Caterham or Westfield anyone ?
23 August 2001, 10:23 PM
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OK - the P1 has long gone 
but in the next 6 months or so I want to get myself a track car..... that is relatively cheap to maintain etc....
Looked at a few Caterham's today - and for circa £10K it appears you can get a decent (used) track car with all the thrills etc....
Any ideas on the differences between Westfields ???? Which are better ??? Anyone driven the two etc ?
Does anyone think that its a decent idea
Cheers,
Gastro
but in the next 6 months or so I want to get myself a track car..... that is relatively cheap to maintain etc....Looked at a few Caterham's today - and for circa £10K it appears you can get a decent (used) track car with all the thrills etc....
Any ideas on the differences between Westfields ???? Which are better ??? Anyone driven the two etc ?
Does anyone think that its a decent idea
Cheers,
Gastro
24 August 2001, 08:31 AM
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Drove a Westy Blackbird on track last week.
Staggering bit of kit. Sequential gear change, 11,000 rpm and handled incredibly (was on cut slicks). I had thought it would be very twitchy, but weighing in at 410kg, 100 mph drifts were smooth and progressive.
It was about a second a lap slower than an R500 and about the same as a Westy Megabusa, all of which were in a different time zone to the rest of the field.
It left the twin engined Tiger for dead, except on anything resembling a straight.
Truly amazing car.
Owner bought it for 14k.
Staggering bit of kit. Sequential gear change, 11,000 rpm and handled incredibly (was on cut slicks). I had thought it would be very twitchy, but weighing in at 410kg, 100 mph drifts were smooth and progressive.
It was about a second a lap slower than an R500 and about the same as a Westy Megabusa, all of which were in a different time zone to the rest of the field.
It left the twin engined Tiger for dead, except on anything resembling a straight.
Truly amazing car.
Owner bought it for 14k.
24 August 2001, 08:41 AM
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Hello Pete, John, Gary, Gastro!
I am seriously tempted, probably late next year, to buy a bike engine derived westie. Not keen on taking Scoob on track, (mine would probably fall apart on the first corner
and I cannot really afford it.
However, a "proper" track car...... Mmmmmm!
Mossman
I am seriously tempted, probably late next year, to buy a bike engine derived westie. Not keen on taking Scoob on track, (mine would probably fall apart on the first corner
and I cannot really afford it.However, a "proper" track car...... Mmmmmm!
Mossman
24 August 2001, 08:43 AM
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Used to own a Westie sold it when my daughter was born; had to by a nice slow practical estate car (Scooby 5dr)
If I was to buy another as a weekend car it would have to be the Megabusa.
If I was to buy another as a weekend car it would have to be the Megabusa.
24 August 2001, 09:31 AM
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John - hate to mention 'over selling' but I've seen ZEi220s going for around £12k - but have they got the pedigreee?
Used (and only slightly at that - not a year old) bike engined Westies can be found for around £10k - check out
Used (and only slightly at that - not a year old) bike engined Westies can be found for around £10k - check out
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24 August 2001, 09:50 AM
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Bike engined cars are all the rage at the moment but don't forget there are lots of other interesting options out there.
Earlier this year I bought a Caterham with a 2.0 litre Vauxhall 16v lump with hot cams and 45 Webers. Probably develops about 210 bhp and it is quick
It's also got all the nice track bits - adjustable roll bars, quick rack, straight cut box, sticky Yoko tyres, full cage and harnesses, etc. Is a 97 car, cost £28k new when Doug Newman built it, has done 10,000 miles and all bought for £13k.
I haven't enjoyed driving so much for years....
Earlier this year I bought a Caterham with a 2.0 litre Vauxhall 16v lump with hot cams and 45 Webers. Probably develops about 210 bhp and it is quick
It's also got all the nice track bits - adjustable roll bars, quick rack, straight cut box, sticky Yoko tyres, full cage and harnesses, etc. Is a 97 car, cost £28k new when Doug Newman built it, has done 10,000 miles and all bought for £13k.
I haven't enjoyed driving so much for years....
24 August 2001, 10:05 AM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by johnfelstead:
<B>they are all great. westies are better value for money IMHO.
offer me 17K and you can have mine. LOL[/quote]
That's 5K for the car, and 12K for the warranty
<B>they are all great. westies are better value for money IMHO.
offer me 17K and you can have mine.
LOL[/quote]That's 5K for the car, and 12K for the warranty
24 August 2001, 11:07 AM
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I have to say I love the idea of this sort of car, the memory of a quick country lane blast in an old Westfield still sticks with me.
My only concern is safety. How much protection have you got if you "kiss" the tyre wall? How does a tubular chassis compare to a monocoque like the scoob?
I've recently been reading about the Dax Rush, with a turbo'd bike engine. They are quoting power to weight at around 800 bhp/per ton! Could you trust yourself?
dela
My only concern is safety. How much protection have you got if you "kiss" the tyre wall? How does a tubular chassis compare to a monocoque like the scoob?
I've recently been reading about the Dax Rush, with a turbo'd bike engine. They are quoting power to weight at around 800 bhp/per ton!
Could you trust yourself?dela
24 August 2001, 02:05 PM
#11
I bought my ZEi220 for £12.5K 18 months ago.
Believe me, it is not the same car now by a long way! £17K is an absolute bargain for the spec it now runs.
Standard ZEi220's, and for that matter 95% of westies are not serious track cars. I could bore you for hours on the things i have changed to make it as quick (and track safe) as it now is.
I wouldn't sell it unless i got the right money for what is the fastest A-B westfield road car (that is balistic on track) in the country.
As to the bike engined cars, just give it another 12 months and you are going to see a huge amount of bad press about these cars.
People are being sold these cars as though they are as reliable as the car engined versions. They wont be. Clutches are going to become as expendable as brake pads. Gearboxes will last 3-5K miles on track tops. If i am wrong, brilliant! I wont be though. Just use your brain and look at the physics of it all. you have 4 times the grip of a bike easily, you have 3 times the weight easily, you are putting this through a 4" clutch and tiny gearbox. [scots accent] It isnt going to take it captain.[/scots accent]
I havent come accross a bike engined car on track yet that can come close to my ZEi220. When i first bought the car and its spec wasnt so hot i could just about match an R500 caterham. I was at Rockingham the other week and 2 R500's were on track there, i stuffed them big style on a track that is both very fast in places and very tight and twisty in others. As to the bike engined cars, stuffed those even more.
An R500 will cost you over £32K.
The only thing i want to change now on the car is a chargecooler kit so i can run full boost on track as right now i wind that back to about 1.2BAR. On the road its back up to 1.7BAR. I have a friend with a ZEi220 who has just had a very nice chargecooler system made by PACE to his own design, waiting for the test results from that. If it works as i think it will god help the R500, 1.7BAR on track will be pretty mindblowing.
As to the Dax 4x4. 0-60 times from that should be faster than mine, simple physics re grip from a standing start. Put it on track and my car will stuff it big style. The Dax is 100Kg heavier than mine in 2wd form, must be 150Kg more in 4x4 form i would think. It wont have the handling balance and it certainly wont be as much fun to drive. Big power RWD is huge fun.
Believe me, it is not the same car now by a long way! £17K is an absolute bargain for the spec it now runs.
Standard ZEi220's, and for that matter 95% of westies are not serious track cars. I could bore you for hours on the things i have changed to make it as quick (and track safe) as it now is.
I wouldn't sell it unless i got the right money for what is the fastest A-B westfield road car (that is balistic on track) in the country.
As to the bike engined cars, just give it another 12 months and you are going to see a huge amount of bad press about these cars.
People are being sold these cars as though they are as reliable as the car engined versions. They wont be. Clutches are going to become as expendable as brake pads. Gearboxes will last 3-5K miles on track tops. If i am wrong, brilliant! I wont be though. Just use your brain and look at the physics of it all. you have 4 times the grip of a bike easily, you have 3 times the weight easily, you are putting this through a 4" clutch and tiny gearbox. [scots accent] It isnt going to take it captain.[/scots accent]
I havent come accross a bike engined car on track yet that can come close to my ZEi220. When i first bought the car and its spec wasnt so hot i could just about match an R500 caterham. I was at Rockingham the other week and 2 R500's were on track there, i stuffed them big style on a track that is both very fast in places and very tight and twisty in others. As to the bike engined cars, stuffed those even more.
An R500 will cost you over £32K.
The only thing i want to change now on the car is a chargecooler kit so i can run full boost on track as right now i wind that back to about 1.2BAR. On the road its back up to 1.7BAR. I have a friend with a ZEi220 who has just had a very nice chargecooler system made by PACE to his own design, waiting for the test results from that. If it works as i think it will god help the R500, 1.7BAR on track will be pretty mindblowing.
As to the Dax 4x4. 0-60 times from that should be faster than mine, simple physics re grip from a standing start. Put it on track and my car will stuff it big style. The Dax is 100Kg heavier than mine in 2wd form, must be 150Kg more in 4x4 form i would think. It wont have the handling balance and it certainly wont be as much fun to drive. Big power RWD is huge fun.
24 August 2001, 04:00 PM
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john,
just watched your video (with the R1)...excellent stuff
Tiggs
Ps- spot on about the bike engines, i looked at a megablade when they were launched and got put off when i thought how long a blade would last if you did your trackdays with a pillion and 3 mates in a trailer behind you
just watched your video (with the R1)...excellent stuff
Tiggs
Ps- spot on about the bike engines, i looked at a megablade when they were launched and got put off when i thought how long a blade would last if you did your trackdays with a pillion and 3 mates in a trailer behind you
24 August 2001, 05:55 PM
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John - Didn't mean to wind you up - I've seen the video / Read the book (The WSCC Boardroom thread on your trip to the Ring) - all I need now is the T-shirt that proclaims "Felstead's Westie Fan Club"
Dela - I can vouch for the strength of a Westie - as I 'kissed a tyre wall' last week at 3 sisters (Wet tracks and Westies make for interesting times) - got the braking point wrong & went straight on at the bottom of Cowards
through the tyre wall, braking from about 80 mph, hitting the wall head on at about 20-30 mph - all I did was scatter about 5 or 6 tyre bails, and crack a bit of fibreglass on the nose & wings - the chassis never got touched, and I was unscathed, and back on track a while later after thoroughly checking the car, and replacing a couple of fastner rivets that had popped. Another guy had a similar 'off' a bit later that day - again hitting the tyres - he came off only slightly worse than me - with no personal damage, but had a crack in his radiator, which he gave up with
Cheers
Steve
- I've seen the video / Read the book (The WSCC Boardroom thread on your trip to the Ring) - all I need now is the T-shirt that proclaims "Felstead's Westie Fan Club" Dela - I can vouch for the strength of a Westie - as I 'kissed a tyre wall' last week at 3 sisters (Wet tracks and Westies make for interesting times) - got the braking point wrong & went straight on at the bottom of Cowards
through the tyre wall, braking from about 80 mph, hitting the wall head on at about 20-30 mph - all I did was scatter about 5 or 6 tyre bails, and crack a bit of fibreglass on the nose & wings - the chassis never got touched, and I was unscathed, and back on track a while later after thoroughly checking the car, and replacing a couple of fastner rivets that had popped. Another guy had a similar 'off' a bit later that day - again hitting the tyres - he came off only slightly worse than me - with no personal damage, but had a crack in his radiator, which he gave up with Cheers
Steve
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