gregh

Seriously wondering wether using my Scoob on track is really worth it in the long term.
Wondering wether I should get a track day car.

What kind of options have I got? I see Caterhams, Elises and Westfields at alot of track days.
What's the minimum you could spend on something like this to get one you could take on track days, and drive there and back?

Would want something reasonably quick :^)

I'm assuming insurance, petrol, tyres, brakes etc are all loads cheaper than the Subaru!

Do you need to be mechanically aware to own a Caterham/Westie?

Does anyone know of any BBS's for the above cars?

cheers,

greg

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Greg

1 thing to remember is that you go onto the SIDC "B" list if you change from a scoob - that means trackdays may cost more & be with all sorts of strange peoples

gregh

pls don't open up that can of worms again Puff

jamesa

Greg,

Whatever you get it`s not that cheap !

I use a modified Mk1 Golf for the road; track; sprint and hillclimbs. Consumeables and mods are obviously less than a Subaru whilst road insurance is 400 quid with ALL mods. declared. Granted, it is not that quick in a straight line ( yet ! ) but it`s superb everywhere else - a real challenge.

I would not use our Subaru on the track - too much to insure / lose. Competition cover for the Golf is cheap but that`s not for a total loss.

The competition aspect makes up for the lack of ultimate speed - especially on road tyres !

Cheers

ChrisB

Greg,

I spent some time a few months ago pricing up a 205 GTI with roll cage, seats etc as a dedicated track car.

I have some figures in Excel if you are interested.

ChrisB.

Markus

Guess you could always go for a scoob purley for trackdays, maybe one of the 94 imports, but you're probably still looking at maybe 4 -7 thousand.

Personally, I'd love to get a another car and turn the blackbeast into a track only car, but I don't think that's going to happen any time soon.

EVO mag had a think about trackday cars the other month, think they mentioned 2.8i capri's, old style M5's and something else, not sure what though (caterham/westie?)

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Alright Greg.

Seriously tho', an old yock is a cheap alternative. Been to spectate at a couple of Bookatrack days & on both times there have been people with cheap cars.

1st was a LHD 323i that chap had bought for £50. He did Brands on the Friday & Bentwater on the Sunday. Didn't need to worry about insurance or ought. Was showing some of the people a thing or two about driving. 2nd was something like a Mk1 Golf GTi.

The idea about a small car, a rollcage & go for it sounds quite good.

Still prefer PTMW!

MorayMackenzie

The BMW E30 M3 is an awesome track car.

Markus,

Are you sure you aren't thinking of the Evo article on cars to Powerslide? That was a set of front engine, rear drive cars that would be good for learning how to powerslide... The likely suspects were Ford Capri 2.8, Mazda MX5, BMW M5 (mmmmmm) and the Toyota Supra Twin Turbo.

Moray

GEJL

You could probably pick up one of the Caterham Academy cars (from their novice race series) for around £7000. That would be fully track ready; rollcage, cut-off switch, extinguisher, harness etc. Try and get one that had not been crashed...! The Vauxhall engined ones are less likely to go pop than a Ford engined one.

100bhp, 525kg, 0-60 around 6s. And faster round the twisties than most other stuff, even on cheap tyres.

I ran one of the early Ford ones in 96, and on the twisty sprints and hillclimbs it would regularly beat Integrales, Ferraris, TVRs etc.

And I used to insure mine on a classic limited mileage policy (comprehensive) for £250ish.

You don't need to be particularly mechanically aware - they are very simple - but if you want to get into it, they have adjustable dampers, you can change the anti-roll bar, suspension geometry etc. pretty easily.

A stripped out hot hatch appeals too, but I just like rear-wheel drive and powerslides...

GEJL

Oh, forgot to mention. You won't save on petrol. Best I ever got was 18mpg on the road. More like 5 to 8mpg on track, and on a good day it would spit petrol from the Webers onto the windscreen. Now that was real motoring...

Type R

When i bought my car (Civic Type R), i chose it as a good compromise between trackdays and driving everyday.

Its cheap on Tyres (15"), Brakes last forever (Discs 14 months 14,000 miles including 8 Trackdays) Pads 6 months or 6000 miles including 3 Trackdays). Its quick, fun, and reasonable fuel economy on and off track. I invested straight away in 2nd set of wheels (Part worns or slick tyres), and took all unecessary stuff out of car, change the oil and filter every 3000 miles.

Bonus is the engine is bullet proof, so far.

I am very happy, and use my car everyday.

Although if i had the extra cash, i would buy a Westie or Cat.

I reckon all in, 1 Trackday proberly costs me about £300 a time, which is a lot for me, but a Scoob or Evo i imagine will be a lot more.

Best advice would be pick something up for 5k, and spend the rest on Trackdays, and modifying etc.

Its one major expensive hobby.

Matt

Stig

Well, I bought a 2.0 EFi Maestro for 80 quid, bought a pair of old Recaro's and Willans harnesses and drove it on a trackday to keep pace with my racing Seven until it went bang.

Except it didn't! It just kept going and going.

Without doubt the worst handling car ever with terminal and I mean TERMINAL understeer. Well, it did have a pair of Korean Bakelite tyres on it

You see, you'll be MUCH faster in something you don't give a toss about. I had a 5 litre TVR Griffith and that was mental on track but you always had the nagging voice in your head saying 'if you stuff this, you're GONNA PAY!!!!!' In the Maestro - hell, who gives a toss

So get an old banger, more smiles per mile than anything out there. When it blows, just take the seats/harnesses out and put them in something else.

btw. I left it standing for 3 months then went to start it. It promptly caught fire and destroyed the ECU - ho hum.

jon hill

similar story to type-r

I live in central london & have one garage - therefore only one car. I bought the integra as a comprimise for road and track - 15" rims mean tyres are cheap (£70 for A539's), under 1100 kgs means that mintex 1177 last for ever, etc, etc.

But - as i'm looking at moving out, my choice would be a cat 7 1.8 supersport (or a roadsport 205 if i finally go racing) and then something like a £5K volvo v70 to tow it and my bikes to the track.

jon

Stig

Forgot to say, a good alternative is also to buy a half decent Seven kit car. You'll pay a fraction of the price for a non-Caterham/Westfield and it'll be pretty damn similar on the track.

Olly

Why not just do the real thing? A decent RAC log booked rally or race car with spares could easily be had for Caterham money. Obtain a National B licence (20 something quid), a decent helmet and overalls (probably mandatory for track days anyway) and go compete.

Not sure if it still runs, but the Slick 50 racing championship used to contain a mixed bag of Rover V8's, two-eight Capri's, Golfs and Peugeots, XR2's, 6 pot BM's etc. All had to be prepared (caged, extinguishers, seats and the like) but road legal and driven to the circuits.

Or get out on the brown stuff with a cheap rally car? Don't get me going...

If a dedicated track car day is your thing, look in Motoring News or the classifieds in CCC: there are usually plenty of ex race Caterhams, or sorted ex challenge Fiestas, Clio's, 5 Turbo's, that sort of thing, for no money. Don't even consider building one, unless you want the next owner to benefit from all your hard work and bucketfulls of cash.

If I had to choose a trackday car, a stripped out Rover Vitesse V8 (think of the noise!!) would do nicely, a sorted two-eight Capri with a Turbo Technics kit and an LSD should go well, or a screamer of a Honda Civic VTEC maybe?

Dream Weaver

I am seriously considering a track day car once I am back on my feet with the job thing.

My plan is to buy probably an E-Reg 205 1.9 GTi for circa £600. Garage it, strip it, overhaul engine, race seats, modified head, cams etc (maybe even Turbo) and so on.

I will trailor it to events so no need to worry about insurance, tax, MOT etc. Should cost sod all to use.

DW

Dream Weaver

Greg

A link for you:

Dream Weaver

And another:

Gary Foster

This all sounds hauntingly familiar.

After calculating the real cost of running the Impreza on track (nearly a grand per track day) I sold it and bought a diesel tow car and a track / weekend car.

My Fisher Fury cost £5K and has a Fireblade engine, apparently it does 4.1s to 60. I am expecting it to be a lot cheaper to run on track, weighing just 450 - 500Kg, 13" Wheels and Mk2 escort pads.

And it was a lot (min 5K) cheaper than the equivalent but far more fashionable Westfield or Caterham.

You have to be a bit handy though, mines already broken a couple of times and the finish is questionable.

Gary

GaryC

Greg I'm going through the same thing at the moment.

I loved taking my Impreza on track, but it isn't a track car. I loved using it on the road, but 95% of the time it is just a very compromised road car, so..

I swapped the Scoob for a 330d and am in the process of looking at a track/sunday afternoon car. (The savings from the 330d compared to the Scoob will alomst pay for the track car by the new year )

I'm looking ay a pure track/sports car - not interested in bargain basement old hot hatches (no offense to anyone who is ) and have narrowed it down to a Caterham. Have driven a number over the past three years or so and they still remain THE most fun car I have driven (above Ferraris/E30 M3s/968CS/911RS/TVR/etc..... )

Did consider Westfields or the new Omatic, but those in the know have advised me that what you gain in marginally cheaper price, you lose in dynamics and quality (Fibreglass Vs Aluminium etc). Caterham have the history and 'pedigree' so (for me) Caterham it is.

2nd hand they can be had from £8/9k, but to get a decent one that you won't want to change after 18 months you need £14-17k for a 2nd hand Superlight - but that will be it and then its fun fun fun (and over 300bhp/tonne )

LEE P

Hi m8, think i would go for a scoob, great every day car and catch lot of people out when you get to the track, done a few days in mine a MY2000 which i got last oct, but bought sum P1 alloys and used old ones for track, they have p zeros on which are lsting quite well, went to croft and did 6 20min sessions which was 100 miles, it went in for its 22500 service and brakes still in tact, pedl does have abit more travel mind, ut after that mileage in 10 month you would expect it. if i had listened to all the horror stories bout track days trashing your car to bits i would of missed out on loads of fun. you can get insurance from competition car ins. strting at £42.50 for 2000 grand of cover with 250 excess if u have a slight knock, 80 squid gets u 5000 of cover, get a scoob and have some fun! LEE.

astraboy

Buy a cossie. a used Saph can be had for 3500 these days. Strip it out and then go have some fun. more **** out antics than you could ever hope for.
astraboy.

Markus

Moray,
You are quite correct, it was the powerslide article and NOT the trackday one. Sorry about that chaps, minor brain failure (as if you could actually tell )

carl

Why does no-one consider an old Formula Ford car? You can pick them up for about 5k (back of Autosport).

gregh

>> Why does no-one consider an old Formula Ford car?

For me I want to drive it on public roads, so that discounts an old FF

greg

druddle

surely john felstead is the man to talk to about westfields/caterhams ???

Spec

Small and cheap? - a Mini.
You can do loads of mods for not much dosh, and the handling on a trackday car can be made razor sharp. You've got nothing to lose, if you're slower than everyone else 'its just a Mini!. Power to weight is the key.
Yes I know I'm biased but thats allowed innit?

Ed Hodgson

I've been looking at the same things recently - after going off backwards onto the grass in my B4 at Cadwell. That's my work car - can't afford to be without it, & is expensive to fix if it breaks.

It really depends on whether you think a cheap track car is £500 or £5000

Obviously Westfield/Caterham is a good bet - a few of my friends are building/thinking of building. - MK Locost looks about the cheapest way into this sort of car, but does demand a fair bit of mechanical aptitude

Cheap hot hatches appeal, but are FWD which maybe not such a good thing. The cheap ones tend to be cheap for a reason...

A few mentions of capris...I've spent £500 on an old XR4i (same 2.8 engine) which had been raced in a Toyo challenge series - so has cage, bucket seat/harness, race spec suspension, braided hoses (+ modified engine I suspect although don't know exactly what). The bits are worth more than the car, so even if it does get trashed, I still walk away without losing too much. Ford parts much cheaper than Subaru. I also learn to drive on a track at less insane speeds than a Scooby

it's road legal but a bit of a handful on the road - first outing at Bedford on Aug 14th - I know it's only a few laps, but it'll be the first chance I get to test it

needs a bit of remedial work - mainly servicing - no brake fluid in the brakes, only air at present

Anyone going to the Bedford day - I'll be the white Sierra going off backwards

Lee

A big point is being missed here.

It isn't about buying a car to drive on track - its purely the fact that through the SIDC and other ventures Subaru owners can experience a trackday with their car.

As soon as you prioritise trackdays you notice that the scoob is not the best choice.

chuckster

Excellent Trigger. I am looking at Tiger too. They co-produce the Z100 - twin 900 ninja engines (0-60 in 3.11 seconds), super nice! Tommorow I shall be mostly going to either Caterham, Dax or both to get a test drive. But to be honest the Tiger B6 looks just the ticket for me, cheap and cheerfull
Chuck