicm

car now runs a conservative 1.5 bar WOT in all gears. need to fit a 3" exhaust from turbo back and tweek the ecu before it is finished. Pressure loss? i dont know m8. the Pace FMIC sits well back in the engine bay thus avoiding big stone and other debris.

cheers

big sinky

dominicm

Bigsinky,

You've got a private message!

bigsinky

Dominicm

replied m8

harvey

iTrader: (48)

The Hybrid Front Mount is well made and we are waiting for feed back on user experiences. Fitting is more involved than with say the APS but for around £500 inc. tax delivered to your door it has to be worth the effort. The Pace does a job but it is not one of the most efficient intercoolers. I will be able to post a direct comparison in the performance of the Hybrid versus the APS shortly.

bigsinky

Harvey,

Is it the thinness of the PACE that makes the intercooler inefficient or the make up of the core. Surely the shortness of the piping on the PACE kits would make up for this. i would appeciate your comments.

cheers

big sinky

AndrewC

I can't comment on how the HYBRID compares with other FMICs, but I can say that lag is not the problem I thought it was going to be, in fact, off-boost/part-boost throttle response is considerably better than with a TMIC.

Running the same boost I was with a MY00 TMIC (1.4bar) needs more fuel, produces a consistantly lower intake temps and results in less engine noise with the FMIC.

Only problem is that I now seem to have a slipping clutch

If you are willing to put the extra effort in to fitting it, the HYBRID is unbeatable VFM.

Andrew...

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

I am running one of Marks intercoolers that Adam mentions..

Very happy with it

Car current spec.. errrmmm 550injectors, K&N filter, Marks FMIC and rad, intercooler pipework very short and done by me and Samco sponsorship(I wish), Link ECU mapped by Pat, uprated Walbro pump, FSE fuel regulator..

clicky engine bay

clicky intercooler and can

Car drives with no real lag on the TD05.. no idea on power as I have not been on a dyno with it..

JGM

DreXeL

Can someone post a link to the second Hybrid group buy thread? I can't find it

harvey

iTrader: (48)

I have not analised why the Pace is not as efficient as some others, probably the core that is used but I have observed that induction temperatures on Pace cars on track, are higher than with the APS for instance. Owners with PACE FMICs and the facility to measure induction and ambient temperatures mike like to post their observations.
The pipe length will have little to do with temperature because of the speed and volume of air passing when the car is on the move.

The Hybrid Second Group Buy is in Drivetrain.

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Jolly

LOL at the John Smiths can used instead of a ruler to gauge size

Don't the Hyperflow FMIC's come with their own induction kit ? I seem to remember seeing them on the JW Racing website..

Midlife.....