55mph in 50 zone.............
15 March 2006, 06:42 PM
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55mph in 50 zone.............
A19 this afternoon at Seaham. Was doing roughly 55 through temporary roadworks when spotted camera van. Snooper did not go off until a van in the outside lane drew level with me then stamped on his brakes then the snooper activated .Does anybody think i got snapped by the van?.Or was it the van in the outside lane that got clocked ?
mick
mick
15 March 2006, 07:51 PM
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More likely the van if the camera was pointed that way....old bill usually factore in 10% +2, so unless it's been a particularly nasty accident black spot, i doubt you'll have been snapped. In 2 weeks time you'll know for sure.
I'm sure someone will send you the link for the most recent court loophole surrounding cameras if you have been caught
I'm sure someone will send you the link for the most recent court loophole surrounding cameras if you have been caught
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15 March 2006, 08:29 PM
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you can be done at any speed regardless of the guidelines, those went out the window, as for the camera vans, they decide who to pick on, its not automated, they cost more money so its operated by the person inside, so they tend to choose the nice high speeders 
15 March 2006, 08:53 PM
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55 on your speedo was quite possibly only 51 real mph anyway - unless you were doing 55 by GPS and 60 on the speedo (?) I'd imagine you'll be OK. I have come in sight of vans at an indicated little bit over the limit, but by <10mph on the speedo and with others going faster than me - haven't got nicked yet (touches wood, prays for nothing nasty in the post and generally hopes he hasn't tempted fate)
15 March 2006, 11:08 PM
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the 10% + 2 or whatever is carp (as has been said).
As far as i understand from reading surveys\interviews with high level police there was a big UK wide survey done in TG and Bike magazine a year or so back which showed different areas in the UK had different tolerances before they issued speeding fines... unfortunately for me in N Wales it was mostly zero tolerance :E
Strange the Snooper didnt go off, mine gos off even for areas that have the roadside camera pods which dont take your speed unless a van\car is near and patched into them (both on straight roads with NO hiding places for cop cars and it always buzzes, and theres no camera poles\boxes in sight..)
As far as i understand from reading surveys\interviews with high level police there was a big UK wide survey done in TG and Bike magazine a year or so back which showed different areas in the UK had different tolerances before they issued speeding fines... unfortunately for me in N Wales it was mostly zero tolerance :E
Strange the Snooper didnt go off, mine gos off even for areas that have the roadside camera pods which dont take your speed unless a van\car is near and patched into them (both on straight roads with NO hiding places for cop cars and it always buzzes, and theres no camera poles\boxes in sight..)
15 March 2006, 11:22 PM
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Rules regarding MANUAL speed checking devices and cameras are that they cannot be used randomly, they can only be directed at cars that the operative considers to be exceeding the speed limit, they are not allowed to target every car in the hope of catching a speeding motorist.
I would say that the van coming up behind you was targetted because he was observed driving at what the device operator considered an excessive speed, hence it was only when the device was checking the van speed that your snooper activated.
Can I just get on my soap box a little here, I run a business that specialises in installing cones and signs for major motorway works, the speed limits are there to protect both the public and the workers. In the past 2 years I have had the job of knocking on 2 of my employees front doors and advising their families that they have been hit by a speeding motorist in roadworks, and they are seriously injured. That is not a pleasant job believe me, luckily on both occasions they survived, but spent many weeks in hospital, and I get all of the grief from the HSE.
Please observe the speed limits in roadworks, we are only trying to make a living, and someone has to do the work.
I would say that the van coming up behind you was targetted because he was observed driving at what the device operator considered an excessive speed, hence it was only when the device was checking the van speed that your snooper activated.
Can I just get on my soap box a little here, I run a business that specialises in installing cones and signs for major motorway works, the speed limits are there to protect both the public and the workers. In the past 2 years I have had the job of knocking on 2 of my employees front doors and advising their families that they have been hit by a speeding motorist in roadworks, and they are seriously injured. That is not a pleasant job believe me, luckily on both occasions they survived, but spent many weeks in hospital, and I get all of the grief from the HSE.
Please observe the speed limits in roadworks, we are only trying to make a living, and someone has to do the work.
15 March 2006, 11:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Martyn Tonks
Rules regarding MANUAL speed checking devices and cameras are that they cannot be used randomly, they can only be directed at cars that the operative considers to be exceeding the speed limit, they are not allowed to target every car in the hope of catching a speeding motorist.
I would say that the van coming up behind you was targetted because he was observed driving at what the device operator considered an excessive speed, hence it was only when the device was checking the van speed that your snooper activated.
Can I just get on my soap box a little here, I run a business that specialises in installing cones and signs for major motorway works, the speed limits are there to protect both the public and the workers. In the past 2 years I have had the job of knocking on 2 of my employees front doors and advising their families that they have been hit by a speeding motorist in roadworks, and they are seriously injured. That is not a pleasant job believe me, luckily on both occasions they survived, but spent many weeks in hospital, and I get all of the grief from the HSE.
Please observe the speed limits in roadworks, we are only trying to make a living, and someone has to do the work.
I would say that the van coming up behind you was targetted because he was observed driving at what the device operator considered an excessive speed, hence it was only when the device was checking the van speed that your snooper activated.
Can I just get on my soap box a little here, I run a business that specialises in installing cones and signs for major motorway works, the speed limits are there to protect both the public and the workers. In the past 2 years I have had the job of knocking on 2 of my employees front doors and advising their families that they have been hit by a speeding motorist in roadworks, and they are seriously injured. That is not a pleasant job believe me, luckily on both occasions they survived, but spent many weeks in hospital, and I get all of the grief from the HSE.
Please observe the speed limits in roadworks, we are only trying to make a living, and someone has to do the work.
cheers mick
16 March 2006, 07:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Martyn Tonks
Rules regarding MANUAL speed checking devices and cameras are that they cannot be used randomly, they can only be directed at cars that the operative considers to be exceeding the speed limit, they are not allowed to target every car in the hope of catching a speeding motorist.
I would say that the van coming up behind you was targetted because he was observed driving at what the device operator considered an excessive speed, hence it was only when the device was checking the van speed that your snooper activated.
Can I just get on my soap box a little here, I run a business that specialises in installing cones and signs for major motorway works, the speed limits are there to protect both the public and the workers. In the past 2 years I have had the job of knocking on 2 of my employees front doors and advising their families that they have been hit by a speeding motorist in roadworks, and they are seriously injured. That is not a pleasant job believe me, luckily on both occasions they survived, but spent many weeks in hospital, and I get all of the grief from the HSE.
Please observe the speed limits in roadworks, we are only trying to make a living, and someone has to do the work.
I would say that the van coming up behind you was targetted because he was observed driving at what the device operator considered an excessive speed, hence it was only when the device was checking the van speed that your snooper activated.
Can I just get on my soap box a little here, I run a business that specialises in installing cones and signs for major motorway works, the speed limits are there to protect both the public and the workers. In the past 2 years I have had the job of knocking on 2 of my employees front doors and advising their families that they have been hit by a speeding motorist in roadworks, and they are seriously injured. That is not a pleasant job believe me, luckily on both occasions they survived, but spent many weeks in hospital, and I get all of the grief from the HSE.
Please observe the speed limits in roadworks, we are only trying to make a living, and someone has to do the work.
In 5 months of doing 40-50 mile each way commute down the M4, there have been 7 places where there have been long 50 limits with no roadworks, no lane restrictions, just a few cones on the hard shoulder. Occasionally, some work on the verges for a hundred yards in a 6 mile limited zone. Ever wonder why people ignore the limits?
16 March 2006, 07:48 PM
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Here here!!! It seems that every major road in my area is cluttered with cones and speed restrictions every mile or so!!! Never a workman in sight! Its took them seven weeks to replace approx 18 road signs on a 3 mile stretch of dual carriageway and still not finished . Utter chaos and this costs me time and money. On the A1 from Gateshead southwards there are umpteen speed restrictions for non existent roadworkers. Why not concentrate on a couple at a time then we would respect limits knowing that they were needed
16 March 2006, 08:22 PM
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Firstly may I point out I am not accusing the originator of disregarding speed limits in roadworks, it was intended as a general comment from the "other side" if you like as to why these limits are in place, and the effect on others if they are disregarded (cones don't stop cars / lorries from hitting my guys)
Meanwhile I fully agree with those of you that have had to crawl through areas where there seems little activity or a few cones on the side of the road, and recommendations made in various documents state that it is not acceptable to impose mandatory speed restrictions where works are confined to hard shoulders or verges. I am sick and tired of contractors imposing limits in these situations.
I do however have some knowledge as to how the temporary speed limit system works, and we as an industry are governed by those rules.
Where works are confined to night works only, then during the day some schemes are "cleared back" to the verge or hard shoulder as part of the contractual requirement to avoid inconvenience to the motorist during the normal working day, A recent one we have installed is on the M42 between junction 9 & 10.
At night (because we are generally a nocturnal bunch) we install systems overnight to allow the main contractor to move plant and equipment onto the road reducing the number of lanes, in this situation a speed limit is necessary to protect both workers and the public. HOWEVER Temporary Traffic Restriction Orders (TTROs) allowing us to implement these speed restrictions are in place 24 HOURS a day, we cannot impose a speed limit at certain times and not at others, the policing and enforcement system does not allow for this situation, the contract either has a speed restriciton or it doesn't, those are the rules we MUST play by.
Meanwhile I fully agree with those of you that have had to crawl through areas where there seems little activity or a few cones on the side of the road, and recommendations made in various documents state that it is not acceptable to impose mandatory speed restrictions where works are confined to hard shoulders or verges. I am sick and tired of contractors imposing limits in these situations.
I do however have some knowledge as to how the temporary speed limit system works, and we as an industry are governed by those rules.
Where works are confined to night works only, then during the day some schemes are "cleared back" to the verge or hard shoulder as part of the contractual requirement to avoid inconvenience to the motorist during the normal working day, A recent one we have installed is on the M42 between junction 9 & 10.
At night (because we are generally a nocturnal bunch) we install systems overnight to allow the main contractor to move plant and equipment onto the road reducing the number of lanes, in this situation a speed limit is necessary to protect both workers and the public. HOWEVER Temporary Traffic Restriction Orders (TTROs) allowing us to implement these speed restrictions are in place 24 HOURS a day, we cannot impose a speed limit at certain times and not at others, the policing and enforcement system does not allow for this situation, the contract either has a speed restriciton or it doesn't, those are the rules we MUST play by.
16 March 2006, 08:29 PM
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Being Cleveland Police, they'd have done both of you 
Middlesbrough has one of the largest drug and prostitution epidemics in the country. Now they could spend time trying to stop those criminal drug dealing gangs, or ........... they could do you for slightly speeding, while sat on their fat @rses in the back of a van.
The brown envelope will be with you soon mate.
Middlesbrough has one of the largest drug and prostitution epidemics in the country. Now they could spend time trying to stop those criminal drug dealing gangs, or ........... they could do you for slightly speeding, while sat on their fat @rses in the back of a van.
The brown envelope will be with you soon mate.
16 March 2006, 08:35 PM
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Rules regarding MANUAL speed checking devices and cameras are that they cannot be used randomly, they can only be directed at cars that the operative considers to be exceeding the speed limit, they are not allowed to target every car in the hope of catching a speeding motorist.
The reality is (in 100% of the cases I have seen) always to the contrary
16 March 2006, 08:49 PM
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traveling down the A19 this morning about 11.30 ish .Iwas going pretty slow due to a heavy snow shower when i spotted a camera van in the layby no marking on it just the 2 black flaps on the back door open was doing about 40 so dont have to worry today
.But further down the road was 2 marked volvos sitting in the layby and the same in the next layby. also 1 on the side ov the road with blues on doing nothing at all and 1 in the next layby with an escort pulled over no wonder cleveland has got all the problems if there just sitting on the A19 trying to catch speeding motorists 
.But further down the road was 2 marked volvos sitting in the layby and the same in the next layby. also 1 on the side ov the road with blues on doing nothing at all and 1 in the next layby with an escort pulled over no wonder cleveland has got all the problems if there just sitting on the A19 trying to catch speeding motorists
16 March 2006, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Martyn Tonks
Firstly may I point out I am not accusing the originator of disregarding speed limits in roadworks, it was intended as a general comment from the "other side" if you like as to why these limits are in place, and the effect on others if they are disregarded (cones don't stop cars / lorries from hitting my guys)
Meanwhile I fully agree with those of you that have had to crawl through areas where there seems little activity or a few cones on the side of the road, and recommendations made in various documents state that it is not acceptable to impose mandatory speed restrictions where works are confined to hard shoulders or verges. I am sick and tired of contractors imposing limits in these situations.
I do however have some knowledge as to how the temporary speed limit system works, and we as an industry are governed by those rules.
Where works are confined to night works only, then during the day some schemes are "cleared back" to the verge or hard shoulder as part of the contractual requirement to avoid inconvenience to the motorist during the normal working day, A recent one we have installed is on the M42 between junction 9 & 10.
At night (because we are generally a nocturnal bunch) we install systems overnight to allow the main contractor to move plant and equipment onto the road reducing the number of lanes, in this situation a speed limit is necessary to protect both workers and the public. HOWEVER Temporary Traffic Restriction Orders (TTROs) allowing us to implement these speed restrictions are in place 24 HOURS a day, we cannot impose a speed limit at certain times and not at others, the policing and enforcement system does not allow for this situation, the contract either has a speed restriciton or it doesn't, those are the rules we MUST play by.
Meanwhile I fully agree with those of you that have had to crawl through areas where there seems little activity or a few cones on the side of the road, and recommendations made in various documents state that it is not acceptable to impose mandatory speed restrictions where works are confined to hard shoulders or verges. I am sick and tired of contractors imposing limits in these situations.
I do however have some knowledge as to how the temporary speed limit system works, and we as an industry are governed by those rules.
Where works are confined to night works only, then during the day some schemes are "cleared back" to the verge or hard shoulder as part of the contractual requirement to avoid inconvenience to the motorist during the normal working day, A recent one we have installed is on the M42 between junction 9 & 10.
At night (because we are generally a nocturnal bunch) we install systems overnight to allow the main contractor to move plant and equipment onto the road reducing the number of lanes, in this situation a speed limit is necessary to protect both workers and the public. HOWEVER Temporary Traffic Restriction Orders (TTROs) allowing us to implement these speed restrictions are in place 24 HOURS a day, we cannot impose a speed limit at certain times and not at others, the policing and enforcement system does not allow for this situation, the contract either has a speed restriciton or it doesn't, those are the rules we MUST play by.
At least some of the works I'm talking about on the M4 have been on the verges/hard shoulder only, not "moving out into the road at night" types.
It does irritate me the number of people who travel at exactly the same speed in the 50s as the 70s, some even seem to get upset at you changing your speed when entering / leaving roadworks. These are often the same people who have been stuck in the outside lane for miles at 65mph in the 70s, barely overtaking and generally annoying everyone else.
16 March 2006, 11:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Martyn Tonks
HOWEVER Temporary Traffic Restriction Orders (TTROs) allowing us to implement these speed restrictions are in place 24 HOURS a day, we cannot impose a speed limit at certain times and not at others, the policing and enforcement system does not allow for this situation, the contract either has a speed restriciton or it doesn't, those are the rules we MUST play by.
mb
p.s. Actually they do have dynamic speed limits, on both the M25 and the latest mickey-mouse trial on the M42. So there must be a TTRO type thingy to permit quick changes!!!!
17 March 2006, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Martyn Tonks
Where works are confined to night works only, then during the day some schemes are "cleared back" to the verge or hard shoulder as part of the contractual requirement to avoid inconvenience to the motorist during the normal working day, A recent one we have installed is on the M42 between junction 9 & 10.
& any idea when are the works @ 11-12 due to finish?
17 March 2006, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by speye91
traveling down the A19 this morning about 11.30 ish .Iwas going pretty slow due to a heavy snow shower when i spotted a camera van in the layby no marking on it just the 2 black flaps on the back door open was doing about 40 so dont have to worry today.But further down the road was 2 marked volvos sitting in the layby and the same in the next layby. also 1 on the side ov the road with blues on doing nothing at all and 1 in the next layby with an escort pulled over no wonder cleveland has got all the problems if there just sitting on the A19 trying to catch speeding motorists
.But further down the road was 2 marked volvos sitting in the layby and the same in the next layby. also 1 on the side ov the road with blues on doing nothing at all and 1 in the next layby with an escort pulled over no wonder cleveland has got all the problems if there just sitting on the A19 trying to catch speeding motorists Mac
17 March 2006, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by speye91
traveling down the A19 this morning about 11.30 ish .Iwas going pretty slow due to a heavy snow shower when i spotted a camera van in the layby no marking on it just the 2 black flaps on the back door open was doing about 40 so dont have to worry today.But further down the road was 2 marked volvos sitting in the layby and the same in the next layby. also 1 on the side ov the road with blues on doing nothing at all and 1 in the next layby with an escort pulled over no wonder cleveland has got all the problems if there just sitting on the A19 trying to catch speeding motorists
.But further down the road was 2 marked volvos sitting in the layby and the same in the next layby. also 1 on the side ov the road with blues on doing nothing at all and 1 in the next layby with an escort pulled over no wonder cleveland has got all the problems if there just sitting on the A19 trying to catch speeding motorists
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