Fuel surge problem
08 June 2003, 12:07 PM
#1
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Whilst out on a run yesterday, I went round a fairly high G corner with about a 1/4 of a tank (it was a right hander, going uphill). As I came out of the corner on full throttle in 2nd I got a completely loss of power for a second. I presume this was fuel surge. As I am about to shell out on a new pump and regulator I'm wondering if I should consider a surge tank now instead of later. What are my options and does anyone have any piccies? Also, will this sort of incident cause engine damage?
Cheers all,
Pete.
Cheers all,
Pete.
08 June 2003, 08:25 PM
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No more ideas on this????
I'm thinking of the standard pump feeding a 1/2 litre tank in the engine bay, and a higher pressure pump feeding the rail. Does anyone have a similar set up?
I'm thinking of the standard pump feeding a 1/2 litre tank in the engine bay, and a higher pressure pump feeding the rail. Does anyone have a similar set up?
08 June 2003, 09:16 PM
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MS
http://www.powerstation.org.uk
go to "our products"...bottom of the page.
Experimented with this setup......no surge through the chicane at Dono with tank showing below empty.
brilliant mod which includes uprated fuel pump.
http://www.powerstation.org.uk
go to "our products"...bottom of the page.
Experimented with this setup......no surge through the chicane at Dono with tank showing below empty.
brilliant mod which includes uprated fuel pump.
09 June 2003, 08:25 AM
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Thanks Doc Joc.
I had seen this. Looks the part and seems to be functional too but it seems a little steep. I fancy making something similar myself but I need some more details.
Cheers.
I had seen this. Looks the part and seems to be functional too but it seems a little steep. I fancy making something similar myself but I need some more details.
Cheers.
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09 June 2003, 03:06 PM
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Come on you lot! With all the track day fans on here, some of you must have attended to this problem??????
10 June 2003, 01:59 PM
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I got major fuel surge (i.e engine stalled for 2s) halfway round a long sweeping hard corner when travelling at 80mph with very little spare grip to play with. The sudden deceleration brought about a wieght-shift forward (like lift off) causing a 270 degree spin and thankfully no damage to me or the car 
This was bitterly disputed on SN at the time and the occasional dig still kicks around. My car still suffers very bad fuel surge at up to 1/2 a tank when making reasonably quick progress. It would be a waste of time on the track!! I'd have to get some sort of swirl pot!
This was bitterly disputed on SN at the time and the occasional dig still kicks around. My car still suffers very bad fuel surge at up to 1/2 a tank when making reasonably quick progress. It would be a waste of time on the track!! I'd have to get some sort of swirl pot!
10 June 2003, 02:42 PM
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Well I believe you Saxo Boy. Luckily, I had come out of the corner but was bolted to the floor in second. It did not feel healthy! I'm going to make something to sort it but I've got a list of things that need doing as long as my arm so for now, i'll just have to keep her above half full.
OH! By the way, FAO Christian R. Saw the car in Banzai. Very nice. Do you fancy telling me where the carbon scoop is from so i can get one? How much? PRETTY PLEASE!!
OH! By the way, FAO Christian R. Saw the car in Banzai. Very nice. Do you fancy telling me where the carbon scoop is from so i can get one? How much? PRETTY PLEASE!!
10 June 2003, 04:24 PM
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I had come out of the corner but was bolted to the floor in second
90% of the time I get fuel surge its on the straight after the corner but this particular corner is long and continiously sweeping so it happened mid-way round it 
11 June 2003, 05:45 AM
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Mad, I will take a picture later of my swirl pot. It is installed on the pass. side suspension mount, next to the fuel filter.
Worked out that there is enough fuel for 45 seconds supply. Thats one bloody long corner.
Dan
Worked out that there is enough fuel for 45 seconds supply. Thats one bloody long corner.
Dan
12 June 2003, 05:29 PM
#24
1)When fitting the uprated fuel pump swap the filter over from the original pump if it is bigger than that on the new pump.
2)The pump sits in a craddle in the fuel tank which is a pressed piece of metal pointing down at an angle into the tank. Grb a hold of this and bend it to almost vertical so that the pump reaches down almost to the bottom of the tank.
It may sound crude but it works.
I could get surge from 3/8 tank down but now it does not happen until just before the fuel light comes on which means I have 20mls to find an Optimax station. Previously the car would go over 40mls from the time the fuel light came on.I found this out to my cost after I carried out the mod.
2)The pump sits in a craddle in the fuel tank which is a pressed piece of metal pointing down at an angle into the tank. Grb a hold of this and bend it to almost vertical so that the pump reaches down almost to the bottom of the tank.
It may sound crude but it works.
I could get surge from 3/8 tank down but now it does not happen until just before the fuel light comes on which means I have 20mls to find an Optimax station. Previously the car would go over 40mls from the time the fuel light came on.I found this out to my cost after I carried out the mod.
06 September 2003, 08:50 PM
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Here is how i solved the problem:
The hose to the right is return to the fueltank.
There is a sligt reduction in the outlet hole on this, to make the surgetank a little bit pressurised.
The one in the middle comes from the fpr.
The left is IN from the oe pump in the fuel tank.
And in the bottom there is hose to the new BIG bosch pump.
from the bosch pump the fuel then goes to the oe filter ant on to the injectors...
Cheers
/Ola
[Edited by bdolgu - 6/9/2003 8:52:01 PM]
The hose to the right is return to the fueltank.
There is a sligt reduction in the outlet hole on this, to make the surgetank a little bit pressurised.
The one in the middle comes from the fpr.
The left is IN from the oe pump in the fuel tank.
And in the bottom there is hose to the new BIG bosch pump.
from the bosch pump the fuel then goes to the oe filter ant on to the injectors...
Cheers
/Ola
[Edited by bdolgu - 6/9/2003 8:52:01 PM]
28 October 2003, 10:35 AM
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Just decided to ressurect this as I never sorted the problem. Last week at Curborough, when booting it out of the hairpin down the finish straight I noticed my Knock link going to 2 ambers. I never felt the effect of lack of fuel but I could deffinately see it. I put this down to running 4 bar pressure until I saw some of the guys with me get the "cutting out" from fuel surge too.
Its obviously detting from running lean....not good......still need to sort it.
Its obviously detting from running lean....not good......still need to sort it.
28 October 2003, 11:23 AM
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I had a very similar problem a few weeks ago in my RB5. Going through a sharp left right left fairly quickly on between half and quarter tank - engine cut stone cold in the middle of the second left. This had the same effect as a really dramatic lift-off oversteer moment! I caught the slide in one direction, then the engine refired and pulled me in the other... Needless to say this shook me up a bit (not to mention my passenger!!).
That was the second time I experienced fuel surge, so I bit the bullet and had the Powerstation swirl pot fitted last Friday (amongst other bits and bobs ;-)). From what I can tell, the problem has absolutely gone away. I repeated the same sequence of corners on quarter tank (if anything slightly quicker than the first time) after having the swirl pot fitted, and there was not a hint of fuel surge.
Yes it was expensive, but the thought of the engine running lean and the potential for unexpected lift-off oversteer scenarios means in my mind it was money worth spent!! Plus you get an uprated fuel pump too, so it can't be bad...
That was the second time I experienced fuel surge, so I bit the bullet and had the Powerstation swirl pot fitted last Friday (amongst other bits and bobs ;-)). From what I can tell, the problem has absolutely gone away. I repeated the same sequence of corners on quarter tank (if anything slightly quicker than the first time) after having the swirl pot fitted, and there was not a hint of fuel surge.
Yes it was expensive, but the thought of the engine running lean and the potential for unexpected lift-off oversteer scenarios means in my mind it was money worth spent!! Plus you get an uprated fuel pump too, so it can't be bad...
23 December 2003, 10:50 AM
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Christian,
How much was the mod?
It pisses me off that I get this now and again, it is a design flaw that should have been considered, especially if it can damage the engine. I can imagine the confused looks at a Subaru garage when you turn up with a blown engine and tell them that you know it was your own fault as you shouldn't have cornered so fast!!!
J.
How much was the mod?
It pisses me off that I get this now and again, it is a design flaw that should have been considered, especially if it can damage the engine. I can imagine the confused looks at a Subaru garage when you turn up with a blown engine and tell them that you know it was your own fault as you shouldn't have cornered so fast!!!
J.
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