Scooby-kid

I would just like to pick the brains of anyone in the IT industry at the moment, please .

So here’s the situation. I am 17, with one year left at 6th form and I want to get into IT as a career. This week is a higher education week at 6th form, so at the moment I am in the process of looking through league tables of universities to see which ones I could realistically get into etc etc.

Tomorrow I will get to speak to representatives from some of the UK universities, but one thing is confusing me at the moment:

Whilst looking on line, one thing which is bugging me is the reference to "computer science" which is described as....

"Design, exploitation and technology surrounding computing - includes computer sciences, information systems, software engineering, artificial intelligence"

.....which sound to me like designing software and hardware and developing new technologies and the like, but what I want to do is something along the lines of designing and installing large networks, fixing them when something goes wrong etc, mostly hardware, as opposed to “network administrator” (mainly I'm interested in looking after the whole system, and fixing pc's and other components when they go wrong)

The way I sort of imagine it is that a big company phones up and says we need a computer system in our such and such building, and then someone goes in and says "o yes, you need a server here and here, you will need X numbers of switches, XYZ internet connection, etc etc" and then someone (me?) goes about installing and maintaining the whole lot after its done.

My question is, how would you describe this type of work?

I have a friend of a friend who is an "IT Consultant" and looks after the computer system at one of Punch Taverns main office buildings. So does this mean I want to be an “IT Consultant”, or are there other job titles/roles/names? Technician maybe?

I would appreciate any advice anyone could give, especially from anyone who has recently (5-10 years) gained a degree and tried to find work in the industry, and how they found it.

Thanks for reading through all that lot ^^^
Scott.

LostUser

Although it's been 10 years since I looked at uni courses, computer science is pretty much what they call the bog standard IT degree. I don't remember seeing it called anything else. I have a few friends that did computer science degrees and it seemed to include programming in some bizaare languages, database design and other odd subjects.

I think it's generally agreed that the content of the course isn't particularly useful but you have that all important degree when you've finished.

The job you describe could be classed as an IT consultant but it's unlikely you'd walk straight in to that job. You'd probably start as network technician for example doing the grunt work of the installation and eventually build up to designing and spec'ing the installation.

I was in your position 10 years ago. I decided I couldn't face 3 years at uni so went straight in to a basic IT support job (120 user site). Within a year I moved up to Systems administrator so I was responsible for all the servers and the clients. A year later I moved to an IT analyst role for a huge company. I'm still here 8 years later. I'm responsible for the IT infrastructure here at the headquarters but also work heavily with our sites in other countries.

Although things have worked out reasonably well for me it's been mostly luck and hard work. My friends that did degrees walked straight in to jobs and quickly earned the same as me.

I should think that anyone coming out of uni right now is finding it bloody hard to find a job. In 3 years time that might all be different.

mike1210

I was 23 when I got a job an IT, my degree was Electronics and I couldn't get work in that role when I left Uni so I worked for my local council in IT doing PC builds, support etc. I loved it but the pay wasn't great. 8 Months later a Uni close to me was advertising for IT roles offering double the money for a similar type job and I luckily got the job. Since then I've been promoted to a 3rd line role (back end stuff, servers etc).

Looking back though, I kinda wish I hadn't bothered with Uni and tried to get a job in IT at 18. If you work for a decent company they would train you up and may put you on day release to a HND etc anyways, or even better Microsoft certs, CCNA etc.

I found as well people who didnt go to Uni and worked in IT from a young age knew their stuff far more than I did and I was playing catch up. Now, I didn't really know what I wanted to be until I was 23 and don't get me wrong I really enjoyed Uni but IMHO degress in IT are not not the be all and end all, especially when you consider If I worked for my local council at 18, got a CCNA and 4 years experience I would be far more employable than a University leaver at 22 years of age.

For programming and the like it may be different, so just my 2 peneth worth-eth. I had a great time in Uni but IMO there no substitute for experience in IT

LostUser

Fully agree that you'll have a great time at uni. Most people meet lifelong friends there and spend 3 years partying etc. I have to admit to feeling slightly jealous whenever I went to visit.

But I agree with Mike that 3 years hands-on IT experience is far more valuable.

I actually started doing 1 day a week HND course when I first started in IT but only managed 8 weeks before I quit the course. It was so basic I was just spending the whole day very bored. I preferred to work 5 days a week rather than 4 days plus the day at college.

I found it more productive to read books. Back then it was Windows NT, networking, Linux, Office, ASP, VB. I must have read 30 or 40 books to gain a broad understanding.

Since then I've gained several IT qualifications CNA, CLP, MCSA but don't take them particularly seriously.

ChefDude

i've worked in IT for 20 years now and, if I was to do it all over again, I would stay in school lol

Do your Bsc Computer science, then get more specialized with a masters. Me? I'd carry on and do a Phd too.

All my friends who are doing well stayed in education and got *really* specialized. They've all been rewarded with leading edge tech jobs that they really enjoy and get paid for too

I'm a good earner, don't get me wrong, but with most of those 20 years on a six figure salary, i'm still very much a worker and I enjoy my job probably 60% of the time.

Keep your options and don't commit to real work too early. this 'university of life' stuff is rubbish.

aceM

If you good with fixing computers, changing hardware, video cards, memory and stuff like that. You may think of taking CompTIA A+ and CompTIA N+ certification for a prerequisite then take Cisco CCNA then proceed from there. One advice would be whether you’re just starting your IT career or figuring out the next direction yours should take, it’s important to get a read on or IT training on where the industry is headed so you’ll know which skills and certifications are good and which ones aren’t worth your time.

James Neill

iTrader: (1)

Scooby-kid

You're talking about what might be many roles.

At one end of the scale, you may work for a small organisation and your job is to keep the "lights on". Ensure people have access to IT (laptops and connectivity) and that it works (a performing network, backup services, central storage, etc). In which case your role might be best described as one of the following
- IT Admin/Support
- Network Support
- IT Manager

Chances are that your job is characterised by dealing with users day to day and understanding what products (hardware and software) you should buy/rent to give the users and you what you need. A large part of your time will be administering things (ie, solving problems, making sure everything working smoothly)

At the other end of the scale is more enterprise level stuff where you might be part of a larger team. In this case, you're role might be
- Infrastructure architect
- IT Operations Manager

Chances are you're job is characterised by trying to give a client a competitive advantage through innovation. For example. Very high availability or fault tolerance. You might spend more time managing teams, agreeing investment decisions or tracking new technology.

In both cases though, you normally find the role you talk about is split in to two in all bit the smallest organisations. Design vs. Operations. The former is more about being an architect. The latter is more about managing and problem solving (eg, running ITIL processes) as an IT Operations Manager.

Geezer

I left school at 18 and sort of fell into IT at a very base level (just happened to be an opening, I had no real interest in IT, but it was money!).

24 years later, I would say that the experience you will gain from going in at a low level will far outwiegh what youwill learn about in a Uni.

The training that an organisation will give you will be far more useful as it will per pertinent to the role you do, not a generalisation like a computer science degree would be (I'm not knocking them per se, but it's not possible to give people the in depth knowledge you need for specific networks etc.).

Experience is what employers want, not qualifications. I have been involved in selection of staff, and I always went for people who looked as if they could do the job, regardless of their qualifications.

If you are going to be a programmer, then a degree will stand you in good stead, but for real IT you need hands on and relevant, professional training.

All IMHO, of course.....

Geezer

hodgy0_2

unless you intend to get into the very technical stuff, i.e. writing software, designing software/PCB's etc I would not be too worried about it

The important thing is to get a university education, I am an IT consultant (with a History Degree) and the skill I use, day in day out, is the ability to write in clear understandable English.

(obviously the ability to understand the difference between a routed protocol and a routing protocol is a given)



PS - by the looks of it you want to become a Network/Systems Engineer

NotoriousREV

Have to agree with Nat. I've been in IT for 12 years and am currently a senior IT manager for a FTSE250 company. Challenging? Yes. Exciting? Not often. Stressful? Absolutely. Well paid? It can be but it's not a given.

Maybe I'm just jaded?

I don't have a degree, by the way, I just tooks jobs that allowed me to expand my experience whenever they came along so I did desktop support, networking, server support, active directory design, ITIL, PRINCE2 etc. although I'm not actually qualified in anything other than ITIL, lol.

Scooby-kid

thanks for the replies everyone.

the course that seems to be at the top of the list at the moment is:

"computer networking and security + CCNA + CCNP"

That sounds like the sort of thing i want to do

I just need to find some more in depth information about it.

once again, thanks for the advice,
Scott.

KiwiGTI

And to add a bit of negativity you are aiming squarely at the crap end of IT. The part with the most competition, politics, cowboys, chancers and thickos that have drifted into IT as a career.

hodgy0_2

on average a person with a degree will always outstrip the earnings of someone without a degree

its a simple fact - in the same way that in any given year the vast majority of professional footballers are born between September and December

hodgy0_2

Nat -- thats the whole point, if you want to move away from the grunt work of server support/network support into a more consultancy role with less hands on -- but much better paid

you will always do better with a degree -- i,m not saying its right or that a guy with 15 years hands on coal face experience but no degree is not capable -- its just he will find a glass ceiling to his earning potential -- not impossible to jump the gap -- but much much harder

and yes its true about footballers -- think about it, always the oldest in the school year, so bigger pyhsically, picked more often for the team etc etc

I think its true of all sports