View Poll Results: How will you vote in the EU referendum?
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EU Referendum
05 July 2016, 02:25 PM
#3421
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Lordy you really believe a privately owned company HAS to accept the lowest tender...they may want to accept the lowest tender because they are a commercial entity and only there to make money maybe?!
Perchance do your buddies who supplied you with this information have a vested interest in moaning about potential job losses?
Perchance do your buddies who supplied you with this information have a vested interest in moaning about potential job losses?
http://www.maritime-executive.com/ar...raws-criticism
We have been able to dismiss the forced free market access to port services. Especially for safety and security concerns, ports must be able to decide on the organization of port services
It seems the majority of criticism of the regulations comes from the shipping companies and to do with variation of charges from port to port!
The UK's concern is more regarding the port access charges being set nationally rather than a port-by-port basis and how this affects them commercially as independent ports vs continental ports with state funding. What is perhaps a good thing is that any state funding will have to be declared under the new rules and may form the basis for unfair competition claims from independent ports!
As a general note, not just to do with ports. No commercial business can be forced to accept one tender over another be it on price or other basis. Any commercial business can make its own decision on its commercial contracts. What may be an issue to UK commercial ports who do tender services contracts, is because the access fees will be set nationally and no longer by the ports, they may have to accept lower bidders for commercial reasons as they can no longer hike their prices to cover more expensive 'preferred' service providers!
05 July 2016, 02:51 PM
#3422
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It doesn't take much googling to work out the facts!
http://www.maritime-executive.com/ar...raws-criticism
So first up, if a port runs its own services, it can continue to run them if it chooses and doesn't need to put them out to tender, although it seems this was not the case in the original draft!
It seems the majority of criticism of the regulations comes from the shipping companies and to do with variation of charges from port to port!
The UK's concern is more regarding the port access charges being set nationally rather than a port-by-port basis and how this affects them commercially as independent ports vs continental ports with state funding. What is perhaps a good thing is that any state funding will have to be declared under the new rules and may form the basis for unfair competition claims from independent ports!
As a general note, not just to do with ports. No commercial business can be forced to accept one tender over another be it on price or other basis. Any commercial business can make its own decision on its commercial contracts. What may be an issue to UK commercial ports who do tender services contracts, is because the access fees will be set nationally and no longer by the ports, they may have to accept lower bidders for commercial reasons as they can no longer hike their prices to cover more expensive 'preferred' service providers!
http://www.maritime-executive.com/ar...raws-criticism
So first up, if a port runs its own services, it can continue to run them if it chooses and doesn't need to put them out to tender, although it seems this was not the case in the original draft!
It seems the majority of criticism of the regulations comes from the shipping companies and to do with variation of charges from port to port!
The UK's concern is more regarding the port access charges being set nationally rather than a port-by-port basis and how this affects them commercially as independent ports vs continental ports with state funding. What is perhaps a good thing is that any state funding will have to be declared under the new rules and may form the basis for unfair competition claims from independent ports!
As a general note, not just to do with ports. No commercial business can be forced to accept one tender over another be it on price or other basis. Any commercial business can make its own decision on its commercial contracts. What may be an issue to UK commercial ports who do tender services contracts, is because the access fees will be set nationally and no longer by the ports, they may have to accept lower bidders for commercial reasons as they can no longer hike their prices to cover more expensive 'preferred' service providers!
So as I suspected just more noise which wilts in the face of a little investigation...or worse case scenario willful ignorance
05 July 2016, 07:40 PM
#3425
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So the Fox is out, and fancy Gove having merely 14 extra votes to show for; in compare to the Crabb who has been under the rock during the hoo-haa time. And look at the other lady who seems to be the second lead.
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews...Q&ocid=UE07DHP
Shame on Gove!
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews...Q&ocid=UE07DHP
Shame on Gove!
05 July 2016, 07:56 PM
#3426
Scooby Regular
And like moths to a flame it attacts people, people who want & need to feel "rage"
To make sense of their parlous existence
And they have had a relentless drip drip of this bullocks for nearly 30 years, I honestly think if the Express ran an article saying all babies born in the EU had to be tattooed, under the armpit with the Euro flag, people would uncritically believe it
It really has been a tragic couple of weeks for the UK, and sadly for simple rational common sense
05 July 2016, 08:10 PM
#3427
Scooby Senior
So the Fox is out, and fancy Gove having merely 14 extra votes to show for; in compare to the Crabb who has been under the rock during the hoo-haa time. And look at the other lady who seems to be the second lead.
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews...Q&ocid=UE07DHP
Shame on Gove!
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews...Q&ocid=UE07DHP
Shame on Gove!
05 July 2016, 08:16 PM
#3428
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05 July 2016, 08:35 PM
#3429
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05 July 2016, 08:47 PM
#3430
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yes, I agree. He didn't believe in the shyte what he was selling because he knew it was bull shyte. USP was immigration and rest was the whole load of lies. He sold the shyte alright, and he also believed in his ever hypnotic charms. Sadly for him and fortunately for the rest of the nation, his hypnosis didn't work. Bleddy good news. For now, anyway. You really don't know what people are capable of. If they fell for all that shyte, they might fall for his repaired charms in future. I don't think he's finished yet. Time will tell.
05 July 2016, 08:55 PM
#3431
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I'd also like to add that with others' co-operation, Boris has been successful to knock Camo off his post; with all this Brexit shyte. Although his plan to be the next PM hasn't worked out this time round, he has still achieved something there, hasn't he.
05 July 2016, 09:25 PM
#3432
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The problem I have with it is just that - noise
And like moths to a flame it attacts people, people who want & need to feel "rage"
To make sense of their parlous existence
And they have had a relentless drip drip of this bullocks for nearly 30 years, I honestly think if the Express ran an article saying all babies born in the EU had to be tattooed, under the armpit with the Euro flag, people would uncritically believe it
It really has been a tragic couple of weeks for the UK, and sadly for simple rational common sense
And like moths to a flame it attacts people, people who want & need to feel "rage"
To make sense of their parlous existence
And they have had a relentless drip drip of this bullocks for nearly 30 years, I honestly think if the Express ran an article saying all babies born in the EU had to be tattooed, under the armpit with the Euro flag, people would uncritically believe it
It really has been a tragic couple of weeks for the UK, and sadly for simple rational common sense
05 July 2016, 09:57 PM
#3433
Scooby Regular
There are large numbers of Christians that, like DYK, have voted leave on the AntiChrist ticket. The most frustrating thing for me is that the experts (my pastor, 'Glen the Poet' who's also a CofE minister and dozens of other men who study scripture daily) say the Brexit/Daniel/Revelation conflation is textually implausible balderdash! Even a couple of Christians I know who are literalists have dismissed it as irrational, lol!! So here again we have the experts losing out to the dilettante and the popinjay.
I have been saying it for years
06 July 2016, 07:44 AM
#3434
The problem I have with it is just that - noise
And like moths to a flame it attacts people, people who want & need to feel "rage"
To make sense of their parlous existence
And they have had a relentless drip drip of this bullocks for nearly 30 years, I honestly think if the Express ran an article saying all babies born in the EU had to be tattooed, under the armpit with the Euro flag, people would uncritically believe it
It really has been a tragic couple of weeks for the UK, and sadly for simple rational common sense
And like moths to a flame it attacts people, people who want & need to feel "rage"
To make sense of their parlous existence
And they have had a relentless drip drip of this bullocks for nearly 30 years, I honestly think if the Express ran an article saying all babies born in the EU had to be tattooed, under the armpit with the Euro flag, people would uncritically believe it
It really has been a tragic couple of weeks for the UK, and sadly for simple rational common sense
06 July 2016, 08:16 AM
#3435
Scooby Senior
There are of course some rules (EU or direct UK) which are good intentioned but perhaps badly implemented or open to abuse, the result of which is an overall negative impact, but these are generally the exception!
One interesting statistic that came out during the referendum debate (sorry was on TV so don't have a link), was there was a total of 8 EU rules over 43 years of membership that went against the will of the British government. So in our entire membership we have only been 'forced' by the EU to do something we didn't want to a total of 8 times! Unfortunately they didn't say what those 8 rules were! On the other side, the rules we wanted, amounted to a few thousand!
06 July 2016, 08:31 AM
#3436
Reporting this morning is that the EU-Canadian deal is likely to collapse, something to do with the EU not involving the member countries on the deal- doh
Hungarian October referendum
Italy going against EU rules supporting it own banks from collapse
Italian elections this autumn
French elections next year followed by Germany
Austria to re run presidential elections due to postal voting irregularities
Austria said it will leave EU if it fast tracks Turkey
Middle east/ African migration into Europe nearly doubled over last years figures, as over 220,000 arrived by boats into Greece, Italy and Spain
Busy time ahead for EU?
UK leaving the EU, removed the sticking plaster over the festering sore!
Hungarian October referendum
Italy going against EU rules supporting it own banks from collapse
Italian elections this autumn
French elections next year followed by Germany
Austria to re run presidential elections due to postal voting irregularities
Austria said it will leave EU if it fast tracks Turkey
Middle east/ African migration into Europe nearly doubled over last years figures, as over 220,000 arrived by boats into Greece, Italy and Spain
Busy time ahead for EU?
UK leaving the EU, removed the sticking plaster over the festering sore!
Last edited by andy97; 06 July 2016 at 08:51 AM.
06 July 2016, 10:20 AM
#3437
As with most rules, where they have a negative impact on one person they usually have a positive impact on another. Usually, the positives far outweigh the negatives, but you only ever hear about the negatives!
There are of course some rules (EU or direct UK) which are good intentioned but perhaps badly implemented or open to abuse, the result of which is an overall negative impact, but these are generally the exception!
One interesting statistic that came out during the referendum debate (sorry was on TV so don't have a link), was there was a total of 8 EU rules over 43 years of membership that went against the will of the British government. So in our entire membership we have only been 'forced' by the EU to do something we didn't want to a total of 8 times! Unfortunately they didn't say what those 8 rules were! On the other side, the rules we wanted, amounted to a few thousand!
There are of course some rules (EU or direct UK) which are good intentioned but perhaps badly implemented or open to abuse, the result of which is an overall negative impact, but these are generally the exception!
One interesting statistic that came out during the referendum debate (sorry was on TV so don't have a link), was there was a total of 8 EU rules over 43 years of membership that went against the will of the British government. So in our entire membership we have only been 'forced' by the EU to do something we didn't want to a total of 8 times! Unfortunately they didn't say what those 8 rules were! On the other side, the rules we wanted, amounted to a few thousand!
We have been paying heavily to be a member of a club where everyone cheats, and gets away with it, but us. And meanwhile, our club fees have paid for basket-case economies to rip jobs off from us.
No more!
PS: eight we didn't want? They didn't say WHICH eight because it was b/s, pure and simple, and would have been shown as such if they had
06 July 2016, 11:48 AM
#3438
Scooby Senior
Well, we know you are pro-EU, but you have missed out the numerous times member states ignore the rules, regs and laws if it doesn't suit them...whereas we don't.
We have been paying heavily to be a member of a club where everyone cheats, and gets away with it, but us. And meanwhile, our club fees have paid for basket-case economies to rip jobs off from us.
No more!
PS: eight we didn't want? They didn't say WHICH eight because it was b/s, pure and simple, and would have been shown as such if they had
We have been paying heavily to be a member of a club where everyone cheats, and gets away with it, but us. And meanwhile, our club fees have paid for basket-case economies to rip jobs off from us.
No more!
PS: eight we didn't want? They didn't say WHICH eight because it was b/s, pure and simple, and would have been shown as such if they had
Even if they are breaking ruled, do you really believe that we don't break any rules either?
You went on about the steel industry in the other thread, but I haven't found any evidence of any rule breaking by Germany or Italy! Yes they pay subsidies to reduce energy costs, which the UK has done too, but I didn't find anything saying rules were broken! This is an interesting article on the Steel industry problems:
https://next.ft.com/content/d91c122c...b-fc683b5e52db
As for not saying which the eight rules were, it wasn't really the point of the interview, the presenter actually stated it was 5, the Brexiter politician then claimed it was 8, to which the presenter responded "5 or 8 does it really matter compared to how many we voted for?"! The politician didn't really want to go into that number!
Last edited by BMWhere?; 06 July 2016 at 11:49 AM.
06 July 2016, 11:52 AM
#3439
Scooby Senior
Here's another story about state aid payments to the German steel industry dating from the mid 90's. They were ordered to repay the aid! They broke the rules - they did not get away with it!
https://www.theengineer.co.uk/inspir...e-aid-rules-2/
https://www.theengineer.co.uk/inspir...e-aid-rules-2/
06 July 2016, 07:59 PM
#3442
Bmwhere, do you REALLY think there's loads of stories out there about rule breaking? It gets hushed up.
Here's three for you, all France.
1. In the days of herring quotas, French boats were landing herring in defiance of EU rules. The harbour master turned a blind eye. I saw him do it myself on Look North.
2. The French government have, as long as I've owned property here, and in defiance of EU dictat, been charging TVA at a far lower rate on renovations carried out by French registered trades persons, than their normal rate. Every year the EU tells them they can't do that, every year, they promise not to do it again.
3. Look up the hidden state aid to Alsthom over the last five years......it'll make your eyes water. No sanctions.
As for steel, do you come from a steel town? Do you know anyone inside the steel industry? If not, and your "knowledge" is coming from the media, or worse, Google, I'd quite down if I were you. You're making yourself look soft.
Here's three for you, all France.
1. In the days of herring quotas, French boats were landing herring in defiance of EU rules. The harbour master turned a blind eye. I saw him do it myself on Look North.
2. The French government have, as long as I've owned property here, and in defiance of EU dictat, been charging TVA at a far lower rate on renovations carried out by French registered trades persons, than their normal rate. Every year the EU tells them they can't do that, every year, they promise not to do it again.
3. Look up the hidden state aid to Alsthom over the last five years......it'll make your eyes water. No sanctions.
As for steel, do you come from a steel town? Do you know anyone inside the steel industry? If not, and your "knowledge" is coming from the media, or worse, Google, I'd quite down if I were you. You're making yourself look soft.
06 July 2016, 10:09 PM
#3443
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That would be interesting, that would assuage all the anti immigration brigade whilst allowing us to keep the benefits of EU membership and avoiding economic meltdown!
06 July 2016, 10:15 PM
#3444
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Bmwhere, do you REALLY think there's loads of stories out there about rule breaking? It gets hushed up.
Here's three for you, all France.
1. In the days of herring quotas, French boats were landing herring in defiance of EU rules. The harbour master turned a blind eye. I saw him do it myself on Look North.
2. The French government have, as long as I've owned property here, and in defiance of EU dictat, been charging TVA at a far lower rate on renovations carried out by French registered trades persons, than their normal rate. Every year the EU tells them they can't do that, every year, they promise not to do it again.
3. Look up the hidden state aid to Alsthom over the last five years......it'll make your eyes water. No sanctions.
Here's three for you, all France.
1. In the days of herring quotas, French boats were landing herring in defiance of EU rules. The harbour master turned a blind eye. I saw him do it myself on Look North.
2. The French government have, as long as I've owned property here, and in defiance of EU dictat, been charging TVA at a far lower rate on renovations carried out by French registered trades persons, than their normal rate. Every year the EU tells them they can't do that, every year, they promise not to do it again.
3. Look up the hidden state aid to Alsthom over the last five years......it'll make your eyes water. No sanctions.
Talk to any coal miner about Thatcher, try and get a reasoned response.
Of course, his information could be coming from an independent source, which is more likely to be closer to the truth, you don't know, so you are no better placed to comment than he is, by your reckoning.
06 July 2016, 10:18 PM
#3445
This has only come about due to UK leaving the EU. The UK is leaving the EU.
This plan is to head off Hungary's referendum and Austria's border control with Italy.
It is a bit late by the EU. I truly believe the EU has hit the buffers and needs to be dissolved
This plan is to head off Hungary's referendum and Austria's border control with Italy.
It is a bit late by the EU. I truly believe the EU has hit the buffers and needs to be dissolved
06 July 2016, 10:23 PM
#3446
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I would agree it needs to be reformed, but I don't think dissolved.
07 July 2016, 07:40 AM
#3448
By the same token, you can't trust anything from a person who has been affected by the decline of the steel industry as they have a biaised view. It works both ways.
Talk to any coal miner about Thatcher, try and get a reasoned response.
Of course, his information could be coming from an independent source, which is more likely to be closer to the truth, you don't know, so you are no better placed to comment than he is, by your reckoning.
Talk to any coal miner about Thatcher, try and get a reasoned response.
Of course, his information could be coming from an independent source, which is more likely to be closer to the truth, you don't know, so you are no better placed to comment than he is, by your reckoning.
And as for Thatcher, well we all know how THAT ended. We are sitting on millions of tons of coal, enough for 300 years, yet we import it while men sit idle. Reasoned response? She was a spiteful ****.
07 July 2016, 08:24 AM
#3449
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So, and in your own words, precisely what IS the point of a club where everyone ignores rules that they don't like?
I know who I'd rather talk to about steel: a steelworks manager or the biased media.
And as for Thatcher, well we all know how THAT ended. We are sitting on millions of tons of coal, enough for 300 years, yet we import it while men sit idle. Reasoned response? She was a spiteful ****.
I know who I'd rather talk to about steel: a steelworks manager or the biased media.
And as for Thatcher, well we all know how THAT ended. We are sitting on millions of tons of coal, enough for 300 years, yet we import it while men sit idle. Reasoned response? She was a spiteful ****.
But everybody doesn't ignore the rules do they. More wild exaggeration.
Scargill was just as much of a 'character'...your emotive language proves Geeza's point; you cannot be objective on the subject. I think most will have empathy but it doesn't make you right.