GlesgaKiss

Just flicked over to channel 4 and discovered this excellent program. Will be on at 10 on C4 +1 if anyone wants to see it. Basically trying to expose a lot of the fallacies surrounding government spending and 'stimulus'. Surprised channel 4 have been allowed to air this much common sense in a oner.

Anyone else been watching? What do you think?

Cocker

iTrader: (3)

yep watching it, horrendous viewing. We're all f***ed and our kids are gonna be even worse off by the sound of it

dunx

iTrader: (3)

I haven't learnt anything new yet...

I enjoy baiting the "Labouites" at work by pointing out that they and their family members each "owe" around £70,000... but they are too thick to understand the difference between a budget deficit and actual debt.

Depressed dunx

P.S. I earn 50% more working for the council than I did in production engineering. ( SADLY )

P.P.S. Recently at a "bean feast" with the Head of Education Leeds where I overheard someone saying, "Their Mother is a working Prostitute, so that ticks another box...", SIGH !

GlesgaKiss

They don't realise that there is no way out other than to face up to it dunx. At some point they will have to (we all will), and the longer it goes on the worse it will be. The joy of politics... It's driven this county into the ground and it's the reason 'stimulus' exists.

Learn a chinese language and move over there to open up a british restaurant, would be your best bet.

Petem95

Will be watching this on 4oD later. Channel4 programmes are usually not afraid to present the real facts (unlike the BBC which always has a politically correct/left wing slant), so it should be interesting.

IMO the UK and other Western countries cannot get out of the situation they are in. Living standards simply cannot continue as they are - for us the NHS and many social services such as the Welfare State are totally unsustainable, and will slowly disappear over the next few decades. The country just cannot afford these things - not by a long shot.

The sooner we face up to this and start to cut back and save money in the controller manner the better, as otherwise it's bankruptsy and very bad times.

kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

Dont worry as soon as the economic benefit of 2 million immigrants into the Country over the last ten years kick in, we will be out of this mess in no time.

Petem95

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/b...ry/4od#3139408

Available to watch online now! Worrying how all the MP's they questioned at the start didn't seem to know what the national debt was, and a few seemed to think 'budget deficit' was actually the debt, when it's infact the increase in the debt each year!

Well worth a watch!

fast bloke

This is 95% fact and 5% scaremongering. If you focus on the 5% scaremongering they are speculating on then you should probably buy the Daily Mail tomorrow, as they will reinforce your views

GlesgaKiss

Agreed, there is a bit of that. When I posted this thread I'd only flicked it over and watched 10 mins half way though - just thought it was pretty good program to educate people, explained in simple terms etc. Maybe the worst case won't happen, but I think the most likely outcome will be that average real income and quality of life gradually drop as the country gets run further into the ground by the politicians. I know you could say it's the fault of the people who vote for them, but IMO we shouldn't have the power to change aspects of economic and personal freedom, etc. Still, maybe it is just best to move away if you feel like that. I've been thinking about it for a while.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

I personally think that this country can be compared to the state of MG-Rover after BMW flew the nest.

Its management kept everything going to save face and keep a good image, whilst secretly racking up debts, and travelling the globe to find a buyer before the creditors call time. The last resort of the saga resulting in trying to get Chinease manufacturers on board. But being shrewd they knew if they waited for it to go bump, they could just pick up the last worthwhile pieces without the unwanted baggage that is the UK operations.

I see the UK as a whole in a similar situation - hence why Cameron was in China to see if they could give us some money. In the end all they've done is buy a few jet engines (and some pigs), in which they'll probably strip down, copy, and produce/maintain themselves for a tenth of the cost of ours....or wait for UK operations to go bump and buy them off the liquidators for a pittance.

Just wait; Soon we'll have the Comac Noodlebus C380 double decker aircraft, powerered by Wolls-Woyce Taishan 900 engines. And UK supermarkets will be selling Chinese bred pork chops...

corradoboy

3x longer than it needed to be. I got bored of being constantly told how big 4.8 trillion is, and them trying to illustrate it in ever more inventive and entertaining ways. Basic fact is that we need to manufacture more and tax less. As long as we predominantly consume we are doomed to run out of cash. Rocket science it ain't.

SJ_Skyline

Some of the numbers were truely shocking, comparing the UK and Chinese public sectors was an eye opener for sure. Ultimately with such a large public sector the associated pension liability is going to be the big problem in years to come.

Comparing Hong Kong to the UK was also clever although healthcare wasn't mentioned with the UK having huge NHS liabilities.

IMHO the two key policies needed are:
- Light Touch Taxation.
- Light Touch Government.
Proven time and again that if taxation is lowered, tax revenues increase. The whole "tax them till the pips squeak" approach didn't work in the past and with modern global mobility will just drive business overseas to a more tax-efficient domicile.

Leslie

Those responsible should be hung out to dry!

Les

r32

You lot are so gullible, you'd believe anything.

You all know Gordon was a whizz as a Chancellor, so good they made him Prime Minister, and he claimed the credit for saving the Worlds economy by showing them the way. I mean why would the Government of the day spend huge pots of money when they owed so much, come on, it just doesnt make sense.
This programme was a con.

zip106

In the meantime, finding out China has bought most of the US Government bonds seems to worry me a tad bit more...

r32

Yes, China owns the USA

Petem95

Some very good examples of just how big the national debt is - for example if every house and flat in the country was sold, and the money went towards paying off the debt - there would still be over £1trillion left to pay!!!

The only way out is to slash the size of the public sector (by more than half) as the programme mentions, then get more people actually producing things to export - but what the programme didn't really mention is we can't manufacture a lot of things at competitive prices anymore.

zip106

Chap on the radio today seemed to mention that.
And the fact that countries going debt collecting usually ends up with full on warfare.

Oh joy.
The world ends in 2012.

GlesgaKiss

It's an achievement being able to see that though. Modern economists have almost convinced everyone that spending drives growth, that the Chinese need us to consume their produce. Biggest con in the history of the world.

corradoboy

Just the environmental damage caused by reliance on Chinese products should be enough justification for western governments to move towards localised manufacturing, but the big money men won't allow that of course.

Dedrater

Would of been a better program if it was called "Dedraters Nearing His Overdraft Limit" and then based on me using Jamies 30 minute meals to feed the family because my time is precious because I need to go hunting Unicorns for the next days meal/

Leslie

I saw the recording yesterday.

How we are being conned! Politicians have developed over the years in a very unpleasant manner!

Les