Adam M

Feel like a traitor putting this here but I really want to know the answer.

When I got my first car, I swore I alwasy aown a golf, after three I bought my impreza.

For a while I swore I would always own an impreza, fastest point to point, outright grip, size, air con, blah, blah, blah.

Now i am reconsidering my opinion.

Not cos I stopped loving the car but because its all a bit too easy. I am not a great driver, nor a particukarly fast one, but when I want to drive fast I get the feeling it is all being done for me.

So I am thinking about my next beast.

I now commute samll distances to work. I am single and only 22. No kids to transport, no luggage, no company execs to go to meetings with.

i was just wondering in my position, how many of you would consider a caterham super light r or even a 500.

The pros for me lie in the weight and engine size reducing fuel consumption significantly, it is also cheaper to insure, and a convertible.

Is this a really silly idea?

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Buy a Delfino - then you get outrageous soft-top with scoob power

Best of all worlds?

johnfelstead

they are great cars but as an everyday mode of transport, no thanks.

I love driving my westfield but if it was my only car then i would soon get sick of it.

Then again i am an old git (34)

Mike Rainbird

Adam,
You have finally seen the light (that 4wd is for girls! ). Welcome back to the man's world (as in powerful rwd cars).

What you really want is Cossie lump in a Seven replica (preferably one with more than 330bhp to shut Mr Felstead up... ).
LOL
Mike

ransj

Go for it!

I'm just finishing off one of Tiger's new lightweight R6s....not quite as expensive as a Caterham but with similar performance.

Have a look at

GCollier

Adam,

I was at MIRA last weekend doing Don Palmer's "Wetter the Better" wet handling course (top guy, top course). There were two caterhams there, and it was interesting watching them on the wet circles. Both were very twitchy, and seemed to be spinning out about once a lap all day. One of the caterhams came back from the wet handling circuit covered in grass after going off three times, once with Don at the wheel! Unfortunately there were no imprezas there to compare it against (I was in my nissan 200SX "interim" car, which even though on $hite tyres, proved to be beautifully balanced, and by the end of the day was able to do complete laps of the circles on opposite lock, without constant steering correction - I'm not blowing my own trumpet though since Don said it's a real fun car, and one of the easiest to do that in).

Anyway, I know where you are coming from when you say you are reconsidering your opinion. The nissan was meant to be a stopgap until I get a new house sorted out, then I was going to get an Evo, or maybe another scoob of some description. Since owning the RWD nissan, I may be coming to the same conclusions as you though. Whilst it may be slower than the impreza, it may well be worth sacrifing those few tenths of acceleration, and that superglue grip for something RWD and a bit "purer". Maybe something like a lotus elise or porsche 968 club sport? Anyway, arranging all these test drives later this year when the time comes is sure going to be fun

Gary.

RichB

Have you got a garage to put it in? I wouldn't get one if you haven't.

Chris L

How about a really scary option?

Westfield have just released the 'Megabusa'. They've taken the enigine from a Suzuki Hayabusa (world's fastest road bike) and put it in an lightweight Westfield body (we're talking very basic here).

So for 21 grand you get an ultra lightweight (440Kg) car - 185bhp 6-speed sequential gearbox - 0-60 in 3.5 seconds(!)

On second thoughts...maybe not everyday

Chris

GCollier

Chris,

A colleague at work very nearly bought the Westfield you describe, but with the Fireblade engine. The Suzuki engine can apparently only be supplied for track cars (some reason I don't recall why it can't be supplied for road use). He came back from the test drive totally bowled over by the car. Only the fact that Westfield couldn't supply him with a car in under about 8 weeks, when he wanted it for a 4 month tour of Europe over the Summer stopped him from buying it.

Gary.

Chris L

Gary

It appears it is now road legal (it has all the required Road Traffic Act bits and bobs (and you can just see the tax disc in one of the pictures that Car Magazine has published)) - but I think they are really intending it as a track day car. I think you would need to be slightly mad to consider this your 'everyday' transport.

Chris

GCollier

Cheers Chris.....He's left work for his 4 month tour of Europe, so it'll be a while before I can let him know.

Mad to use it as everyday transport, probably yes, but he is Greek, LOL

johnfelstead

I was very close to buying a megablade westfield before i bought my cossie powered car, it was literally one phone call away.

So why didnt i buy one and instead bought a cosworth turbo powered westfield instead?

Simple answer, torque!!

There is nothing more frustrating on the road than driving a car with bugger all torque, power doesnt come into it in the real world, its torque that counts.

I wanted the car to be a great cross country road killer and an awesome track day car.

I believe on track the 2 cars will be very close on lap times but i bet mine produces more grins/lap as it has so much more torque than grip its rediculous.

If you want to use the bike engined car on the road, you are going to have to drive it like a bike, loads of revs and bugger all torque to pull from the higher gears if you are feeling tired or lazy.

I know on some of my trips home after a full track day, where i might need to be driving for 4 hours, i would not want to be sitting in a car that is reving to 14,000 rpm just to start to get past something.

Here are some figures to back up what i am saying.

The westfield megablade has 135BHP @ 11,500rpm, 67lb/ft torque at 8,000rpm. its power/weight is 327BHP/tonne.

My westfield cosworth has 350BHP @ 6,300rpm and 340Lb/ft torque @ 3,800rpm. it's power/weight is 480BHP/tonne.

Look at the torque figures though, on the road my car will anialate a bike engined westfield, it anialtes most bikes actually. On track the bike engined car has a major weight advantage through the corners, but has no torque, so if like me you love driving a car that you can get sideways at will the bike engined car is not the way to go.

So the question has to be, what do you want from the car? If you are after a super fast cornering car for the track then the bike engined route is for you. If you want a car that has huge pace on track but is also a livable road car then the car engined route is the way to go.

The final thing that put me off a bike engined car is the lack of history they have at the moment, we dont yet know how these superlightweight bike engines cope with pulling a vehicle along that is 4 times its designed for weight. Are the blocks and gearbox's going to cope with the added loading over time? I have my doubts.

Adam M

Surely the caterham 500R superlight would be more impressive than the megabusa you describe. It has more outright horsepopwer and weighs anout the same.

Onlyu loss is 6 speed sequential. That must be worth a fair few tenths I suppose.

I am now hearing that if you sneeze in these cars it is not uncommon to change lanes and end up backwards in the wall.

ransj

John,

I think your comments are very true - you have stated some of my reservations as well.

Bike powered cars are always going to be at home on the track, as they have been for a number of years (radicals, etc.). But on the road I'm not so sure.

The twin-engined car Tiger are doing is a monster but not for the road!!

I've just been out for a quick blast in the R6, which has got a standard engine in (and still running in) and it's plenty fast enough....as its still a little damp!

John, is your Westfield a yellow one?

Simon

Gary Foster

John

Hope you don't mind I have a couple of questions,

I'm real tempted by a Westie as a second car until the MY01 is released (I watched the Mpegs you posted - that is some serious hardware you have there !).

I have their brochures but they don't mention a Cossie powered car. Did you put the engine in yourself ? was it easy ? did you buy it like it ?

And finally (sorry) why not an Seight ?, no poncing around with 4 cylinders and turbo's etc.

Gary

Chris L

Blimey John - only suggested it as an alternative

Chris

Gary Foster

Hey ! I'm not a Scooby Newbie anymore !

I feel all grown up now,

I have actually been reading this board for over a year but I don't post much, hence newbie

Gary

johnfelstead

My car is yellow nosecone and wings and deep blue body. L16 COS

My car is a very rare westfield, it is a ZEi220. It was only available as a fully built car, not in kit form, it is fully type aproved and crash tested and is classed as a production car with proper registration and not a kit car on a Q reg.

They built only 18 of these cars, mine is the most famous one as it was the factory press car and was featured in all the fast road mags and the westfield brochures. The MD of westfield ran the car as his own personal transport for 2 years so it has all the bells and whistles, it would have cost over £24,000 in the spec i bought it in when new.

You can not buy one of these now, westfield dropped the car because the engine was too expensive to buy compaired to a rover V8.

Why did i go for this rather than a SEiGHT. Very simple answer, 220BHP is bloody boring which is what the car originaly was and what most SEiGHT's are. I wanted proper power and the easiest way to get this is with a cossie turbo engine.

I know an awefull lot about the rover V8 engine, i have built a very special 5 litre with 450BHP for a race car and i know that most rover V8 power figures are total bull. Its a very expensive engine to tune up properly and needs masive internal work to get to 350BHP, never mind 400+.

It cost me less than £600 to uprate from 220BHP to 350BHP, that wont even pay for one cylinder head on a rover engine.

And gary, i dont "ponce around" with my car, the one thing it most definately isnt is a ponces car LOL

blubs

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by johnfelstead:

Why did i go for this rather than a SEiGHT. Very simple answer, 220BHP is bloody boring which is what the car originaly was and what most SEiGHT's are. [/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

John,

I have driven a SEiGHT and can say they are many things. Boring? Sorry mate, can't agree with you there. I know I only drive a standard MY00 but it felt anything other than boring

Jeez, that car of yours must really fly

gregh

BTW John do you drive to track events or trailer the Westie?

Greg

Gary Foster

John

Thanks for that. Doesn't look like I'll be writing a fat cheque to Westfield any time soon then I have seen a couple of ZEi s for sale in Autotrader, I didn't realise that was a proper designation and that they were so rare !.

OK, I guess it's not so poncy (says the man currently driving a 115hp BMW Compact !, honestly, how much respect can I lose in just one post)

I'm still tempted. I guess it's just the standard SEi chassis then, nothing horribly different (expensive) from the normal cars.

Right I'm straight of too Autotrader too look.

Gary

johnfelstead

There were 2 ZEi models sold, the 180 and the 220. The 180 has a ford zetec 1800 N/A engine and is pretty untunable, with only 130BHP. The 220 has an escort cosworth engine and was 227BHP in standard trim.

The chasis on the 220 is very similar to the SEiGHT and uses the same suspension components and weighs the same.

The biggest diference is the body panels which are unique to the ZEi series. To allow the car to meet type aproval laws the body had to be modified and features fully enclosed front bodywork and crash safe mirors. etc.

It is the only westfield that was allowed to be sold into mainland europe as a production car and to this day is the only westfield i could sell to someone in europe for them to use on the road without any aproval problems.

It has silly little things like heater ducts to the front windscrean (almost unheard of) and has small flaps in the sidescreens that allow you to pay at toll booths without getting out of the car with the hood up. Both requirements for european type aproval.

There are a few SEi Wides out there with cossie turbo engines installed, one or 2 are OK but most are death traps acording to people i have spoken too.

I have never seen one myself and dont see why anyone couldnt do as good a job as the factory, i know i could and have made my car much better than it was when i bought it.

The SEiGHT is a fantastic car and is much easier to find than a cossie turbo car, i just wanted something that was a bit mental and seem to have that now acording to the reaction i get from passengers.

Surprisingly, i have become used to the power quite quickly and might uprate it to 420BHP, then again i am a bit nuts. LOL

I dont trailer the car to track days, i drive it. Thats one of the reasons why i didnt fancy the bike engined car in the end.

Just to finaly rub it in, the car costs me £380/year to insure fully comp on an agreed value and includes fully comp track cover for unlimited track days.