6spd Sti Gearbox refurb who would you trust?
15 December 2019, 03:04 PM
#1
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
6spd Sti Gearbox refurb who would you trust?
Here’s a story of an experience I had recently when my local Scooby guyt who has been outstanding in getting this dealt with, had to deal with a very popular company that among other things is known for doing good work on Subaru gearboxes, I didn’t get involved with them directly as I didn’t want to upset the Subaru guys relationship with the gearbox people, and based on the tone of their responses to his questions I still have not spoken to them, as I do not believe they deserve that courtesy. I have not decided if I will say who they are but please read on…..
I had been having increasing noise issues with a 6 spd Sti box that I had put in my 04 WRX PPP a couple of years back. I have owned the car for 15 years (125K on it now) and do not want to part with it so I had decided to embark on a full refurb process of the whole car in a short a time as possible, rather than getting the odd bit fixed every few years and never really enjoying the car in a relatively fault free condition.
I decided that the 6spd had to be sorted first because if that turned out to be totally shot I didn’t want to get another supposed “no wines, no crunches drives as it should” second hand box that would probably end up having issues in a short time, and so would consider jacking the whole car in if it was shot.
So my local Subaru guy whipped the box out and shipped it off for a strip down and refurb at the gearbox experts, I was quite pleased at the time because the company chosen was one who I had only heard good things about on the web. The reported issues at the strip down were the usual baulk rings, a couple of selector forks and some bearings, the cost of which was I thought quite reasonable and was better than the bad news I was dreading when they stripped it.
So three weeks later the box was back in my car but despite all the old noises being fixed there was now a new, even louder noise, which was totally dependent on vehicle speed, clutch in or out etc made no difference. The sound from underneath was clearly at the front of the box and was a swishing whining noise that would get louder/higher pitched as the car got faster.
Unfortunately the box expert convinced us to try an oil they recommended in the box first, and run that, but that did not help. The oil that came out of the freshly rebuilt box was a rusty brown and clearly not as it should be. When asked about what we found the experts just said the “box was filthy inside when they received it”, which is a strange response as they had just been paid to refurbish the box so how was it still so filthy when we got it back!? This type of response was characteristic of their attitude. It became clear why that oil was rust coloured this week.
So over the last few weeks the box finally came back out, still making the new noise created by the ‘refurb’. The Subaru guy who was as peed off about all this as me so he actually drove the box to the box company (a 500 mile round trip) and insisted they strip it in front of him. Their findings were a worn/corroded spigot bearing on the shaft that goes to the front diff, apparently they said “due to moisture ingress”!
So how does a bearing buried in the middle of the box suffer from moisture ingress but not the rest of the gearbox? I would be interested to hear any theories on that one from you guys on Scoobynet. Bear in mind as I said this noise was not present in the first place when they were originally sent the box. One possible answer we thought of is that along with the rest of the box innards the spigot bearing went in a parts washer but was not properly dried. This then sat rusting for a few days until it got back into my car and oil was added to the box (the box is shipped without oil to prevent spillage I believe), and the car fired up. Hey presto I had a noisy bearing and after just two hundred miles on a refreshed box horrible rust coloured oil came out.
During this time the box expert was totally unapologetic, they claimed they do not normally accept boxes for refurb without a pre diagnosed fault, and other such guff. But how could we tell them in advance about a noise they had not yet introduced into the box yet? It simply says they offer a gearbox rebuild service on their website and not that the customer has to diagnose the exact fault for them to fix it! Yet another example of their customer car.
Even when they got the box back they accepted no responsibility for their poor service, even though it was clearly an error in the work they had done which caused the bearing to become noisy so suddenly. They insisted on being paid for replacing the bearing, which if it had been included in the original work (if it had actually been necessary at that point!) would probably only have added about £200 max to the bill as the box was already in bits.
So this has now cost me a further £700, and the Subaru guy is out of pocket because he spent two days trailing up and down the country for which he did not charge me (add up two full days lost labour and a night in a hotel and make a guess at what that cost him), because their poor response via phone and emails meant he insisted on seeing them face to face and watch them strip the box down because they were clearly not accepting any responsibility, and had an attitude that sounded like, how dare you question us we are the experts!
At the moment the gearbox seams fine on the second attempt, although I may have the oil changed again next time it is in the garage for the next stage of the overhaul just to be on the safe side incase there is still any crap in there. Unsurprisingly my Subaru guy is now looking for another company to do any gearbox work in future.
Do you think a company doing so many Subaru boxes should have some method of spinning a box at a normal operational RPM before they ship it to confirm there are no bugs? It would appear they don’t.
Any guesses who it might be? By guess I don’t mean name any gear box expert until I say yes it was them, just one you know has given this kind of service.
As I said I have not decided if I will say who it is but I would appreciate some comments on the above to help me arrive at that decision.
Ian
I had been having increasing noise issues with a 6 spd Sti box that I had put in my 04 WRX PPP a couple of years back. I have owned the car for 15 years (125K on it now) and do not want to part with it so I had decided to embark on a full refurb process of the whole car in a short a time as possible, rather than getting the odd bit fixed every few years and never really enjoying the car in a relatively fault free condition.
I decided that the 6spd had to be sorted first because if that turned out to be totally shot I didn’t want to get another supposed “no wines, no crunches drives as it should” second hand box that would probably end up having issues in a short time, and so would consider jacking the whole car in if it was shot.
So my local Subaru guy whipped the box out and shipped it off for a strip down and refurb at the gearbox experts, I was quite pleased at the time because the company chosen was one who I had only heard good things about on the web. The reported issues at the strip down were the usual baulk rings, a couple of selector forks and some bearings, the cost of which was I thought quite reasonable and was better than the bad news I was dreading when they stripped it.
So three weeks later the box was back in my car but despite all the old noises being fixed there was now a new, even louder noise, which was totally dependent on vehicle speed, clutch in or out etc made no difference. The sound from underneath was clearly at the front of the box and was a swishing whining noise that would get louder/higher pitched as the car got faster.
Unfortunately the box expert convinced us to try an oil they recommended in the box first, and run that, but that did not help. The oil that came out of the freshly rebuilt box was a rusty brown and clearly not as it should be. When asked about what we found the experts just said the “box was filthy inside when they received it”, which is a strange response as they had just been paid to refurbish the box so how was it still so filthy when we got it back!? This type of response was characteristic of their attitude. It became clear why that oil was rust coloured this week.
So over the last few weeks the box finally came back out, still making the new noise created by the ‘refurb’. The Subaru guy who was as peed off about all this as me so he actually drove the box to the box company (a 500 mile round trip) and insisted they strip it in front of him. Their findings were a worn/corroded spigot bearing on the shaft that goes to the front diff, apparently they said “due to moisture ingress”!
So how does a bearing buried in the middle of the box suffer from moisture ingress but not the rest of the gearbox? I would be interested to hear any theories on that one from you guys on Scoobynet. Bear in mind as I said this noise was not present in the first place when they were originally sent the box. One possible answer we thought of is that along with the rest of the box innards the spigot bearing went in a parts washer but was not properly dried. This then sat rusting for a few days until it got back into my car and oil was added to the box (the box is shipped without oil to prevent spillage I believe), and the car fired up. Hey presto I had a noisy bearing and after just two hundred miles on a refreshed box horrible rust coloured oil came out.
During this time the box expert was totally unapologetic, they claimed they do not normally accept boxes for refurb without a pre diagnosed fault, and other such guff. But how could we tell them in advance about a noise they had not yet introduced into the box yet? It simply says they offer a gearbox rebuild service on their website and not that the customer has to diagnose the exact fault for them to fix it! Yet another example of their customer car.
Even when they got the box back they accepted no responsibility for their poor service, even though it was clearly an error in the work they had done which caused the bearing to become noisy so suddenly. They insisted on being paid for replacing the bearing, which if it had been included in the original work (if it had actually been necessary at that point!) would probably only have added about £200 max to the bill as the box was already in bits.
So this has now cost me a further £700, and the Subaru guy is out of pocket because he spent two days trailing up and down the country for which he did not charge me (add up two full days lost labour and a night in a hotel and make a guess at what that cost him), because their poor response via phone and emails meant he insisted on seeing them face to face and watch them strip the box down because they were clearly not accepting any responsibility, and had an attitude that sounded like, how dare you question us we are the experts!
At the moment the gearbox seams fine on the second attempt, although I may have the oil changed again next time it is in the garage for the next stage of the overhaul just to be on the safe side incase there is still any crap in there. Unsurprisingly my Subaru guy is now looking for another company to do any gearbox work in future.
Do you think a company doing so many Subaru boxes should have some method of spinning a box at a normal operational RPM before they ship it to confirm there are no bugs? It would appear they don’t.
Any guesses who it might be? By guess I don’t mean name any gear box expert until I say yes it was them, just one you know has given this kind of service.
As I said I have not decided if I will say who it is but I would appreciate some comments on the above to help me arrive at that decision.
Ian
15 December 2019, 03:40 PM
#3
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Hi SJ
I just wanted to get peoples thoughts on the technical side of it before I did that. Incase somebody has a plausible suggestion about how this might not be their fault. I don't want to accuse anyone if there is a good chance they were not at fault
cheers
Ian
I just wanted to get peoples thoughts on the technical side of it before I did that. Incase somebody has a plausible suggestion about how this might not be their fault. I don't want to accuse anyone if there is a good chance they were not at fault
cheers
Ian
15 December 2019, 03:46 PM
#4
...its a tough one really but i know that if i paid for a gearbox to be rebuilt looked at and the company that done the work sent it back to me and said all work has been done it should be 100% reliable and in full working condition it’s as simple as that really,any less then that and they would have to answer to me.SJ.
15 December 2019, 03:57 PM
#5
Arfer why did you not use a gearbox builder recommended from Scoobynet i.e...Alyn ASPerformance who rebuilt my wife’s 6 speed a few years ago and it has never missed a beat not even once no strange noises just perfect as Subaru intended it to be.SJ.
.SJ.
Trending Topics
15 December 2019, 07:28 PM
#9
Scooby Regular
16 December 2019, 06:00 AM
#11
Its a shame that some mainly very good companies feel that the customer has a sense of over entitlement and cant just knuckle down and get the job done . your spanner guy is a good man for sure.
16 December 2019, 06:20 AM
#12
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
We believe it is my box, at least externally it is, clearly it is not possible to confirm that all the non new bits that went back into the box on its first visit there were all mine. I suppose another theory could be that on the first visit someone else's knackered spigot bearing ended up in my box but who knows.
ian
ian
16 December 2019, 09:28 AM
#13
Scooby Regular
where ever he ended up it certainly wasn't around the Durham / Newcastle area!!!
16 December 2019, 09:41 AM
#14
I've a feeling I know where you are referring to and if it is I'm surprised by the service you've received as these people have a very good name Subaru/Motorsport.
Christ Alyn, is there anything you dont do?
Handy to know that, wish i'd known before or i'd have sent you my old six speed.
Christ Alyn, is there anything you dont do?
Handy to know that, wish i'd known before or i'd have sent you my old six speed.
16 December 2019, 11:14 AM
#15
I would recommend using Scoobyclinic, Mark the Engine and Gearbox builder is a expert.
Alyn at AS Performance is very helpful and honest and I would also recommend him.
In my last job I worked as a Technician at a Main Dealer for ten years. I have seen Technicians and Master Technicians miss diagnosis faults and make mistakes.
It can happen to anyone, It seems your gearbox expert is not wanting to own up to there mistake.
Alyn at AS Performance is very helpful and honest and I would also recommend him.
In my last job I worked as a Technician at a Main Dealer for ten years. I have seen Technicians and Master Technicians miss diagnosis faults and make mistakes.
It can happen to anyone, It seems your gearbox expert is not wanting to own up to there mistake.
16 December 2019, 03:20 PM
#16
Scooby Regular
Following as I was thinking of giving my box a refresh next year.
16 December 2019, 04:40 PM
#17
Scooby Regular
Name and shame so no one else get treated the way you have
The following 3 users liked this post by Russell38:
The following users liked this post:
16 December 2019, 07:35 PM
#19
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
Hi all
so apologies but after speaking with work colleagues I have been put off naming the company as I don't want the hassle of any repercussions as I have enough going on at the moment.
However I will say that nobody actually named them above so if you are looking to have some gearbox work all the above recommendations are probably trustworthy.
So sorry for woosing out but that's all
Ian
so apologies but after speaking with work colleagues I have been put off naming the company as I don't want the hassle of any repercussions as I have enough going on at the moment.
However I will say that nobody actually named them above so if you are looking to have some gearbox work all the above recommendations are probably trustworthy.
So sorry for woosing out but that's all
Ian
17 December 2019, 12:43 PM
#23
Scooby Regular
17 December 2019, 11:46 PM
#24
Box was dirty inside? Shouldn’t matter if you put the box in with a packet of super noodles for gears. You want it refurbished, they strip it, assess, quote for what it needs and do the work accordingly. If it comes back with ANY issue the onus is on them to make it right.
Last edited by MarkRF; 17 December 2019 at 11:49 PM.
The following users liked this post:
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post