New evo7 and STI 7 tested 2moro on top gear!
21 March 2001, 05:06 PM
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I have been informed by the dealer who is providing the evo7 (warrender of Bolton) that their car is on top gear tomorrow night (thurs) along with the sti7 
The guy was saying to me that they have sold 23 evo7's and 4 new STI7's without people even driving them!!!!!
but they do have a couple of 22B's in stock for anyone whos interested
Lets see what the outcome is, both are very good cars so it is going to be close, but the evo still has its pathetically small fuel tank
and also warrender have told me that they are doing their own limited edition of the evo7 with 340bhp now that sounds good
Tony
The guy was saying to me that they have sold 23 evo7's and 4 new STI7's without people even driving them!!!!!
but they do have a couple of 22B's in stock for anyone whos interested
Lets see what the outcome is, both are very good cars so it is going to be close, but the evo still has its pathetically small fuel tank
and also warrender have told me that they are doing their own limited edition of the evo7 with 340bhp now that sounds good Tony
21 March 2001, 05:34 PM
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If you see Tiff driving around in a black Evo1: it is my car ! :-)
It was filmed down at castle combe last Thursday. I've got to say Tiff looked happy in the E7 than the STI, The STI carried a lot more understeer through the fast corner where I was stood.
He wouldn't say which he preferred though.
First time I've seen a E7 and a new STI in the flesh next to each other, boy oh boy is the STI ugly, sorry guys. Sounds glorious though, compared to our giant hoover sound effcts :-)
TonyC
It was filmed down at castle combe last Thursday. I've got to say Tiff looked happy in the E7 than the STI, The STI carried a lot more understeer through the fast corner where I was stood.
He wouldn't say which he preferred though.
First time I've seen a E7 and a new STI in the flesh next to each other, boy oh boy is the STI ugly, sorry guys. Sounds glorious though, compared to our giant hoover sound effcts :-)
TonyC
21 March 2001, 07:19 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by TonyBurns:
<B>The guy was saying to me that they have sold 23 evo7's and 4 new STI7's without people even driving them!!!!![/quote]
That is such a crock of ****, salesman speak mate, dont believe it!
Cem
<B>The guy was saying to me that they have sold 23 evo7's and 4 new STI7's without people even driving them!!!!![/quote]
That is such a crock of ****, salesman speak mate, dont believe it!
Cem
21 March 2001, 07:50 PM
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Would have had a drive of the evo7 but the bloody thing was having its SVA test today but got the info pack on it, it looks pretty good to me
Tony
but got the info pack on it, it looks pretty good to me Tony
21 March 2001, 07:51 PM
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Cem
I think he means pre-sold 27. On the launch night at Warrenders they had a list of all the cars due with spec and colour, at least 15 had names next to them.(including a Mr Hunt-no relation)
The first customer cars aren't due until April, but 27 orders is believable.
Kevin.
[This message has been edited by HUNTY (edited 21 March 2001).]
I think he means pre-sold 27. On the launch night at Warrenders they had a list of all the cars due with spec and colour, at least 15 had names next to them.(including a Mr Hunt-no relation)
The first customer cars aren't due until April, but 27 orders is believable.
Kevin.
[This message has been edited by HUNTY (edited 21 March 2001).]
21 March 2001, 08:15 PM
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Yup Hunty, he was saying about that, the car that your going to see on top gear 2moro nite has been sold, the poor guy whos bought it aint even had a go yet lol!! but if i get a chance ill go down and have a look around one, just to be inquisitive you know
Tony
Tony
21 March 2001, 10:01 PM
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DOH, I managed to convince myself I read this thread yesterday, hence me watching 20 mins of home front wondering what had happened to TG!
I think I'm going mental
Bob
I think I'm going mental
Bob
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22 March 2001, 08:33 AM
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Certainly all the guys I know up here in the North West with VI's are keeping them and don't like the VII.
The First VII's Warrenders sell will be to the 'must have new shape' people, not Evo VI owners wanting the new shape.
The VII will also attract the car enthusaist that wanted all that was good about the VI but wouldn't be seen dead in one!
I am guessing, but I bet most trade from an old shape STI!
Kevin.
The First VII's Warrenders sell will be to the 'must have new shape' people, not Evo VI owners wanting the new shape.
The VII will also attract the car enthusaist that wanted all that was good about the VI but wouldn't be seen dead in one!
I am guessing, but I bet most trade from an old shape STI!
Kevin.
22 March 2001, 10:07 AM
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IMHO Mitsubishi and Subaru made the last of a breed in the old EVO 6 and Sti 6, the new Evo and STi both look like over weight big, ugly cars made so for the American market. I can't believe how ugly and bloated both of these cars look.
Of course all the mags and TV programs are going to say they are an improvement in some areas and give the overall feel that they have moved on for the better. But I believe that the likes of us driving Evo 6s and Sti 5s/6s are driving the last of a dying breed.
Enjoy them while you can, I think it will have to be a Skyline next.
SJD
Of course all the mags and TV programs are going to say they are an improvement in some areas and give the overall feel that they have moved on for the better. But I believe that the likes of us driving Evo 6s and Sti 5s/6s are driving the last of a dying breed.
Enjoy them while you can, I think it will have to be a Skyline next.
SJD
22 March 2001, 11:29 AM
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Scott,
I understand what you are saying and agree to some extent. I think what we are witnessing is a breed of new generation cars, cars that will pave the way for the next 5-7 years or so of rallycar homologation.
Although the current new duet offered from Subaru and Mistu seem big, over-designed and dare i say it, slow, we should look forward to further incarnations of said models.
For example, I am looking forward to the Evo 8 and the RS Sprint and especially a Makinen edition, or the Sti 8 or a Type RA or (wouldnt it be great) a 22B version.
I think when the original Impreza made its debut, the welcoming was far from friendly. It was its further incarnations that made it what it is today.
I suppose we may have to just sit and wait.
Cem
I understand what you are saying and agree to some extent. I think what we are witnessing is a breed of new generation cars, cars that will pave the way for the next 5-7 years or so of rallycar homologation.
Although the current new duet offered from Subaru and Mistu seem big, over-designed and dare i say it, slow, we should look forward to further incarnations of said models.
For example, I am looking forward to the Evo 8 and the RS Sprint and especially a Makinen edition, or the Sti 8 or a Type RA or (wouldnt it be great) a 22B version.
I think when the original Impreza made its debut, the welcoming was far from friendly. It was its further incarnations that made it what it is today.
I suppose we may have to just sit and wait.
Cem
22 March 2001, 11:33 AM
#12
I agree with cem on this one,
I was looking at buying an EVO VI 18 months ago and the dealer in question told me that if I wanted one that I would have to act very quickly as they were in very short supply due to limitied production runs.
What a crock of S**t, you can walk into any Mitsi dealer and pick up an EVO VI.
Just remember he is in the business of selling cars at a profit and will tell a punter anything to get rid of his motors.
Regards
Paul
I was looking at buying an EVO VI 18 months ago and the dealer in question told me that if I wanted one that I would have to act very quickly as they were in very short supply due to limitied production runs.
What a crock of S**t, you can walk into any Mitsi dealer and pick up an EVO VI.
Just remember he is in the business of selling cars at a profit and will tell a punter anything to get rid of his motors.
Regards
Paul
22 March 2001, 12:09 PM
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I still don't believe it Hunty.
There isn't a single person on the whole of the LTR forum that has ordered one.
That sounds pretty fishy to me. Salesmen would sell their grandmothers if they could to get a sale.
Cem
There isn't a single person on the whole of the LTR forum that has ordered one.
That sounds pretty fishy to me. Salesmen would sell their grandmothers if they could to get a sale.
Cem
22 March 2001, 03:03 PM
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Scott,
You say "I can't believe how ugly and bloated both of these cars look." about the EVO and STI 7s... and follow up by saying it's a Skyline next for you!?
I reckon the EVO 7 looks more like a baby skyline than previous incarnations, especially now they've gone for a more subaru/subtle styling approach.
I'd consider waiting a while and getting an EVO 7 when the tuners have got some reliable results from it... and getting a "GTR-Lite" or "Baby-GTR" for the front grill.
Moray
You say "I can't believe how ugly and bloated both of these cars look." about the EVO and STI 7s... and follow up by saying it's a Skyline next for you!?
I reckon the EVO 7 looks more like a baby skyline than previous incarnations, especially now they've gone for a more subaru/subtle styling approach.
I'd consider waiting a while and getting an EVO 7 when the tuners have got some reliable results from it... and getting a "GTR-Lite" or "Baby-GTR" for the front grill.
Moray
22 March 2001, 03:43 PM
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Call me Mr Nostalgic, but I think that the tools we drive now will never appear from the same mould as they have from the past 4-5 generations gone by.
Had Subaru done a Porsche 911 on us and made the next incarnation just as attractive to drive as it is to look at then I wouldn't be moaning.
But you cannot deny both the Evo V11 and Sti V11 look more far more bloated and rounded than the niche products they supersede.
It’s an era gone by, q Hovis music
Had Subaru done a Porsche 911 on us and made the next incarnation just as attractive to drive as it is to look at then I wouldn't be moaning.
But you cannot deny both the Evo V11 and Sti V11 look more far more bloated and rounded than the niche products they supersede.
It’s an era gone by, q Hovis music
22 March 2001, 04:05 PM
#16
Sorry Cem, your completely wrong on the next generation of EVO's and STi's, i am sad to say.
The rules for rallying have changed masively, there is no longer a need to build a road going example of the rally car for homologation purposes.
The reason the EVO VI is such a brilliant car, better than the last proper subaru in many ways is because Mitsubishi were the last manufacturer to move from GroupA rules to WRC rules.
Under GroupA rules the rally car is based quite closely to the road car. Under WRC rules you dont event need to produce a 4 wheel drive or turbocharged model. Hence the Focus, 206, Accent, Ibetha, Octavia, Xsara.
All you need do now to go rallying in the WRC is base the car on a production vehicle, you can replace the suspension and drivetrain with any design, within certain guidelines. The engine has to come from the manufacturers range, but does not have to be sold in turbo form, hence the Zetec replacing the YB in the focus. There is no Zetec turbo sold to the public.
The days of rally bred supercars like the STi's and EVO's are Over, makes me sad to say this.
The objectives of increasing manufacturer involvement in the WRC by changing these rules is working however, you have far more manufacturers competing at the highest level.
The rules for rallying have changed masively, there is no longer a need to build a road going example of the rally car for homologation purposes.
The reason the EVO VI is such a brilliant car, better than the last proper subaru in many ways is because Mitsubishi were the last manufacturer to move from GroupA rules to WRC rules.
Under GroupA rules the rally car is based quite closely to the road car. Under WRC rules you dont event need to produce a 4 wheel drive or turbocharged model. Hence the Focus, 206, Accent, Ibetha, Octavia, Xsara.
All you need do now to go rallying in the WRC is base the car on a production vehicle, you can replace the suspension and drivetrain with any design, within certain guidelines. The engine has to come from the manufacturers range, but does not have to be sold in turbo form, hence the Zetec replacing the YB in the focus. There is no Zetec turbo sold to the public.
The days of rally bred supercars like the STi's and EVO's are Over, makes me sad to say this.
The objectives of increasing manufacturer involvement in the WRC by changing these rules is working however, you have far more manufacturers competing at the highest level.
22 March 2001, 04:32 PM
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(My) logic suggests that:
1) WRX is more refined, slower and VERY ugly. Naa!
2) STI is still more refined, faster and still ugly. Hmmm, possibly....
3) The VII is faster still, refined and not ugly - for about the same money as the STI. On the face of it seems like no contest to me....
Before the flames start, I haven't driven any of these machines - this is just comparing the machines on paper. Also, choosing cars is very subjective - horses for courses and all that....
Jamie
1) WRX is more refined, slower and VERY ugly. Naa!
2) STI is still more refined, faster and still ugly. Hmmm, possibly....
3) The VII is faster still, refined and not ugly - for about the same money as the STI. On the face of it seems like no contest to me....
Before the flames start, I haven't driven any of these machines - this is just comparing the machines on paper. Also, choosing cars is very subjective - horses for courses and all that....
Jamie
22 March 2001, 04:43 PM
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John,
Sure, for Mitsubishi the manufacturer, the GroupA category is over, but do the the privateers who still race GroupA not represent a huge market for Mitsubishi?
Even so, we have seen the 22B, which had nothing to do with homologation whatsoever, but still represented what we all see doing the special stage stuff. I still think we will see them appear in all their glory on our roads.
Cem
Sure, for Mitsubishi the manufacturer, the GroupA category is over, but do the the privateers who still race GroupA not represent a huge market for Mitsubishi?
Even so, we have seen the 22B, which had nothing to do with homologation whatsoever, but still represented what we all see doing the special stage stuff. I still think we will see them appear in all their glory on our roads.
Cem
22 March 2001, 05:03 PM
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Cem, I was under the impression that most EVOs were sold to Gr.N teams. Problem is that they have no real competition left in that class.
I also just read that 2002 will be the last season where Gr.N cars can participate in the WRC events.
Theo
I also just read that 2002 will be the last season where Gr.N cars can participate in the WRC events.
Theo
22 March 2001, 05:11 PM
#23
let me expand on that a little.
The way the rules work for GroupA is that the manufacturer has to produce a run of cars that it then homologates.
Whether the car eventually becomes a privateer or works car is irelevent.
You will not see any next generation GroupA cars in private hands because in order for them to exist the manufacturer has to have built them first in the required numbers to get the homologation papers.
With the advent of the WRC (world rally car) rules no manufacturer has to go to that massive expense or take the risk of being able to sell the thousands of production cars it would need to make to become homologated.
The whole point behind the WRC cars was to take this massive burden away, this allowed companies like Skoda and Citroen to join the party at a realistic price level.
The reason Mitsubishi has cleaned up in GroupN, which is very, very closely based on the homologation run spec of the cars is because Mitsubishi is the only manufacturer since the WRC rules came out that decided to stay with the GroupA rules, as they felt the market was there to sell the thousands of cars they have to build and still make a profit. There are also some minor technicle advantages to running a GroupA car, but i wont bore you with those.
Even Mitsubishi has now seen the light with WRC rules and has gone down that route.
The days of the rally bred supercar are over, end of story.
The way the rules work for GroupA is that the manufacturer has to produce a run of cars that it then homologates.
Whether the car eventually becomes a privateer or works car is irelevent.
You will not see any next generation GroupA cars in private hands because in order for them to exist the manufacturer has to have built them first in the required numbers to get the homologation papers.
With the advent of the WRC (world rally car) rules no manufacturer has to go to that massive expense or take the risk of being able to sell the thousands of production cars it would need to make to become homologated.
The whole point behind the WRC cars was to take this massive burden away, this allowed companies like Skoda and Citroen to join the party at a realistic price level.
The reason Mitsubishi has cleaned up in GroupN, which is very, very closely based on the homologation run spec of the cars is because Mitsubishi is the only manufacturer since the WRC rules came out that decided to stay with the GroupA rules, as they felt the market was there to sell the thousands of cars they have to build and still make a profit. There are also some minor technicle advantages to running a GroupA car, but i wont bore you with those.
Even Mitsubishi has now seen the light with WRC rules and has gone down that route.
The days of the rally bred supercar are over, end of story.
22 March 2001, 09:21 PM
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i thought evo7 looked much classier and aggressive than sti. the sti looked like a bad and very expensive joke.its all well and good having a quick car, but u have to like the way it looks too, surely??
23 March 2001, 09:45 AM
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John
I thankyou
Guys
I knew that and I told you so
For those of you who haven't got an Sti or Evo get one now!! Sell your Mother, your Grandmother, your wife!! you don't know what you are missing
SJD
I thankyou
Guys
I knew that and I told you so
For those of you who haven't got an Sti or Evo get one now!! Sell your Mother, your Grandmother, your wife!! you don't know what you are missing
SJD
23 March 2001, 08:34 PM
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richie
i understand what youre saying, but i for one am not a mechanic or engineer. i buy a car for lots of reasons, but a lot of that decision is based on the way a car looks.some cars are beautiful (355), some mean ( evo6/ mk 1 scooby) some elegant (a6) some pretty ( tt).
now, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and i for one really wanted the wrx to look great, coz i'd have bought one. the minute i saw one i bought a my00.
it seems that people like the new wrx for a few reasons. either they have a vested interest ( dealers/ after market mod specialists), or they have just bought one, and the looks are growing on them
or they just want to buy scoobies coz they always liked em.
each to their own i spose, but c'mon people, if nissan had brought this car out as the new shape of the skyline with worse performance, you'd ALL be slating it!
if people went on this bbs and said " yeah, i know it looks iffy but i still love it" i'd have a damn site more respect for them than people falling over themselves to agree with after market modders.
i have my flame suit on, but for what its worth, i thought the sti sounded great, but the evo looked better.
i understand what youre saying, but i for one am not a mechanic or engineer. i buy a car for lots of reasons, but a lot of that decision is based on the way a car looks.some cars are beautiful (355), some mean ( evo6/ mk 1 scooby) some elegant (a6) some pretty ( tt).
now, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and i for one really wanted the wrx to look great, coz i'd have bought one. the minute i saw one i bought a my00.
it seems that people like the new wrx for a few reasons. either they have a vested interest ( dealers/ after market mod specialists), or they have just bought one, and the looks are growing on them
or they just want to buy scoobies coz they always liked em.each to their own i spose, but c'mon people, if nissan had brought this car out as the new shape of the skyline with worse performance, you'd ALL be slating it!
if people went on this bbs and said " yeah, i know it looks iffy but i still love it" i'd have a damn site more respect for them than people falling over themselves to agree with after market modders.
i have my flame suit on, but for what its worth, i thought the sti sounded great, but the evo looked better.
