phatso

just thought id share todays enlightening experience with you all ..

My Scooby Sport went in for a 6 month service today, brought the car back in March and as part of the 1 year warranty it had to have a 6month/6000 miles service with them (They're not Subaru dealer by the way).

for a little history .. the scooby is MY99, just under 5000 miles on the clock, and ready for its 67,500 / 54 months Service which was being done today. Anyway, the scooby got its service and cost little over 80 quid, not bad I suppose for just changing the oil and few other stuff (something I would have done it it wasn’t for the warranty). On paying the person they mentioned that the timing belt was due for a change, and proceeded to give me a lovely quote of 300 quid +VAT +Labour, probably in all 400+ quid, thinking to myself ... "ooook" and promptly left the garage to head home and think about it.

On the way home i popped into see my mate (a top notch mechanic) mentioned the price and his mouth dropped, told me that it shouldn’t cost at all what i got quoted. Gave me a quick quote of no more than 80 quid (all inclusive) unless the tensioner needs doing too. So now feeling relieved that my mate can give me a good price, but also feeling a bit peee'd that this garage can charge over 4 times the amount for it.

and if this story has a moral ending, just watch the little blighters dont take you on a ride! on your expense!

comments welcome

cheers, Lee

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

£80 all in sounds a bit cheap, as the belt is £75 or so from a reliable motor factor......a Gates belt, not a Scoob one.
Got mine done for £140 or so, and thought I'd done well.
Alcazar

phatso

cheers for the reply, not sure what the belt is but will check with him next week when he orders it, thanks for the info though.

He did say it was a rough price, but was no where be near the 400 quid from the other place. Just took me by surprise thats all, the price difference from garage to garage.

pays to ask around and not blindly hand over the old credit card to the first garage.

phatso

actually, if anyone can recommend a decent belt (with some rough prices) I would appreciate it. I like to know whats going in to my scoob

chiark

Cam belts are important on any car, and I know of one that appears to have been badly fitted which almost resulted in catastrophic failure - thankfully the owner stopped the car and had it flatbedded back home.

The belt had apparently jumped three teeth on two cogs, so consequently was running like a dog . Perhaps it was a problem with the fitting of the tensioner? I don't know the ins and outs, but it wasn't particularly cheap to put right - diagnosis, new belt, labour...

This is one area where I would want reassurance that the person fitting it knew exactly what they were doing, so I would without hesitation go to a Subaru franchised dealer or a select few specialists.

If something goes titsup, I'd want someone's head on a platter - hence I'll pay the money and take the reassurance and guarantee that gives.
Cheers,
Nick.

phatso

comments appreciated, the bloke im now getting to do the timing belt I would trust with my life, so now worries there.

When the CAM belt does come around, and if I still have this scoob by then, I'll be using a local specialist who resurrected my escort after a cylinder got stuck and some other damage occured, dont mind paying a little extra for a professional job.

Going back to being ripped off though, makes me sick that as some motorists just dont question what they're paying for, that these garages are just waiting for them and take them for a ride.

Another garage did something similar to a mates car, stripped the engine on a less-than 1 year old car, to find nothing was wrong in the engine and ended up writing-off the car due to the cost of rebuilding it back up.

anyway .. <ranting over>

ozzy

I agree up to a point with Nick (Chiark), but what rattles my cage is we are charged excess based on worry and paranoia.

You could say the same with any work on your car - spark plugs, timing belt, camblet, brakes, etc.. If fitted incorrectly all have the potential of causing further damage.

Any Dealer should be qualified to do any work on your car to a set standard. I don't think we should be forced to pay premium for anyone doing their job.

The cost should be simply based on the cost of the part and the time involved in doing the job correctly. If you're unhappy with the quote ask them to explain what is involved and how they have costed the job.

If they say it's a 2hr job and the part costs £140, then it's easy to see if a £500 bill is overpriced or not.

If they run into difficulties, then I can see why the cost would vary, but I'm certainly not going to pay extra if their mechanic takes much longer to change a cambelt that someone else. If they say it's 2hrs, then that's all I expect to pay unless they have a damn good reason for it taking longer.

Get them to stick their necks out and quote the time involved and parts costs. Then it's up to them to justify any more time or money involved on doing the job.

If they don't, time to pick another Dealer.

Stefan

chiark

True.

Make sure that the place you are using understands how to set/replace as necessary the cam belt tensioner, that's all

Cheers,
Nick.

ozzy

I'm sure of you ask "do you know what you're doing?" the mechanic will give you an honest answer or a smack in the gob

Stefan

dnb

I'm merely an amature mechanic, but I changed my Scoob cambelt in an hour and 45 mins - the first Scoob belt I've done. It was done properly too... (It's the older tensioner on mine, so that simplifies the job somewhat) Oh, and my labour is free to me. (And my family/close friends - just don't encourage them )

The belt was on special offer from Crossroad Garage. Price was £50. (You remember, the tire fiasco people!! ) I believe that £70 to £75 is about right for a Gates belt at the moment.

Don't forget that there is incredible mark up in the price of car bits, purely from the distribution. The belt probably costs about £2 to make - the rest comes from Gates selling it to Subaru, Subaru selling it to IM, IM selling it to the dealers and the dealers selling it to you. Each one wants some profit - ie the price probably doubles at each exchange, so if you can cut out even one link in the chain, you're winning by a mile.

I agree completely that the work needs to be done properly. However, just because you're paying top dollar for the work, doesn't mean it's being done well.

ozzy

So Gates manufacture the belt for Subaru then? I thought Gates were an alternative to the OE one.

I'm getting my cambelt done on Friday, so think I'll make sure the robbing barstewards aren't gonna try it on.

Stefan

RichWalk

Hi DNB, my company exports for DAYCO just had a look at approx prices, we r 1 level away from the factory dist in UK. Normal 2.0 Impreza we'd sell to major o/seas clients £8-9 each, the Turbo version is much bigger belt but would be approx £20-25 each.

Are Gates OE to Subaru on this belt?

phatso

excuse my ignorance, but isnt the timing belt and cam belt to seperate parts?

Going back to my details, ive had a CAM Belt work done on the 45k service (car was actually 34k at the time), my next CAM belt isnt due for another 40,000 miles or 18 months (the 90k mileage) and its currently on the 67.5k/54 month Service (car is actually at 50k on the clock) ... confused yet?

Im not totally mechnically minded, so is the CAM belt totally different to the Timing belt, or they actullay the same thing and im getting totally screwed??

Regards, Lee (getting confused)

dnb

The prices were guesses on my part, based on my experiences in the electronics industry. They were only really intended to illustrate the point of markup in the supply chain. I've nothing against it, as we all need to earn money somehow - I just try to avoid markup where I can!

I think Gates make Subaru OE belts, but not 100% sure. I know they make a large range of belts for other car manufaturers.

Similar sort of thing with lambda sensors - 80% (very approx) of the world's supply are made by Bosch!

RichWalk

hi DNB again... yes your evaluation of how these prices reach retail level is very accurate, the companies like mine who stock the bloody things usually end up making the least margin (which is OK if u have huge volumes, but doesnt always work that way!)My price guide was to backup exactly what u were saying... Probably of no interest to you but we also are in process/about to launch 300+ range of direct lambda sensors, we are the UK distribs' for Facet, who will be one of only 4/5 manufacturers in the world with lambda technology.

Cheers Rich.

chiark

cam belt/timing belt are the same thing - but I am clueless so could be wrong

dnb

Ask me again about lambda sensors in 10k miles or so!

phatso

Just got a quote from a website for a Timing Belt ..

Impreza 2.0i Timing Belt

Eng Series :EJ20E
Eng cc :1994cc
Eng Type OHC
No of Teeth/Belt Width :211 x 30mm

QTB - 345 £ 25.09


Was orginally quoted £68+vat for this part from said garage, now thats a massive markup! with the other parts they said i needed when they changed the timing belt (Tensioner + Idlers) its a grand total of £300+vat

Id hate to know exactly how much they'll would making out of me if i did use them.