New UK Subaru Sti - Due April/May
16 May 2014, 03:39 PM
#871
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Chris, the way forward is not to look backwards, but if you keep putting backwards kit in your cars then you wont go forwards.
Here is an example, my new Pug RCZ R, did a 500 mile trip, heavy traffic motorway, town, A road, averaged 40mpg without trying, that has 270ps.
Extra urban is quoted at 55mpg.... if i tried i would get near that, in a performance car!
Its also euro 6 compliant, has £143.50 a year road tax, pretty cheap to insure, cheap to run considering, handles and goes like a dream and i can get my hairdressing kit in the boot no problems
This is what subaru are up against, and they need to do much better in the developement of their engines to even get close, that is one BIG point that people are looking at now, performance AND economy all in the same package (who wants £400+ per annum road tax?).
You also want a reliable network for spare parts, thats not happening at the moment, I.M. is run on a shoe string, dealers need better training, its after care as well as selling the product.
The product needs to get better, its stuck in a rut from 1997 performance wise, interiors have improved but they are still Dacia standard and not up market, that needs to change when you go up against BMW, VW and Audi.
It needs to change, you cannot go up against cars that do 15+mpg to the gallon more with the same power, provide better dealer networks, have decent warranties and low road tax, DIT is the way forward for Subaru, the BRZ was a step in the right direction but Toyota sell more.....
Here is an example, my new Pug RCZ R, did a 500 mile trip, heavy traffic motorway, town, A road, averaged 40mpg without trying, that has 270ps.
Extra urban is quoted at 55mpg.... if i tried i would get near that, in a performance car!
Its also euro 6 compliant, has £143.50 a year road tax, pretty cheap to insure, cheap to run considering, handles and goes like a dream and i can get my hairdressing kit in the boot no problems
This is what subaru are up against, and they need to do much better in the developement of their engines to even get close, that is one BIG point that people are looking at now, performance AND economy all in the same package (who wants £400+ per annum road tax?).
You also want a reliable network for spare parts, thats not happening at the moment, I.M. is run on a shoe string, dealers need better training, its after care as well as selling the product.
The product needs to get better, its stuck in a rut from 1997 performance wise, interiors have improved but they are still Dacia standard and not up market, that needs to change when you go up against BMW, VW and Audi.
It needs to change, you cannot go up against cars that do 15+mpg to the gallon more with the same power, provide better dealer networks, have decent warranties and low road tax, DIT is the way forward for Subaru, the BRZ was a step in the right direction but Toyota sell more.....
16 May 2014, 03:41 PM
#872
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One of the top tuners has just taken delivery of one today, going to see it tomorrow. So all the myths will soon be broken about the engine. Running in and then bench marking has already started. Watch this space for upgrades but think the plan is to forge it.
16 May 2014, 03:46 PM
#873
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Chris, the way forward is not to look backwards, but if you keep putting backwards kit in your cars then you wont go forwards.
Here is an example, my new Pug RCZ R, did a 500 mile trip, heavy traffic motorway, town, A road, averaged 40mpg without trying, that has 270ps.
Extra urban is quoted at 55mpg.... if i tried i would get near that, in a performance car!
Its also euro 6 compliant, has £143.50 a year road tax, pretty cheap to insure, cheap to run considering, handles and goes like a dream and i can get my hairdressing kit in the boot no problems
This is what subaru are up against, and they need to do much better in the developement of their engines to even get close, that is one BIG point that people are looking at now, performance AND economy all in the same package (who wants £400+ per annum road tax?).
You also want a reliable network for spare parts, thats not happening at the moment, I.M. is run on a shoe string, dealers need better training, its after care as well as selling the product.
The product needs to get better, its stuck in a rut from 1997 performance wise, interiors have improved but they are still Dacia standard and not up market, that needs to change when you go up against BMW, VW and Audi.
It needs to change, you cannot go up against cars that do 15+mpg to the gallon more with the same power, provide better dealer networks, have decent warranties and low road tax, DIT is the way forward for Subaru, the BRZ was a step in the right direction but Toyota sell more.....
Here is an example, my new Pug RCZ R, did a 500 mile trip, heavy traffic motorway, town, A road, averaged 40mpg without trying, that has 270ps.
Extra urban is quoted at 55mpg.... if i tried i would get near that, in a performance car!
Its also euro 6 compliant, has £143.50 a year road tax, pretty cheap to insure, cheap to run considering, handles and goes like a dream and i can get my hairdressing kit in the boot no problems
This is what subaru are up against, and they need to do much better in the developement of their engines to even get close, that is one BIG point that people are looking at now, performance AND economy all in the same package (who wants £400+ per annum road tax?).
You also want a reliable network for spare parts, thats not happening at the moment, I.M. is run on a shoe string, dealers need better training, its after care as well as selling the product.
The product needs to get better, its stuck in a rut from 1997 performance wise, interiors have improved but they are still Dacia standard and not up market, that needs to change when you go up against BMW, VW and Audi.
It needs to change, you cannot go up against cars that do 15+mpg to the gallon more with the same power, provide better dealer networks, have decent warranties and low road tax, DIT is the way forward for Subaru, the BRZ was a step in the right direction but Toyota sell more.....
16 May 2014, 04:07 PM
#875
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Got mine thrown in! Think his deal was already a loss for them so they had to make some money back one way or another! Make sure you get a free full tank of fuel though - you're going to need it
Last edited by NormantheDog; 16 May 2014 at 04:08 PM.
16 May 2014, 04:32 PM
#877
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John, a fair few dealers may not have been up to standard but you have others who had to get out or just got fed up of the BS I.M. were feeding them, for example, 2011 Legacy, needed front brake discs, how long do you expect to wait for brake discs on a 2 year old car?
Try 8 weeks
The garage couldnt let the guy take his car out of there because they were dangerous, now how quickly do you expect any other manufacturer to get you a set of brake discs? 1 or 2 days max?
Service item, not held in stock....
Shock absorber for a limited edition Subaru, time to wait.... 6 effing months!!!!
Well done subaru, 1 owner without their car for that long, and you wonder why dealers left
And the dealer I used rebuilt a fair few 2.5's, in and out of warranty, and they loved the product (and still do) but got fed up with the hassle they got, no replies from I.M. no parts available, so they have moved on and I dont blame them, if you have to work with a company that has 1 person on warranty claims and they are not available, its time wasted and wasted time = money.
I.M./Subaru UK have been their own worst enemy, they once had the fan base from the mid 90's through to the mid to late 00's, but due to the way they treated their customers (damn in the 90's they were one of the best for customer service) they lost the respect of most of these people buying the product, do that and you dont sell cars.
Tony
PS, i only found 1 fastest lap v the new STI and AMG, not much in it but then again i found a few with the old STI and some less powerful fwd cars, and the fwd cars stuffed the STI (with more power), so the jury is out on that one till they run it around a few more tracks
Try 8 weeks
The garage couldnt let the guy take his car out of there because they were dangerous, now how quickly do you expect any other manufacturer to get you a set of brake discs? 1 or 2 days max?
Service item, not held in stock....
Shock absorber for a limited edition Subaru, time to wait.... 6 effing months!!!!
Well done subaru, 1 owner without their car for that long, and you wonder why dealers left
And the dealer I used rebuilt a fair few 2.5's, in and out of warranty, and they loved the product (and still do) but got fed up with the hassle they got, no replies from I.M. no parts available, so they have moved on and I dont blame them, if you have to work with a company that has 1 person on warranty claims and they are not available, its time wasted and wasted time = money.
I.M./Subaru UK have been their own worst enemy, they once had the fan base from the mid 90's through to the mid to late 00's, but due to the way they treated their customers (damn in the 90's they were one of the best for customer service) they lost the respect of most of these people buying the product, do that and you dont sell cars.
Tony
PS, i only found 1 fastest lap v the new STI and AMG, not much in it but then again i found a few with the old STI and some less powerful fwd cars, and the fwd cars stuffed the STI (with more power), so the jury is out on that one till they run it around a few more tracks
The car we had in, and I know another dealer very well who had one with exactly the same issue at exactly the same time, and both customers were delighted with the way it was dealt with by us and the other dealership, and one has actually bought a new one (sadly not mine, but still trying to persuade him though).
With any manufacturer, you are going to get the odd thing that runs out of stock, or becomes an issue to get from time to time for whatever reason, it is how it is handled in those circumstances that shows the difference between someone who just wants to sell you a car, a part or a service, and a dealer who wants a long standing business relationship with its customers.
The other issues you mention, I have to be honest in the last 2 years I have not experienced that, however, from a personal stance (he says taking his company hat off for the second time in a day, hoping not to get another bollo**ing hehehe) I would have to agree that certain things could have been done better in the past. Not saying it hasn't happened to others prior to the last 2 years, but we have had no issue's with warranty claims, Subaru/IM are very clear.
16 May 2014, 06:28 PM
#878
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16 May 2014, 06:43 PM
#879
TonyBurns/Urban/scoobyboy/f1 fan etc etc what would you like to see happen? Would you like it if we all stopped buying 2.5 Subarus and have all that have been made scraped? And then change the SN name to classic SN where only the 2.0 cars are discussed.
Why does it seem to get under the skin of some folk that some like the 2.5 cars? We all know about Subaru failings but choose to go on regardless. I don't see why the sti is often compared to zegerman cars.
If you want to offer a more practical economic and reliable option then should we not be talking about 1.0 small cars or maybe diesel cars. We buy performance cars with our heart and not with our head. No sports car is a sensible buy but we work hard and have the choice to buy what we like and should not be treated as if we don't know better.
The German cars may be better in every single way on paper at least,or maybe not. Subaru however offer something a bit different and I applaud them for doing so. They mite not offer a good warranty but they do offer a choice and if people choose to make that choice then good for them.
Why does it seem to get under the skin of some folk that some like the 2.5 cars? We all know about Subaru failings but choose to go on regardless. I don't see why the sti is often compared to zegerman cars.
If you want to offer a more practical economic and reliable option then should we not be talking about 1.0 small cars or maybe diesel cars. We buy performance cars with our heart and not with our head. No sports car is a sensible buy but we work hard and have the choice to buy what we like and should not be treated as if we don't know better.
The German cars may be better in every single way on paper at least,or maybe not. Subaru however offer something a bit different and I applaud them for doing so. They mite not offer a good warranty but they do offer a choice and if people choose to make that choice then good for them.
How many times do I have to say it, Im not having a go at the new car, im having a go at Subaru uk, XDevil666 is not wanting to listen to what anyone has to say, basically its his way/his views and no one else knows what there on about, and it proves that when he refused to read what f1 fan had written!!
The thing that I dont agree on is the warranty issues, we all know the storys about the 2.5 as there mentioned on here everyday,
but Subaru have never come out and admitted it was there fault with the engines breaking(read the 2.5 sticky thread at the top) and then they have the cheek to bring a new model out and you can see for yourself its on there website where they give 5 year warranty on Subarus etc and then in brackets(STi model not included) which gives me hugh confidence that they had fix the problems that plagued the hatch and hawk engines!!!
NormantheDog and Thehulkster699 I wish you all the best with your new purchases and hope you enjoy them in years to comes!!
And XDevil666, well you can just go and Fluck yourself!!
16 May 2014, 06:57 PM
#881
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When they brought the recent Cosworth out didn't that only come with a 24 month warranty? I remember it being less than the Sti and many people questioned why.
16 May 2014, 06:59 PM
#883
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16 May 2014, 07:03 PM
#884
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Mate, Did you forget I have a standard internal 2.5 Hawk STi running a lot more then standard power
How many times do I have to say it, Im not having a go at the new car, im having a go at Subaru uk, XDevil666 is not wanting to listen to what anyone has to say, basically its his way/his views and no one else knows what there on about, and it proves that when he refused to read what f1 fan had written!!
The thing that I dont agree on is the warranty issues, we all know the storys about the 2.5 as there mentioned on here everyday, but Subaru have never come out and admitted it was there fault with the engines breaking(read the 2.5 sticky thread at the top) and then they have the cheek to bring a new model out and you can see for yourself its on there website where they give 5 year warranty on Subarus etc and then in brackets(STi model not included) which gives me hugh confidence that they had fix the problems that plagued the hatch and hawk engines!!!
NormantheDog and Thehulkster699 I wish you all the best with your new purchases and hope you enjoy them in years to comes!! And XDevil666, well you can just go and Fluck yourself!!
How many times do I have to say it, Im not having a go at the new car, im having a go at Subaru uk, XDevil666 is not wanting to listen to what anyone has to say, basically its his way/his views and no one else knows what there on about, and it proves that when he refused to read what f1 fan had written!!
The thing that I dont agree on is the warranty issues, we all know the storys about the 2.5 as there mentioned on here everyday,
but Subaru have never come out and admitted it was there fault with the engines breaking(read the 2.5 sticky thread at the top) and then they have the cheek to bring a new model out and you can see for yourself its on there website where they give 5 year warranty on Subarus etc and then in brackets(STi model not included) which gives me hugh confidence that they had fix the problems that plagued the hatch and hawk engines!!! NormantheDog and Thehulkster699 I wish you all the best with your new purchases and hope you enjoy them in years to comes!!
And XDevil666, well you can just go and Fluck yourself!!What if the new WRX STi came with a full 5-year warranty as all other Subaru's do now? How many extra people would actually then buy one? Is there anyone here who would put their money down on a car if it came with a full 5-year warranty at no extra cost?
Not attacking anyone by the way, this is just an honest question. (I got my company hat back on again, been told I have to keep it on at all times on here now hehehehe)
16 May 2014, 07:21 PM
#886
Scooby Regular
John it would definitely attract me over the 3 year warrantee but it would need a power upgrade as said before not stepping down from a 320R and having done 66k in 3.5 years 60k would be no good.
16 May 2014, 07:22 PM
#887
OK, so hypothetical question (this is not just aimed at you by the way Scoobyboy1, just your's was the last relevant comment to reply to).
What if the new WRX STi came with a full 5-year warranty as all other Subaru's do now? How many extra people would actually then buy one? Is there anyone here who would put their money down on a car if it came with a full 5-year warranty at no extra cost?
Not attacking anyone by the way, this is just an honest question. (I got my company hat back on again, been told I have to keep it on at all times on here now hehehehe)
What if the new WRX STi came with a full 5-year warranty as all other Subaru's do now? How many extra people would actually then buy one? Is there anyone here who would put their money down on a car if it came with a full 5-year warranty at no extra cost?
Not attacking anyone by the way, this is just an honest question. (I got my company hat back on again, been told I have to keep it on at all times on here now hehehehe)
But seriously, In my opinion if you advertised the car with a full 5 year 60k miles warranty at no extra cost(covers headgasket, ringlands, basically the engine) the same as any other Subaru model, then I think you would sell more cars!!!
But going from Subaru's warranty on there website, ive took a couple of paragraphs out what seems to bug me about buying a brand new £29k WRX STi and Ive highlighted my problem with the warranty!!!
5 YEAR WARRANTY. PEACE OF MIND FOR BUSY LIVES.
For built-in peace of mind, every vehicle (excluding WRX STI) marketed by Subaru (UK) Ltd is covered by a 5 Year / 100,000 mile (whichever is sooner) Limited Warranty. So every vehicle apart from the STi has a full limited warranty, so im guessing that includes engine, drivetrain etc
WRX STI is covered by the standard 3 Year / 60,000 mile (whichever is sooner)Manufacturer’s Warranty (bumper to bumper, excluding clutch driven plate). So a standard warranty, so basically when the engine goes pop, there going to say its not under warranty and the weak link of the engine, headgasket/ringlands will not be covered, this gives me no confidence at all!!
Last edited by scoobyboy1; 16 May 2014 at 07:24 PM.
16 May 2014, 08:18 PM
#891
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OK, thanks for that terzoscooby so how about a 350bhp car, with a 5-year 100,000 mile warranty as per all other Subaru's. You ain't going to get that for the same £28,995, what price would be a fair price for that?
16 May 2014, 08:32 PM
#892
Cant you do a decat mid-section, and a remap?? Got to see around the 340-350bhp mark and plenty of torque that the 2.5 produces!!
Wouldnt cost loads to do, and then sell it as the Mangoletsi 340/350 tuning pack with 5 year warranty???
Litchfields have been doing it for years with there JDM imports, and im guessing they dont bother with Subaru's anymore so there could be a market for it!!!
16 May 2014, 08:39 PM
#893
Former Sponsor
How many cats has the new STi got??
Cant you do a decat mid-section, and a remap?? Got to see around the 340-350bhp mark and plenty of torque that the 2.5 produces!!
Wouldnt cost loads to do, and then sell it as the Mangoletsi 340/350 tuning pack with 5 year warranty??? Litchfields have been doing it for years with there JDM imports, and im guessing they dont bother with Subaru's anymore so there could be a market for it!!!
Cant you do a decat mid-section, and a remap?? Got to see around the 340-350bhp mark and plenty of torque that the 2.5 produces!!
Wouldnt cost loads to do, and then sell it as the Mangoletsi 340/350 tuning pack with 5 year warranty???
Litchfields have been doing it for years with there JDM imports, and im guessing they dont bother with Subaru's anymore so there could be a market for it!!!350bhp remap already done, I'll certainly look into 5-year warranty, but there is going to be a cost for all of the above, especially for the warranty.
Mid-section and back boxes are already developed too, not got costings yet or performance and sound improvements, but should have in next 1-2 weeks.
But I need to know what would a car like that be realistically worth, and would people buy it, if so, I will invest my teams time, as well as my time and money putting it together?
16 May 2014, 08:47 PM
#895
Finance deals on your site look quite good £299 with £5k deposit or £395 with £1k deposit??
So with a decent no quibble warranty and lets say 340bhp pack, im guessing a 33k car??? and yes thats £5k over what the standard car is, but more power and under-warranty, and cheaper then what the Evo x FQ300 was when that was released!!
So with a decent no quibble warranty and lets say 340bhp pack, im guessing a 33k car??? and yes thats £5k over what the standard car is, but more power and under-warranty, and cheaper then what the Evo x FQ300 was when that was released!!
Last edited by scoobyboy1; 16 May 2014 at 08:49 PM.
16 May 2014, 08:57 PM
#896
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Any thoughts guys?
16 May 2014, 08:57 PM
#897
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To be honest though just a message of 'we screwed up with the engine in the past, we know that and we're going to make sure it's right from now on' in some sort of official capacity would go a long way!
16 May 2014, 09:00 PM
#898
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Can I also just commned you John for coming on here and taking such an active part in this thread. I know you want to sell cars so of course you have the motivation, but I don't see many other dealers giving the same sort of time and effort to respond to people's gripes on a public forum so hats off to you
16 May 2014, 09:13 PM
#899
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I would agree with that. Trouble is the looks aren't for me, but that is just a personal taste thing. I think a 5 year warranty and an optional power upgrade would seal the deal for a good few!
To be honest though just a message of 'we screwed up with the engine in the past, we know that and we're going to make sure it's right from now on' in some sort of official capacity would go a long way!
To be honest though just a message of 'we screwed up with the engine in the past, we know that and we're going to make sure it's right from now on' in some sort of official capacity would go a long way!
Can I also just commned you John for coming on here and taking such an active part in this thread. I know you want to sell cars so of course you have the motivation, but I don't see many other dealers giving the same sort of time and effort to respond to people's gripes on a public forum so hats off to you
Also, following on from my previous comment earlier today, I have finally managed to work out that it is less than 1% of cars we have had through our doors. It will take me a little longer to find out national figures though, but I will find out and make those figures public when I do. It has been a problem with some cars, I totally agree, but, nothing like the scale that people have made it out to be.
Thanks for your kind words though F1_fan, I do want to sell cars absolutely, but I am also really passionate about the product, just ask all the guys I work with (and many of my customers), I am really annoying at times hehehehe.
16 May 2014, 09:13 PM
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Thanks Scooby1 and Lordharding. It would cost more than £1200 to do both to be fair, especially the warranty, however, I am sure it could be done for less than £33k in total, I would guess. I am thinking out loud here based on nothing but my previous experience, that it would be somewhere in-between to have both the 5-year warranty and re-map.
Any thoughts guys?
Any thoughts guys?