The Rig

iTrader: (13)

On a classic, with whiteline rear ARB, showa suspension all round is it worth adding the antilift kit to the list ?

Front end just feels terrible latlely, holds to the road but on swift bends / roundabouts at speed the front end drifts, not tyre related more body roll.

just wondering if the antilift kit would help ?

Staurossim

Hi I have the same problem,on some roundabouts and cambered turns im getting some understeer,I think ALK with some decent tyres and front camber around 1 degree and 45 minutes will solve this!

2pot

iTrader: (3)

What are your tyre pressures?
Post your alignment print out.
Hopefully you've got a stock front bar?
What size rear bar - is it adjustable?
Which version Showa? Inverted or non-inverted? Damping adjustable? Perch height adjustable? Which spring rates?

The ALK will cause more dive under braking and more front lift under acceleration.

SouthWalesSam

iTrader: (1)

From my experience, yes.
Cuts power-on understeer significantly.

JDM_Stig

iTrader: (3)

Spend the cash on Poly bushes then decent alignment.

The Rig

iTrader: (13)

Hmmm ok cheers all, to answer some questions

Pressures 34 at front 32 at rear
stock front bar with new drop links
Rear bar is 24mm on the 2nd hole of adjustment available with the extra load support brackets
Pink showa/kyb shocks n springs, 4 adjustable dampening settings, set on 1 all round as any other is too hard


When you say poly bushes all round on what parts ? Ive got poly bushes on front anti roll bar bushings, rear anti roll bar , rear subframe .

cheers all

JDM_Stig

iTrader: (3)

Front arm bushes are a massive difference, then rear trailing arms, both the shock one and the actual training arm front bush,
You will get all the bushes for the price of the ALK, and they will change the car completely.

2pot

iTrader: (3)

You sure they are not 4 settings front, 8 settings rear - which is the 20 year old Showa (pink) version of the current kyb (red) agx.
Your struts are way past there best. Setting one should be noticeably soft.
That Showa strut was sold with v5 sti springs (f223/r185lb/in). Any idea what spring is on them now?
Have your bump stops disintegrated? Failed rear stops would cause understeer.

Take it in somewhere and get a print out of the current alignment - have a full tank of fuel or put 40kg in the boot.

SouthWalesSam

iTrader: (1)

Yes, you could do that and sharpen up your steer, but you’d still have the power on understeer that you’ve described when accelerating out of roundabouts.

It’s caused by rear end squat, so you’d still need the anti lift kit.

If you go stiffen up the rear you’ll just turning the problem into early front wheel lock up under braking.

... in my experience.

2pot

iTrader: (3)

Anti-dive, on a road car (usually 20-25%), allows you to use soft springs (maximising grip), but still restrict the suspension travel and therefore confine the geometry, within defined parameters. Under hard braking, anti-dive restricts changes in camber/toe, which adversely effect braking stability + passengers don't, usually, like being pitched around.

A racing car, with aero, might use 50% anti-dive, to maintain a pre-determined aero attitude.

If you fit an ALK, with oem spring rates, you'd better find a way compensate for the increase in dive, eating up your bump travel. No bump travel = No suspension.
Anti-dive was resisting a rotational force, by restricting the suspension travel under braking.
Compensating for an ALK?!
The problem is, overly stiff springs, on a road car, decrease grip. Probably the reason why those with, ill-considered, coilover spring rates, like ALK's. As the ALK is softening the, generally, overly stiff coilover front suspension.
Compression damping rates should be controlling spring oscillations, not compensating for sub-optimal design in other areas.
Stiff front bump stops, as pitch control, also induce understeer/affect ride quality, on poor road surfaces.

Staurossim

I will try ALK soon and I will post my impressions!(good or bad)

2pot

iTrader: (3)

Most dampers are rebound-biased.
Under braking, with an ALK, the suspension will 'jack down' significantly more, onto the front bump stops. Every subsequent bump will reduce the ride height, as the damping is slowing the suspension returning to its normal height.

Assuming the geometry/alignment and tyres pressures are OK? If you want to tame corner exit understeer, stiffen the rear bump stops.
Or, if you have non-inverted dampers, you can also use clips to control the engagement of the rear stop at corner exit.

scoobaholic

Really interesting! I‘m on an RB320 suspension with whiteline ALK (on car before I bought it) and sometimes on undulating roads can hit the front bump stops which is not only unpleasant but also calls for slower speeds. I didn‘t remove the ALK as I‘m quite happy with the set-up and worried I‘d end up with more understeer. Am tempted to try stock or group N bushings instead and see if that‘s better.
Any thoughts?

2pot

iTrader: (3)

I prefer the group n rear lca bushes and the stock front lca bushes.
With Whiteline kca335 front top mounts and Superpro trc0002 or Whiteline kca313 ball joints+tie rod ends.

nico1131

Exactly what I was about to mention.

I'd remove the ALK, fit Group N rear LCA bushes, whiteline top mount and why not install a shim without flipping the pin of the LCA to increase caster a bit more (if Aluminum LCA).

The Rig

iTrader: (13)

Nah, 4 settings on front ( via adjustment on the top mount itself) and rear has a 4 point dial on the back, gas filled, its says KYB on them.( which i thought was the showa shocks ) but guessing 2 seperate brands ?

Setting 1 is soft ish, 2 is firm, 3 is ok not much movement and 4 is track.never used lol

bump stops are all there and look good

current alignement was done not long ago, although i then changed the bottom ball joints which made the steering wheel slighlty out, typically !!

Think i will avoid the ALK and maybe get some firm bushes all round or shall i put the whiteline rear ARB on its softest or firmest setting ( currently in the middle )

scoobaholic

Thanks very much guys, yeah thats what I was thinking (group n rear lca bushes and the stock front lca bushes), I will try that soon.
So the whiteline topmounts would be to get extra caster, I guess trading in a little compliance over the stock mounts, will look into that.
I‘ve been recommended the whiteline ball joints before but didn‘t understand why they would be an improvement on the rb320 set up, again I didn‘t want it to stiffen up the front (via the rollcentre) relative to the rear, not sure if that‘s a factor.

Markyscoob

My experience of ALK was very positive. Here on the Island we get a lot of crappy roads. Braking into a junction or tight corner on broken tarmac, the O.E. anti-dive causes the car to bang and crash about and lose grip. With the ALK the car is more supple and able to cope. The anti-Lift element also helps as it doesn't understeer out of tight corners any more.

Win-Win for me.

scoobaholic

Sounds good, what set-up is that on? The crappy backroads is where I want my set-up to work, too. I can definitely relate to 2pots comment on the alk letting the front suspension jack down more under braking. The rb320 is already lowered at the front by around 30mm, so if I go over successive undulations or a large compression it can hit the stops. Will have to try without the alk and see the difference.