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Pulled by the Police ... Again!

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Old 24 July 2009, 03:44 PM
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spec-cie
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Default Pulled by the Police ... Again!

Just been stopped by the Police again. The officer took exception to the speed I exited a roundabout at despite the fact that I was well below the speed limit (the roundabout and the road are national speed limit). Traffic was moderately busy and conditions were a little bit wet.

What the officer said to me (best recollection, not a verbatim quote):

"The reason I've stopped you is that the speed you exited the roundabout at was absolutely ridiculous. Are you not aware of how dangerous it is when the road is wet? You must have been going some speed because I had to do 75mph with my lights on just to catch you up."

Me:

"I didn't see you with your lights on or I'd have stopped earlier"

Him:

"Exactly, that just shows how fast you were going."

Me:

"Well, in my opinion, the speed I was doing was absolutely right for the conditions. I may not be as highly trained a driver as you are but I have been driving for 20 years (4 in this car), have had three days of high-performance driver training with an instructor who also teaches the Police APNR Interceptor drivers, as well as a number of other driver training courses. I've been on three skid-pan training sessions in the car I'm driving now and have a pretty good appreciation of how well it handles in the damp and wet. The road ahead of me was clear and visibility was good but even so I took things much steadier than I would in the dry and at no point did I exceed the speed limit.

The fact that you couldn't catch me at 75mph, given I was only doing 55mph in a 60mph zone indicates that you were actually a long way behind me (borne out by the fact I could just about make out your car in my rear-view mirror as I exited the roundabout). Surely, despite your superior training, I am a better judge of what speed I should be doing sat in my car than you are 300 yards behind me.

And if its safe for you, albeit with your superior Police training, to do 75mph in your fairly standard FWD patrol car, surely its not so dangerous for me to be doing 55mph in my AWD car with uprated suspension, brakes, discs and pads? After all, even if we just take the Highway Code stopping distances at face value and make no allowance for the ability of the car or driver, I could have easily stopped within the distance I could see where as you would have been hard pushed."

Well, that's what I wanted to say, but of course what I actually said was:

"Oh, I'm very sorry".

Gave him my name and address and then went on my way.

Am I a coward for not having a go? I get stopped 2 or 3 times a year in the Scoob for various reasons that all seem somewhat spurious and never in either of my other cars. I've been stopped for turning right 200 yards after a junction with a no right turn sign (the officer claimed that the NRT sign covered the whole of the road, total nonsense) and for using excessive acceleration when joining a dual carriageway (short slip road, I decided to use the cars power to fit comfortably into a gap in traffic rather than dawdle out and force the car behind - an unmarked police car as it turned out - to slow down, which is what the IAM teaches drivers to do). I once tried to explain my position, carefully and politely, but the officer went red and started to get angry so I backed off because I didn't want to want to end up getting charged with something I couldn't prove I didn't do.

Or do I just have to swallow my pride, take a bollocking, and wait for the next time? I want *someone* to stand up to the Police and explain that not every Scooby driver is a lunatic with a death wish and the driving skills of a newly-qualified driver ... but not badly enough to volunteer. I make no claim to being a saint who *never* speeds or enjoys the power of the car but I believe I make responsible choices as when to do so and have spent plenty of time and money trying to improve my skills so that I'm never a danger to myself or others. And even if I am guilty of the odd spirited drive on a Sunday morning the fact is that, on this occasion I was well within my limits, the limits of the car and the limits of the law.

Or is it really me? Is the new acceptable standard of driving to never overtake, always do the speed limit -10% (unless there's a bit of water on the ground in which case its the speed limit -30%), to do as the officer tells you even if you think he's in the wrong?

This happen to anyone else?

Views from Police members especially welcome.

Last edited by spec-cie; 24 July 2009 at 04:05 PM.
Old 24 July 2009, 04:19 PM
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doesn't matter if you are in the right or wrong, it's their opinion of your behaviour that counts and 'answering back' is normally a sure fire way to get nicked. sucks but its true.
Old 24 July 2009, 04:25 PM
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Good post, and I agree with you - however its really down to a judgement call on the drivers part as to how receptive the officer in question is - some will have stopped you purely to make you aware that you have attracted their attention, where others are determined to find something worth booking you for. Bear in mind that they are more often than not first on the scene when there is an accident, and they may be a little over-sensitive to the contributing factors as they see them (which I can understand).

Personally given your description of your general driving style, I'm in the same boat and enjoy using the car as and when I feel I can, again reading road ahead etc and driving progressively rather than aggressively etc. however I have been stopped in similar circumstances, and also decided to bite my tongue.

Basically it comes down to being as aware as they are, ensuring that you know what vehicles are in the immediate vicinity, and which of those are likely to be police cars, unmarked or otherwise, and drive accordingly.

There is usually a 1/2 mile zone of a higher standard of driving surrounding a marked patrol car, its the unmarked cars that are the real problem as they can be harder to spot. Also, in your case, this car (I presume it was a marked car?) was some distance away, and this is where us scooby drivers are at a disadvantage... our cars are easier to spot, and they do stand out, both by their appearance and the sound. So, they tend to spot us often before we spot them, ending in a roadside chat sometimes.

I've been stopped a few times, and interestingly it does tend to follow the pattern above... I got stopped a lot in one of my early cars, a Fiat Uno. It was three different colours (black tailgate, blue bonnet and red doors - kinda a work in progress at the time) so attracted a lot of unwanted attention from the plod. Then I changed my car to a mondeo, and although I drove it in the same places in the same manner as the Uno, I wasn't stopped - not even once. Changed to my first 98 UK scoob wagon and found myself getting stopped again... changed to Forester XT, then legacy H6 and wasn't stopped in either of them. Had the V4 STI for a few months now and not been stopped ... yet
Old 24 July 2009, 04:35 PM
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Very nicely written if not a bit long , i've been having the odd little blat on a sunday or of an evening, for years, nothing mad just when conditions allow and out the way. The past 5 years have seen me in a 911, tvr, clio v6 and a few others but to name a few. Not once have i felt paranoid in any of the above cars , I bought my sti a month or so back and have since accumulated 6 points, both from jumped up little men in unmarked hot hatches and like you both where 3-400 yards behind and 3 cars back and both where guessing my speed with a distance motion ( hand held stop watch) device . The fact is on both occasions they got excited about seeing the car, any other vehicle would not have rised an eyebrow.
Old 24 July 2009, 04:45 PM
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The funniest thing envolving a police check was when my father inlaw was sat out side a house waiting to pick up his daughter and a copper came up to him and asked him quite rudely what he was doing etc,so he put up his window and drove off!
The copper then came after him lights blazing and pulled him over and asked what he thought he was doing and he replied that he d done nothing wrong and so wasn t going to be spoke to like a c**t by anyone
To which the copper actualy apologised and left him to his business
I always take the "i m very sorry officer"aproach
Old 24 July 2009, 04:59 PM
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I was stopped once for having a small front plate on a Subaru I had. They kept me in the back of the traffic car for about 20 mins lecturing me and finally told me to get it changed within a week or so(can't remember now) and send away a slip signed by an MOT tester.

I just agreed with everything they had to say. So that 20 mins could have been a lot longer if I had argued, because we all know it's not just about the law: we have their egos to take into the equation too.
Old 24 July 2009, 05:04 PM
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Most of the bad coppers were bullied at schools and have a grudge against the world now they have a little bit of power in my opinion.
Granted though there are still a few top quality coppers out there.
Old 24 July 2009, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by spec-cie
Just been stopped by the Police again. The officer took exception to the speed I exited a roundabout at despite the fact that I was well below the speed limit (the roundabout and the road are national speed limit). Traffic was moderately busy and conditions were a little bit wet.

What the officer said to me (best recollection, not a verbatim quote):

"The reason I've stopped you is that the speed you exited the roundabout at was absolutely ridiculous. Are you not aware of how dangerous it is when the road is wet? You must have been going some speed because I had to do 75mph with my lights on just to catch you up."

Me:

"I didn't see you with your lights on or I'd have stopped earlier"

Him:

"Exactly, that just shows how fast you were going."

Me:

"Well, in my opinion, the speed I was doing was absolutely right for the conditions. I may not be as highly trained a driver as you are but I have been driving for 20 years (4 in this car), have had three days of high-performance driver training with an instructor who also teaches the Police APNR Interceptor drivers, as well as a number of other driver training courses. I've been on three skid-pan training sessions in the car I'm driving now and have a pretty good appreciation of how well it handles in the damp and wet. The road ahead of me was clear and visibility was good but even so I took things much steadier than I would in the dry and at no point did I exceed the speed limit.

The fact that you couldn't catch me at 75mph, given I was only doing 55mph in a 60mph zone indicates that you were actually a long way behind me (borne out by the fact I could just about make out your car in my rear-view mirror as I exited the roundabout). Surely, despite your superior training, I am a better judge of what speed I should be doing sat in my car than you are 300 yards behind me.

And if its safe for you, albeit with your superior Police training, to do 75mph in your fairly standard FWD patrol car, surely its not so dangerous for me to be doing 55mph in my AWD car with uprated suspension, brakes, discs and pads? After all, even if we just take the Highway Code stopping distances at face value and make no allowance for the ability of the car or driver, I could have easily stopped within the distance I could see where as you would have been hard pushed."

Well, that's what I wanted to say, but of course what I actually said was:

"Oh, I'm very sorry".

Gave him my name and address and then went on my way.

Am I a coward for not having a go? I get stopped 2 or 3 times a year in the Scoob for various reasons that all seem somewhat spurious and never in either of my other cars. I've been stopped for turning right 200 yards after a junction with a no right turn sign (the officer claimed that the NRT sign covered the whole of the road, total nonsense) and for using excessive acceleration when joining a dual carriageway (short slip road, I decided to use the cars power to fit comfortably into a gap in traffic rather than dawdle out and force the car behind - an unmarked police car as it turned out - to slow down, which is what the IAM teaches drivers to do). I once tried to explain my position, carefully and politely, but the officer went red and started to get angry so I backed off because I didn't want to want to end up getting charged with something I couldn't prove I didn't do.

Or do I just have to swallow my pride, take a bollocking, and wait for the next time? I want *someone* to stand up to the Police and explain that not every Scooby driver is a lunatic with a death wish and the driving skills of a newly-qualified driver ... but not badly enough to volunteer. I make no claim to being a saint who *never* speeds or enjoys the power of the car but I believe I make responsible choices as when to do so and have spent plenty of time and money trying to improve my skills so that I'm never a danger to myself or others. And even if I am guilty of the odd spirited drive on a Sunday morning the fact is that, on this occasion I was well within my limits, the limits of the car and the limits of the law.

Or is it really me? Is the new acceptable standard of driving to never overtake, always do the speed limit -10% (unless there's a bit of water on the ground in which case its the speed limit -30%), to do as the officer tells you even if you think he's in the wrong?

This happen to anyone else?

Views from Police members especially welcome.
Typical copper, he just plucked a figure from thin air, i would have told him to GTFO, the problem is *** heads like that will always be believed just cos they are a copper, their "opinion", no matter how daft will always carry mre weight than yours.


And he got pissed of when you displayed superior driving knowledge, the force is full of complete ***** like this who have no idea about driving a performance car cos daddy bought them a brand new corsa 1.2 sxi when they passed their test, but they think they can judge everything from speed to (in their opinion) dangerous overtakes.


The worst thing is he can give you points when he clearly knows **** all about performance cars or how to drive them!



POlice are beoming more hated by the day cos of demmicks like this one!
Old 24 July 2009, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mak24seven
Very nicely written if not a bit long , i've been having the odd little blat on a sunday or of an evening, for years, nothing mad just when conditions allow and out the way. The past 5 years have seen me in a 911, tvr, clio v6 and a few others but to name a few. Not once have i felt paranoid in any of the above cars , I bought my sti a month or so back and have since accumulated 6 points, both from jumped up little men in unmarked hot hatches and like you both where 3-400 yards behind and 3 cars back and both where guessing my speed with a distance motion ( hand held stop watch) device . The fact is on both occasions they got excited about seeing the car, any other vehicle would not have rised an eyebrow.
Shouldnt be allowed, how these **** can give you points is beyond me!
Old 24 July 2009, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by GlesgaKiss
I was stopped once for having a small front plate on a Subaru I had. They kept me in the back of the traffic car for about 20 mins lecturing me and finally told me to get it changed within a week or so(can't remember now) and send away a slip signed by an MOT tester.

I just agreed with everything they had to say. So that 20 mins could have been a lot longer if I had argued, because we all know it's not just about the law: we have their egos to take into the equation too.
**** that, i would have told them to give me the warning and im out of there asap,. they have NO right to sit there and lecture you for 20 mins!
Old 24 July 2009, 05:17 PM
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most coppers are ok, but you also get the opposite end of the spectrum, and somehow, a total w4nker of a bloke managed to get a job in the police force, and his w4nkerness is carried on in his job, unfortunately, being a w4nker, he will spend his day, giving the police a bad name, the public hate them, their colleagues hate them, their parents hate them, but they are there, and we will meet one or two of them........the best way to look at it is say the obligatory yes sir no sir, listen to the lecture, and drive away knowing that you never ever have to be that person
Old 24 July 2009, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by GC8WRX
**** that, i would have told them to give me the warning and im out of there asap,. they have NO right to sit there and lecture you for 20 mins!
I was 20 at the time mate, that makes me a criminal.
Old 24 July 2009, 05:32 PM
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you should have offered him a race down the road, if you win a 1/4 mile drag you get to go, if he wins you accept the penalty.... lol
Old 24 July 2009, 05:38 PM
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Got stopped hammering it from a standstill down and empty section of dual carriageway, one awficer in a std patrol car so he could do nothing (not sure I was doing much more than 60mph - it was just the time I took to get there!).

Anyhoo, I was apologetic and after a few choice words and he let me on my way.

Was also stopped for having front fog lights on at night when it wasn't foggy. One of my headlamp bulbs had gone a few days earlier and I hadn't got around to replacing itso I wanted to avaoid the "motorbike" look. Thought that might be an occasion where they might usie their dixcretion, but no, modern target meant I got a fine. Wanted to moan about it, but knew my tax had run out the week before, so kept quiet!!

Last edited by andythejock01wrx; 24 July 2009 at 05:40 PM.
Old 24 July 2009, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by gallois
most coppers are ok
I used to agree with you, but every time this happens I'm a little less sure. Maybe its just the patrollers round where I live but then they're the only Police I ever have to deal with so they're the ones that form my view.

And its not that I particularly mind being stopped if its to check that I really own the car, that its roadworthy, and so on ... its the lecturing me like I'm the thick kid in the class who can't walk two yards without tripping over his own shoelaces that I object to.

A friend who owns an Aston Martin has been stopped twice when she admits she was speeding 'quite a bit'. On both occasions she apologized and said sometimes she gets a bit carried away given the sort of car it is and on both occasions she got let off!
Old 24 July 2009, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by spec-cie
I used to agree with you, but every time this happens I'm a little less sure. Maybe its just the patrollers round where I live but then they're the only Police I ever have to deal with so they're the ones that form my view.

And its not that I particularly mind being stopped if its to check that I really own the car, that its roadworthy, and so on ... its the lecturing me like I'm the thick kid in the class who can't walk two yards without tripping over his own shoelaces that I object to.

A friend who owns an Aston Martin has been stopped twice when she admits she was speeding 'quite a bit'. On both occasions she apologized and said sometimes she gets a bit carried away given the sort of car it is and on both occasions she got let off!


MILF?


i bet she had cleavage showing, and apart from themselves, thats the closest most coppers will get to a decent pair of ****!
Old 24 July 2009, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by GC8WRX
MILF?


i bet she had cleavage showing, and apart from themselves, thats the closest most coppers will get to a decent pair of ****!
Er, no. She's a nice girl but I wouldn't touch her even with your barge pole!
Old 24 July 2009, 06:08 PM
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i got stopped one night coming home from chippy up carraigeway off lights burried it on a slightly wet road and got to bottom of carraigeway stopped at a red light looked and there was blue lights behind me he then caught up and he got out and asked me if i was going to stop i said yes he then told me to pull into a street then said taht speed you where doing ther was unbelieavable i was doing 120 to catch you i did not say anything back he took me to court for doing 68 in a 30 and aprox 118 on a 70 and i got away with it because he didnt have any evidence of these readings and il not say what exact speed i was doing on here but it wasnt 118.lol :P

Last edited by uk300scoob; 24 July 2009 at 06:09 PM.
Old 24 July 2009, 06:29 PM
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you have to bend over and take it better to keep you licence then not
Old 24 July 2009, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by spec-cie
Er, no. She's a nice girl but I wouldn't touch her even with your barge pole!

I dunno, depends how pissed i am and how dirty i perceive her to be!



Old 24 July 2009, 07:00 PM
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i pulled over by a female copper who was doing speed checks(handheld) with a male colleague who hand the device(pointed down on the ground) for ""doing more than 30"" i said i wasnt and her excuss was she was a PROfessional and can tell the speed just by looking!! she should be a super hero then!!lol

she just said slow down and let me go! she didnt notice that the works van hadnt got the new tax disc in it!!

steve
Old 24 July 2009, 07:47 PM
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If im doing something wrong cause ive been driving for 20 years and have only been stopped twice. Once in wales cause he said I crossed zigzigs on a crossing I didnt but he never took it any further than a finger wagging, and once in the early hrs cause I was driving a car that had a sticker in the rear window saying 'stop this car if being driven in the early hrs, it could be stolen' part of the local crime stoppers blurp.
My point being that if you think you saw him in your rear view be it in the distance why drive this way.
By the way never been stopped in the scooby and yes I do like to put my foot down when conditions dictate
Old 24 July 2009, 07:54 PM
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not all coppers are ***** though.
i got flagged down for giving it a few beans through a high street late at night. only in 1st / 2nd gear, so more noise than speed.

copper (traffic plain clothed with ID round his neck) came to my window, said its not a race track round here. i apologised and he said. you dont want to mess up your lovely car do you, and then said there are a lot of unmarked cars about tonight in the area and to take it easy.

- i pulled off as slowly and as quietly as i could....

thought i was going to get the riot act to be honest. just goes to show.

ps: he didnt mention my number plate or door numbers either !!!

Last edited by WRX_Dazza; 24 July 2009 at 07:55 PM.
Old 24 July 2009, 08:07 PM
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A few years ago when I first got the Scoob I was coming back from my 1000 mile service, I took a wrong turn so I came off at the next exit and went to double back round the roundabout when this silver Skoda Octavia cut me up on the roundabout by pulling right out infront of me without even looking. Then when I was heading up the slip road (which was two lanes) the same car just pulled out and cut me up again!!
I thought to myself sod this and when we got off the sliproad onto the dual carriageway I nailed it to over take him as he was still doing about 50mph in the 70 zone, when I was just about to pass him admitidly doing 80mph he straddled both lanes and slammed his brakes on before putting on his lights so I pulled in behind him and followed him along the road.
He then proceeded to pull me in at the side of the dual carriageway about 5 or 600m short of a layby causing all sorts of havock behind us.
I could see when he got out the car he was raging, I put down my passenger window to hear him shouting and I quote " You F8cking Ar*hole", he stormed over to the car and trew the door open and shouted "Next time I will have your f8cking licence off you". He then slamed my door shut as hard as he could and stormed off to his car without letting me say anything.

When I got home I went into the local police station and made an unoficial complaint about the officer. When I was sitting in the Chief Insepectors office he phoned Ayr police and whoever he spoke to informed him that he knew the officer and couldnt believe that he would behave in such a manner. I reminded the Inspector that I was making an unoficial complaint and all I wanted was his superior to have a word in his shell to let him know that his behavior was totaly out of order.
Later on that day I got a phone call with an appology, and luckly enough I have not been stopped since

Graeme
Old 24 July 2009, 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by G.Mac
A few years ago when I first got the Scoob I was coming back from my 1000 mile service, I took a wrong turn so I came off at the next exit and went to double back round the roundabout when this silver Skoda Octavia cut me up on the roundabout by pulling right out infront of me without even looking. Then when I was heading up the slip road (which was two lanes) the same car just pulled out and cut me up again!!
I thought to myself sod this and when we got off the sliproad onto the dual carriageway I nailed it to over take him as he was still doing about 50mph in the 70 zone, when I was just about to pass him admitidly doing 80mph he straddled both lanes and slammed his brakes on before putting on his lights so I pulled in behind him and followed him along the road.
He then proceeded to pull me in at the side of the dual carriageway about 5 or 600m short of a layby causing all sorts of havock behind us.
I could see when he got out the car he was raging, I put down my passenger window to hear him shouting and I quote " You F8cking Ar*hole", he stormed over to the car and trew the door open and shouted "Next time I will have your f8cking licence off you". He then slamed my door shut as hard as he could and stormed off to his car without letting me say anything.

When I got home I went into the local police station and made an unoficial complaint about the officer. When I was sitting in the Chief Insepectors office he phoned Ayr police and whoever he spoke to informed him that he knew the officer and couldnt believe that he would behave in such a manner. I reminded the Inspector that I was making an unoficial complaint and all I wanted was his superior to have a word in his shell to let him know that his behavior was totaly out of order.
Later on that day I got a phone call with an appology, and luckly enough I have not been stopped since

Graeme
More ned than pplod!

How do I get the saltire avitar btw?
Old 24 July 2009, 10:34 PM
  #26  
spec-cie
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Originally Posted by scousefly
My point being that if you think you saw him in your rear view be it in the distance why drive this way.
What do you mean by 'in this way' ... driving like I normally drive? Yes, I saw a car in my rearview mirror but I didn't clock it as a police car. But what difference would it have made if I had? As I said I was driving well within my limits, the car's limits and the limits of the law ... so what's the problem?

I'm glad you've had no problems with the Police but your post seems to imply that anyone whose been pulled must be guilty of something. My experience is quite different.
Old 24 July 2009, 10:57 PM
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Moley
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I got pulled this evening, doing 45mph in a 30mph limit

Couldn't fault the police officer at all.

He could have given me 3 points and been an **** about it, but was really down to earth and let me go with a friendly warning.

There are good ones out there
Old 24 July 2009, 11:07 PM
  #28  
dunx
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The ones I talk to are quite decent people, the one's I went to school with were/are kn*bheads....

My local CSPO (?) said "Nice car !" last time we met !

LOL

dunx

P.S. Moley does he get insurance from you ? LOL
Old 25 July 2009, 08:03 PM
  #29  
scousefly
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Originally Posted by spec-cie
What do you mean by 'in this way' ... driving like I normally drive? Yes, I saw a car in my rearview mirror but I didn't clock it as a police car. But what difference would it have made if I had? As I said I was driving well within my limits, the car's limits and the limits of the law ... so what's the problem?

I'm glad you've had no problems with the Police but your post seems to imply that anyone whose been pulled must be guilty of something. My experience is quite different.

In a way he deemed unacceptable you stated you saw him in your rear view but in this comment you didn't clock him as plod? Which one was it?
Old 27 July 2009, 08:06 AM
  #30  
spec-cie
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Originally Posted by scousefly
In a way he deemed unacceptable you stated you saw him in your rear view but in this comment you didn't clock him as plod? Which one was it?
I saw a car in my rear view mirror that, when he later caught me up and pulled me over turned out to be a police car. It was marked but so far away I couldn't initially see that in the quick glance I took.

But that's beside the point. How am I supposed to know what he deems acceptable if I'm driving well within the conditions and the law? If its not acceptable to drive like that, what is?

You don't work for the local constabulary do you?


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