This blasted EU thing
27 August 2012, 02:33 PM
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This blasted EU thing
Right we've all read the threads and I don't think anyone can say for definite what will happen. Maybe it will maybe it wont but sitting around debating it won't acheive anything. I just fired off an email to my local MP and the half dozen MEPs for my area. I will let you all know when I hear a response and hope its favourable! I personally think it should be ok but thats no reason to leave it to chance.
If you want to do the same that would be great but please don't just copy and paste mine as I am sure these people get copy and paste jobs all the time and just ignore them.
Dear Sir,
I write with regards to the EU proposal regards roadworthiness, please see link.
http://ec.europa.eu/transport/doc/roadworthiness-package/com%282012%29380.pdf
There is much confusion and uncertainty amongst car enthusiasts as to what this will mean. Depending on how the document is interpreted it could appear to outlaw or heavily restrict modification of vehicles. There is a long tradition in this country of modifying our cars, I believe the current MOT system is more than adequate to make sure they are safe without the need for yet more beurocracy from the EU. This it would appear is a restriction in our freedom being dictated to us by Europe and is completely unacceptable to the tens of thousands of car enthusiasts nationally. The UK is world renowned in the motorsport industry with many large, highly succesful teams choosing to be base themselves here. What sort of signal does this send to teams and companies looking to invest here?
Aside from the issue with freedom what about the economic issues? There are hundreds of companies involved in supply and fitting aftermarket parts. These companies support thousands of jobs which could potentially be at risk. The profits of these companies are taxed, the workers wages are taxed and when I buy the parts or use their services I pay VAT as well. There are also many publications directly linked, again jobs and revenue for the treasury. Any car enthusiast also pays a massive amount of duty on the fuel used in them.
In these hard times is that what we really need, more interfering regulations that will cost people their jobs and the treasury income? The Eurozone is in massive crisis, is this really the sort of thing that Brussels should be focusing on?
I would ask you to look at this issue urgently, the proposal is on the verge of going through within the next six weeks and people are still none the wiser to how this will be interepted and implemented. We really need the support of people like you to oppose this.
If you want to do the same that would be great but please don't just copy and paste mine as I am sure these people get copy and paste jobs all the time and just ignore them.
Dear Sir,
I write with regards to the EU proposal regards roadworthiness, please see link.
http://ec.europa.eu/transport/doc/roadworthiness-package/com%282012%29380.pdf
There is much confusion and uncertainty amongst car enthusiasts as to what this will mean. Depending on how the document is interpreted it could appear to outlaw or heavily restrict modification of vehicles. There is a long tradition in this country of modifying our cars, I believe the current MOT system is more than adequate to make sure they are safe without the need for yet more beurocracy from the EU. This it would appear is a restriction in our freedom being dictated to us by Europe and is completely unacceptable to the tens of thousands of car enthusiasts nationally. The UK is world renowned in the motorsport industry with many large, highly succesful teams choosing to be base themselves here. What sort of signal does this send to teams and companies looking to invest here?
Aside from the issue with freedom what about the economic issues? There are hundreds of companies involved in supply and fitting aftermarket parts. These companies support thousands of jobs which could potentially be at risk. The profits of these companies are taxed, the workers wages are taxed and when I buy the parts or use their services I pay VAT as well. There are also many publications directly linked, again jobs and revenue for the treasury. Any car enthusiast also pays a massive amount of duty on the fuel used in them.
In these hard times is that what we really need, more interfering regulations that will cost people their jobs and the treasury income? The Eurozone is in massive crisis, is this really the sort of thing that Brussels should be focusing on?
I would ask you to look at this issue urgently, the proposal is on the verge of going through within the next six weeks and people are still none the wiser to how this will be interepted and implemented. We really need the support of people like you to oppose this.
27 August 2012, 02:43 PM
#2
well worded mate i hope they take notice of it,i really hope it doesnt come to us living in a dictated state,our grand parents fought for our free right and now its under threat
the eu is a load bollocks and the sooner the uk wakes up and realises this the better
the eu is a load bollocks and the sooner the uk wakes up and realises this the better
27 August 2012, 02:50 PM
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Right we've all read the threads and I don't think anyone can say for definite what will happen. Maybe it will maybe it wont but sitting around debating it won't acheive anything. I just fired off an email to my local MP and the half dozen MEPs for my area. I will let you all know when I hear a response and hope its favourable! I personally think it should be ok but thats no reason to leave it to chance.
If you want to do the same that would be great but please don't just copy and paste mine as I am sure these people get copy and paste jobs all the time and just ignore them.
Dear Sir,
I write with regards to the EU proposal regards roadworthiness, please see link.
http://ec.europa.eu/transport/doc/roadworthiness-package/com%282012%29380.pdf
There is much confusion and uncertainty amongst car enthusiasts as to what this will mean. Depending on how the document is interpreted it could appear to outlaw or heavily restrict modification of vehicles. There is a long tradition in this country of modifying our cars, I believe the current MOT system is more than adequate to make sure they are safe without the need for yet more beurocracy from the EU. This it would appear is a restriction in our freedom being dictated to us by Europe and is completely unacceptable to the tens of thousands of car enthusiasts nationally. The UK is world renowned in the motorsport industry with many large, highly succesful teams choosing to be base themselves here. What sort of signal does this send to teams and companies looking to invest here?
Aside from the issue with freedom what about the economic issues? There are hundreds of companies involved in supply and fitting aftermarket parts. These companies support thousands of jobs which could potentially be at risk. The profits of these companies are taxed, the workers wages are taxed and when I buy the parts or use their services I pay VAT as well. There are also many publications directly linked, again jobs and revenue for the treasury. Any car enthusiast also pays a massive amount of duty on the fuel used in them.
In these hard times is that what we really need, more interfering regulations that will cost people their jobs and the treasury income? The Eurozone is in massive crisis, is this really the sort of thing that Brussels should be focusing on?
I would ask you to look at this issue urgently, the proposal is on the verge of going through within the next six weeks and people are still none the wiser to how this will be interepted and implemented. We really need the support of people like you to oppose this.
If you want to do the same that would be great but please don't just copy and paste mine as I am sure these people get copy and paste jobs all the time and just ignore them.
Dear Sir,
I write with regards to the EU proposal regards roadworthiness, please see link.
http://ec.europa.eu/transport/doc/roadworthiness-package/com%282012%29380.pdf
There is much confusion and uncertainty amongst car enthusiasts as to what this will mean. Depending on how the document is interpreted it could appear to outlaw or heavily restrict modification of vehicles. There is a long tradition in this country of modifying our cars, I believe the current MOT system is more than adequate to make sure they are safe without the need for yet more beurocracy from the EU. This it would appear is a restriction in our freedom being dictated to us by Europe and is completely unacceptable to the tens of thousands of car enthusiasts nationally. The UK is world renowned in the motorsport industry with many large, highly succesful teams choosing to be base themselves here. What sort of signal does this send to teams and companies looking to invest here?
Aside from the issue with freedom what about the economic issues? There are hundreds of companies involved in supply and fitting aftermarket parts. These companies support thousands of jobs which could potentially be at risk. The profits of these companies are taxed, the workers wages are taxed and when I buy the parts or use their services I pay VAT as well. There are also many publications directly linked, again jobs and revenue for the treasury. Any car enthusiast also pays a massive amount of duty on the fuel used in them.
In these hard times is that what we really need, more interfering regulations that will cost people their jobs and the treasury income? The Eurozone is in massive crisis, is this really the sort of thing that Brussels should be focusing on?
I would ask you to look at this issue urgently, the proposal is on the verge of going through within the next six weeks and people are still none the wiser to how this will be interepted and implemented. We really need the support of people like you to oppose this.
Not sure where it says it will outlaw or heavily restrict modified vehicles...granted I only scan read it but there appears to be a bit of unnecessary panic here?
27 August 2012, 03:16 PM
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After reading threads on pistonheads and the like I think yes the consesus is it should be ok. Even if it is ok a bit of lobbying to policticians to remind them we're still here and valuable to the economy does no harm.
I think its all down to how the rather vauge guidelines are interpreted. You could read it that anything that detracts from OE spec is not allowed, or you could read it that only things that reduce safety are banned. I'd rather at least get my views accross instead of waiting to see what happens and them complain (traditional british way
) You have to remember in some EU countries they cant do squat to their cars and you just know given half a chance the EU would have it that way everywhere!
27 August 2012, 03:17 PM
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We are extremly lucky in that respect and long may it continue! What a shame for genuine enthusiasts in other countries like beliblisk, hopefully not a future vision of the UK!
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27 August 2012, 03:28 PM
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After reading threads on pistonheads and the like I think yes the consesus is it should be ok. Even if it is ok a bit of lobbying to policticians to remind them we're still here and valuable to the economy does no harm.
I think its all down to how the rather vauge guidelines are interpreted. You could read it that anything that detracts from OE spec is not allowed, or you could read it that only things that reduce safety are banned. I'd rather at least get my views accross instead of waiting to see what happens and them complain (traditional british way)
You have to remember in some EU countries they cant do squat to their cars and you just know given half a chance the EU would have it that way everywhere!
I think its all down to how the rather vauge guidelines are interpreted. You could read it that anything that detracts from OE spec is not allowed, or you could read it that only things that reduce safety are banned. I'd rather at least get my views accross instead of waiting to see what happens and them complain (traditional british way
) You have to remember in some EU countries they cant do squat to their cars and you just know given half a chance the EU would have it that way everywhere!
27 August 2012, 03:32 PM
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we have had this discussion over on scottishscoobies.net and there is a lad that knows a fair bit about EU law. he reckons its no where near the passing stage.
one of the statements sums it up well.
do you really think it would have gotten to the passing stage and none of the companies from the hundreds of billions industry have said a word. not boo to a goose, no petitions, nothing. then one site posts a write up and the whole forum world goes mental speculating.
this is nothing more than misunderstood information from a proposal at a very early stage.
so, our view, right or wrong, im not here to discuss our view as its what we believe. as everyone else has one and its theirs.
Not going to happen in the near future if ever at all.
one of the statements sums it up well.
do you really think it would have gotten to the passing stage and none of the companies from the hundreds of billions industry have said a word. not boo to a goose, no petitions, nothing. then one site posts a write up and the whole forum world goes mental speculating.
this is nothing more than misunderstood information from a proposal at a very early stage.
so, our view, right or wrong, im not here to discuss our view as its what we believe. as everyone else has one and its theirs.
Not going to happen in the near future if ever at all.
27 August 2012, 03:41 PM
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we have had this discussion over on scottishscoobies.net and there is a lad that knows a fair bit about EU law. he reckons its no where near the passing stage.
one of the statements sums it up well.
do you really think it would have gotten to the passing stage and none of the companies from the hundreds of billions industry have said a word. not boo to a goose, no petitions, nothing. then one site posts a write up and the whole forum world goes mental speculating.
this is nothing more than misunderstood information from a proposal at a very early stage.
so, our view, right or wrong, im not here to discuss our view as its what we believe. as everyone else has one and its theirs.
Not going to happen in the near future if ever at all.
one of the statements sums it up well.
do you really think it would have gotten to the passing stage and none of the companies from the hundreds of billions industry have said a word. not boo to a goose, no petitions, nothing. then one site posts a write up and the whole forum world goes mental speculating.
this is nothing more than misunderstood information from a proposal at a very early stage.
so, our view, right or wrong, im not here to discuss our view as its what we believe. as everyone else has one and its theirs.
Not going to happen in the near future if ever at all.
Regardless of all the debate one way or the other it does no harm for folks to drop their MP and quick email to make their feelings known after all thats what we pay them for!
27 August 2012, 04:08 PM
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I for one am not worried by this bollox in the slightest, even if it did come into force I wouldn't take any notice of it and shall carry on as I am with mods, they can say what they like but unless they are willing to cover the cost of returning my car to standard it shall remain modded
Besides I have the friendliest mot station going
Besides I have the friendliest mot station going
27 August 2012, 06:14 PM
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Is this not more to do with vosa requesting a change in vehicle law to suit their mot regime? My understanding is they had recently added new testable items to the mot guide, unfortunately they haven't been able to add them all until they have got the law changed.
27 August 2012, 06:59 PM
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Not really its a proposal by the EU which would affect all member states, not just VOSA in the UK. The sticking point is no one knows 100% exactly how it will be implemented.
27 August 2012, 07:23 PM
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If it's like Belgium, then they take your car from you when your pulled over. They then take your car to their garage and proceed to swap everything back to standard using parts from the main dealers, then give you the bill in the form of a fine. And you don`t get the modded parts back.
27 August 2012, 07:28 PM
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I was reading somewhere that after handguns were banned in this country the government were taken to the EU court and were forced to compensate every owner. Maybe similar would apply but someone would have to take them to court.
Chances are it won't come to that though.
Chances are it won't come to that though.
27 August 2012, 10:04 PM
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Things can be done to make mods legal here but everything you do need TUV certificat. We can switch wheels,change bits of exhaust and put KW coilovers (cause they have TUV) but here things stop.
TMIC,cone filters,AP or other brakes,roll cages,rotated kits you can forget about all bigger mods.
I own semi legal impreza (stage 2 i guess) and so far i didnt have any problem......but i always get bad feeling when i see blue boys in my rear mirror:S
Hope you guy will never need to know how that feels.
TMIC,cone filters,AP or other brakes,roll cages,rotated kits you can forget about all bigger mods.
I own semi legal impreza (stage 2 i guess) and so far i didnt have any problem......but i always get bad feeling when i see blue boys in my rear mirror:S
Hope you guy will never need to know how that feels.
29 August 2012, 03:57 PM
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Just spotted this on pistonheads.
http://pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=26260
Looks like we can breathe a sigh of relief for now, but still maybe worth emailing them politicians to get your views known for further down the road?
Have heard back from one of the MEPs I emailed saying he is against the proposal.
http://pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=26260
Looks like we can breathe a sigh of relief for now, but still maybe worth emailing them politicians to get your views known for further down the road?
Have heard back from one of the MEPs I emailed saying he is against the proposal.
29 August 2012, 04:28 PM
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No way this was ever going to happen - it would have hurt the economy too much and ultimately, money talks!
Although a TUV style approval process for modified parts might not be an altogether bad idea PROVIDING it was well implemented, as:
a) It would stop ****e parts getting on the market and having nothing to distinguish them from quality items. It would be reassuring to know that your latest engine/braking/chassis mod had undergone a rigorous and transparent quality assurance process and did what it said on the tin! Anyone who has been involved in tuning their car knows that tuning is a trap for the unwary!
b) It would make life easier to modify a car from a legal viewpoint. For example, have you got a modified exhaust? 'Technically' anything other than std OEM isn't acceptable and you could be asked to remove it by an police officer. The fact that more people aren't pulled up for this is due to discretion in the enforcement of the law NOT the fact that there aren't legal provisions there to stop people from installing the latest "Megaton Ultraburner" There was an issue with this in Scotland not so long back with a very tame Prodrive exhaust IIRC!
c) It might make insuring modified cars easier. Most aftermarket parts now are sold with the disclaimer "not for road use". That could be resolved. Also, as an example, many of us have cars with higher quality brakes and suspension than that provided by Subaru, but there is bugger all chance of having that recognized in an insurance quote and the value of such parts is often significantly diminished in any settlement. I was offered 400 Quid for nearly new AP 6 pot set up when my old car was written off! I'd imagine this is at least in part owning to their non-approved aftermarket status. This situation might improve were parts to be type approved.
Although a TUV style approval process for modified parts might not be an altogether bad idea PROVIDING it was well implemented, as:
a) It would stop ****e parts getting on the market and having nothing to distinguish them from quality items. It would be reassuring to know that your latest engine/braking/chassis mod had undergone a rigorous and transparent quality assurance process and did what it said on the tin! Anyone who has been involved in tuning their car knows that tuning is a trap for the unwary!
b) It would make life easier to modify a car from a legal viewpoint. For example, have you got a modified exhaust? 'Technically' anything other than std OEM isn't acceptable and you could be asked to remove it by an police officer. The fact that more people aren't pulled up for this is due to discretion in the enforcement of the law NOT the fact that there aren't legal provisions there to stop people from installing the latest "Megaton Ultraburner"
There was an issue with this in Scotland not so long back with a very tame Prodrive exhaust IIRC!c) It might make insuring modified cars easier. Most aftermarket parts now are sold with the disclaimer "not for road use". That could be resolved. Also, as an example, many of us have cars with higher quality brakes and suspension than that provided by Subaru, but there is bugger all chance of having that recognized in an insurance quote and the value of such parts is often significantly diminished in any settlement. I was offered 400 Quid for nearly new AP 6 pot set up when my old car was written off! I'd imagine this is at least in part owning to their non-approved aftermarket status. This situation might improve were parts to be type approved.
Last edited by New_scooby_04; 30 August 2012 at 01:07 PM.
29 August 2012, 08:45 PM
#26
I was reading somewhere that after handguns were banned in this country the government were taken to the EU court and were forced to compensate every owner. Maybe similar would apply but someone would have to take them to court.
Chances are it won't come to that though.
Chances are it won't come to that though.
The difference for us is that we have no 'Car Tuners' Association, although were one to be created it would doubtless have a huge membership and wield considerable power. Likwise the many tuning companies are similarly unrepresented. Would the Motor Trade Association be much use?
Anyone think a Car Tuners Association would be a goer? (Might need a better name though!)
30 August 2012, 04:09 PM
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They were the chaps who first dredged up this stuff.
As for this proposal 100% definetly never ever making into law, well I'm not prepared to trust the politicians and EU plonkers, however unlikely it seems it would pass. This is the EU after all!
Although it would appear that ACE got everyone into a panic over this happening soon.
As for this proposal 100% definetly never ever making into law, well I'm not prepared to trust the politicians and EU plonkers, however unlikely it seems it would pass. This is the EU after all!
Although it would appear that ACE got everyone into a panic over this happening soon.
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