More useable power on MY99 UK
27 February 2004, 05:40 PM
#1
More useable power on MY99 UK
Current Spec is:
MY99 UK 4 Door
Full Mongoose de-cat (turbo back)
HKS SSQV
Samco Silicon Hoses (turbo-intercooler)
Tek3 Map (by JB) 17.4/17.5psi peak
Pagid grooved discs and 421 pads.
I like very much the way the car drives but I feel the need for a bit more punch.
Ideally I would like to budget an additional £1500-£2000 for this project.
What I would like to avoid is changing to FMIC, changing the gearbox (or breaking it) or expensive bangs/re-builds.
Following a bit of initial research I feel around 350bhp may be attainable.
Off the top of my head I am currently looking at:
Turbo ....TD05/06-20G....how suited are these?...Any other contenders?
Re-map or EBC (or both?)
Knocklink
Clutch ...AP Oragnic Racing Clutch? (not inc in budget as current one is knackered anyway)
Am really not too techie with cars so all views/advice along the way would by most appreciated.
Bob
MY99 UK 4 Door
Full Mongoose de-cat (turbo back)
HKS SSQV
Samco Silicon Hoses (turbo-intercooler)
Tek3 Map (by JB) 17.4/17.5psi peak
Pagid grooved discs and 421 pads.
I like very much the way the car drives but I feel the need for a bit more punch.
Ideally I would like to budget an additional £1500-£2000 for this project.
What I would like to avoid is changing to FMIC, changing the gearbox (or breaking it) or expensive bangs/re-builds.
Following a bit of initial research I feel around 350bhp may be attainable.
Off the top of my head I am currently looking at:
Turbo ....TD05/06-20G....how suited are these?...Any other contenders?
Re-map or EBC (or both?)
Knocklink
Clutch ...AP Oragnic Racing Clutch? (not inc in budget as current one is knackered anyway)
Am really not too techie with cars so all views/advice along the way would by most appreciated.
Bob
27 February 2004, 06:11 PM
#2
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20G because it will be easier to get 350 BHP out of it with a TMIC than a 16G. £800
Fuel pump, reg. £200
Knocklink. £140
Remap. ?£250
Labour
AP Clutch.
And that is pretty much your budget almost spent, but...
Optional depending on how easy/unstressed you want your 350 BHP to be:
K&N 57i induction £80
550cc injectors £250
Turbo inlet pipe £150
Exhaust manifold/uppipe - eg Gruppe S £350
With the price of FMICs now, could be a good idea. £350?
Fuel pump, reg. £200
Knocklink. £140
Remap. ?£250
Labour
AP Clutch.
And that is pretty much your budget almost spent, but...
Optional depending on how easy/unstressed you want your 350 BHP to be:
K&N 57i induction £80
550cc injectors £250
Turbo inlet pipe £150
Exhaust manifold/uppipe - eg Gruppe S £350
With the price of FMICs now, could be a good idea. £350?
27 February 2004, 06:39 PM
#3
That sounds very reasonable. I have a preference to keep the car visually std looking (under bonnet too).
They're was a great GB of FMIC but I just missed out.
Will the std TMIC be okay or best to go for an STi one if its any better?
The std 440 injectors should be okay for 350bhp so I will stick with them unless there are any adverse effects?
Is the exhaust manifold you mention an equal length one? I would perfer to keep the flat four burble unless equal length manifold results in alot more torque.
I had the re-map penciled in for around £400 from preliminary enquiries...is this too much.
I dont want to focus too much on 350bhp as a figure...its just how much I have read the UK box can tolerate...I want something that pulls hard from as low down as possible.
I will snap up the GBs on Fuel pump/reg and knocklink to get the project underway.
Cheers
They're was a great GB of FMIC but I just missed out.
Will the std TMIC be okay or best to go for an STi one if its any better?The std 440 injectors should be okay for 350bhp so I will stick with them unless there are any adverse effects?
Is the exhaust manifold you mention an equal length one? I would perfer to keep the flat four burble unless equal length manifold results in alot more torque.
I had the re-map penciled in for around £400 from preliminary enquiries...is this too much.
I dont want to focus too much on 350bhp as a figure...its just how much I have read the UK box can tolerate...I want something that pulls hard from as low down as possible.
I will snap up the GBs on Fuel pump/reg and knocklink to get the project underway.
Cheers
27 February 2004, 07:12 PM
#4
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FMIC would be best by far. 440s are marginal at 350 BHP - if you run high fuel pressure get a regulator capable of a bit more pressure than the 5 Bar that the FSE one can run to if you are sticking with 440s.
Torque not power will kill the box.
Gruppe S manifold is non-equal length, boxer sound still there in abundance.
Torque not power will kill the box.
Gruppe S manifold is non-equal length, boxer sound still there in abundance.
27 February 2004, 07:31 PM
#5
How much bhp and torque can I safely acheive with the proposed mods?
If 550s will help I will keep an eye out for 2nd hand ones and then sell the 440s to try and keep within budget. Presumably FSE reg will be okay with them.
Not really sure of the benefits of Gruppe S headers, but may consider them if worthwhile.
Will I be able to vary boost via dawes after map? Already have boost gauge.
If 550s will help I will keep an eye out for 2nd hand ones and then sell the 440s to try and keep within budget. Presumably FSE reg will be okay with them.
Not really sure of the benefits of Gruppe S headers, but may consider them if worthwhile.
Will I be able to vary boost via dawes after map? Already have boost gauge.
27 February 2004, 07:50 PM
#6
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If the ECU has been mapped to handle various boost levels and your mapper is not freaked out by the idea, then yes a Dawes could be used to alter boost levels, but there wouldn't be much point unless you were reducing it for a hot track day.
FSE will be fine with 550s.
Gruppe S headers will allow the same power at lower boost.
T-uk's MY00 did 341 BHP at one of the more conservative rolling roads with APS FMIC, TD05, fuel pump/reg, original 440 injectors, Gruppe S headers, APS induction. Take away the FMIC and the headers and it would lose about 10%.
FSE will be fine with 550s.
Gruppe S headers will allow the same power at lower boost.
T-uk's MY00 did 341 BHP at one of the more conservative rolling roads with APS FMIC, TD05, fuel pump/reg, original 440 injectors, Gruppe S headers, APS induction. Take away the FMIC and the headers and it would lose about 10%.
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27 February 2004, 08:32 PM
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I am being cautious with figures. You will struggle to get 350 BHP on any rollers without the FMIC and headers with a TD05 and a sensible tune.
If you use a TD05/06-20G it will make up for the other deficiencies to some degree. But it is arguably less elegant to use a bigger turbo to counteract poor breathing and cooling. On a limited budget for ambitious power you will have inefficiencies somewhere along the chain. Some will sap power more than others.
If you use a TD05/06-20G it will make up for the other deficiencies to some degree. But it is arguably less elegant to use a bigger turbo to counteract poor breathing and cooling. On a limited budget for ambitious power you will have inefficiencies somewhere along the chain. Some will sap power more than others.
27 February 2004, 09:08 PM
#9
Really want to avoid going for a FMIC. Is the STi intercooler bigger than MY99 uk one?
Also am looking at getting some parts from across the water as the GBP vs USD is so good the minute...are 565 injectors compatible?
Even if 350bhp is not realistically attainable, I'm sure the mods will make a considerable difference to my little TD04 output.
Am looking for
as opposed to 
Also am looking at getting some parts from across the water as the GBP vs USD is so good the minute...are 565 injectors compatible?
Even if 350bhp is not realistically attainable, I'm sure the mods will make a considerable difference to my little TD04 output.
Am looking for
as opposed to
28 February 2004, 10:00 AM
#10
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Not sure the 565 will fit - check with Pavlo.
FMIC & manifold really is the way to go for this sort of power, but you can use a bigger turbo.
You are going from 107 BHP/litre to 175 BHP/litre. Think of the stresses involved!
FMIC & manifold really is the way to go for this sort of power, but you can use a bigger turbo.
You are going from 107 BHP/litre to 175 BHP/litre. Think of the stresses involved!
28 February 2004, 01:21 PM
#11
Am really wanting to keep it within budget and want the mods to be reliable.
TD05/06-20G = £845
Fuel Pump/reg = £200
Knocklink = £140
Re-map = £400
Labour = £100
Tots up to just under £1700 on std injectors or £1900 on 550s.
Really dont want to spend £3000 (inc clutch) as I cant justify spending that sort of money as the cars dont seem to hold any value nowadays.
Maybe 350bhp with my budget is too much.
TD05/06-20G = £845
Fuel Pump/reg = £200
Knocklink = £140
Re-map = £400
Labour = £100
Tots up to just under £1700 on std injectors or £1900 on 550s.
Really dont want to spend £3000 (inc clutch) as I cant justify spending that sort of money as the cars dont seem to hold any value nowadays.
Maybe 350bhp with my budget is too much.
28 February 2004, 06:29 PM
#13
porting the headers could be more cost effective than getting uprated ones. Have no idea of the costs involved though.
Are these easily done (locally) or is it best to get it done by somebody from here (Harvey springs to mind)?
Just had a friend of mine over with his Fiat Coupe 20v Turbo, wanting me to drill holes into his airbox (a well known Coupe mod apparently) and I did this and was v suprised at the change in noise...has a nice induction note now. Haven't heard of this being done to any other cars though but it seems like quite logical. Any thoughts?
Are these easily done (locally) or is it best to get it done by somebody from here (Harvey springs to mind)?
Just had a friend of mine over with his Fiat Coupe 20v Turbo, wanting me to drill holes into his airbox (a well known Coupe mod apparently) and I did this and was v suprised at the change in noise...has a nice induction note now. Haven't heard of this being done to any other cars though but it seems like quite logical. Any thoughts?
29 February 2004, 01:52 PM
#19
Originally Posted by stevebt
you only have a budget of £100 for all labour
and ive just had my tek3 tweaked and it was £350+vat
and ive just had my tek3 tweaked and it was £350+vat£100 should be sufficient for labour on fitting turbo, injectors, fuel pump and reg. I know the mechanic who will do the work (under direction) and I pay for his time. Fitted my turbo, anti-roll bar link and rear lights last time which took best part of the day and I paid him £90...Mind you wouldn't let him work on it alone as it worried me when he wasn't used to the flat four rumble and put it down to a misfire...! He's a good mechanic though specialising in Italian motors.
29 February 2004, 07:24 PM
#22
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Bob,
Yet another 350bhp project
The thing to consider is that just bolting on a bigger turbo, fpr and fuel pump and remap and expecting 350bhp isnt always gonna happen. In fact twice i have done this and both times been left with less bhp. Both times has cost me £000s.
In my opinion its a matter of the combination of parts working together. Why dont you try a mod or 2 at a time, that way you can see whats working and whats not working. Maybe try power runs in between (£40 a time).
Ive finally completed my project and dont know what power i got, but have made my gearbox/diff whine like mad in a few days driving.
What interests me is that people want 350bhp and dont talk about chasis modifications. I use coilovers, AP 4 pots, poly bushes etc etc to be able to use this power. Power is nothing without control.........
Yet another 350bhp project
The thing to consider is that just bolting on a bigger turbo, fpr and fuel pump and remap and expecting 350bhp isnt always gonna happen. In fact twice i have done this and both times been left with less bhp. Both times has cost me £000s.
In my opinion its a matter of the combination of parts working together. Why dont you try a mod or 2 at a time, that way you can see whats working and whats not working. Maybe try power runs in between (£40 a time).
Ive finally completed my project and dont know what power i got, but have made my gearbox/diff whine like mad in a few days driving.
What interests me is that people want 350bhp and dont talk about chasis modifications. I use coilovers, AP 4 pots, poly bushes etc etc to be able to use this power. Power is nothing without control.........
01 March 2004, 12:57 PM
#23
Would you be able to post details of the mods you tried with details of effectiveness (with figures).
The only thing with doing a couple of mods at a time is the need to map some of them for effectiveness, it just costs alot less to map all at once.
Am keeping my eye out for coilovers or failing that I may go with eibachs and anti-lift. Car has 4 pots std.
bob
The only thing with doing a couple of mods at a time is the need to map some of them for effectiveness, it just costs alot less to map all at once.
Am keeping my eye out for coilovers or failing that I may go with eibachs and anti-lift. Car has 4 pots std.
bob
01 March 2004, 03:12 PM
#25
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BOB, what sort of power is your 99 running i have the same car with the samw mods apart from the tek 3 , did it make much difference? as i am told this is a good way to go with a 99 car.
01 March 2004, 03:30 PM
#26
Originally Posted by neen
BOB, what sort of power is your 99 running i have the same car with the samw mods apart from the tek 3 , did it make much difference? as i am told this is a good way to go with a 99 car.
Getting a tek3 made an even bigger difference tough
Dont have dyno figures but I would say around 260-270bhp (am sure JB can give a more accurate figure)
Tek3 is only as good as the mapper
Can equate to 13.1secs 1/4 mile (have had mine @13.4 on a slippery strip)
Bob
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