SS333

I've read a lot on S.Net and also tried to use the search function to try to find even more info but thought it would be worth asking the question direct!

I'm looking for an honest 2007-onward STI. From what I have head the Hatchback design STI isn't hugely popular on here but the configuration works perfectly for what I want.

Prices seems to vary from high £9k all the way up and my budget is at the £10-11k end. I'm looking for a non-mega miler and am not bothered about after market parts - I'd rather buy the car, become a paid up member here and use the experience on this forum to add the tuning parts I want.

So, other than the obvious cosmetic things, is there anything else I should be looking for? I've read that the 2.5 engines can be problematic but any advice is appreciated.

Thank in advance.

thenewgalaxy

The STI hatch is a great car. I have a variant of it and it's the best car I've owned, out of a very talented bunch. For the performance on tap, some of the cars out there are bargains for what they offer.

It's good to ask advice on here because you'll get a lot of it and have the ability to choose which direction to go with things like insurance, aftermarket parts and maintenance.

As with any high performance machine, going for one at the lower end of the price range may lead to big bills on top of the already hefty running costs. Don't expect to get much better than 25mpg out of one of these cars with careful driving and expect less than 20mpg if you have a heavy right foot.

Common sense would point you in the direction of a car with a specialist-rebuilt engine as it would appear that a significant number of these cars (but by no means "most" or "all") suffer from a couple of well known problems. While we all still argue about the particular contrived set of circumstances that lead to the 2.5 engine failures, it would appear that the 2008-10 cars are prone to piston failures and head gasket issues.

So my advice would be to go for a car with a "rebuilt and forged engine" from a specialist or buy a newer car of the 2011+ variety. I know of only one failure on this batch of cars, whereas there are a lot of 2008 vintage cars in the sticky thread at the top of the page.

If you see a car you like, post a link to this thread. It may have a history someone on here knows about or we may know counts for or against it

SS333

Thank you for the reply.

I'm using man-logic on this purchase; therefore, I should probably clarify a few points.

I do a fair bit of mountain bike riding and also have two children. I have a good daily driver but it isn't suitable to use with a bike rack and I get tired of cleaning muddy boot prints out of the rear carpet in the winter.

Therefore, and using the above mentioned man-logic, I have decided what I need is a reasonable priced weekend car. Something I can throw the bikes on the roof of, not worry about when the children get muddy boot marks on it and generally use without being too precious about it.

Get ready for the man-logic...

So, I started off with a budget of £5k and have slowly talked myself up. I want something fun to drive, that doesn't look like a rep-mobile and 4WD is a benefit. A car I can throw a roof mounted bike rack on and drive for a few hours in relative comfort. As I've spent time looking, I started to think 'if I get something quick, I can also use it for track days', therefore ticking another box.

So, I won't be using it all the time. Running costs don't concern me and aren't a factor. Lastly, a ton of irrational thinking has brought me to this place.

As for purchase price, I'd rather spend £2k rebuilding an engine on an 08/09 than buying a later car for a lot more money and perhaps still having the same issue. The more I spend on the purchase of the car, the less likely I am to want to use it for all the intended purposes. Spending money on parts, maintenance and running costs don't count as cost of the car when using man-logic

Disclaimer: I know the above is bordering on bat-sh*t-mental but I'm a man and crazy *** thinking is a skill we're born with.

thenewgalaxy

Not at all. I like your logic, even for £9k(+ £2.5k) what you get is a very quick and practical car that will hold it's value well. Not much will keep up with an Impreza STI in a straight line let alone a bendy one.

I know someone who has bought one of these cars with the intention of electively forging the pistons and uprating the head gaskets, along with a remap. It'll be one hell of a car after that and reliable too.

What you're looking for, if you're happy to take the risk of needing a £2500 engine rebuild, is really a low mileage 2008 car with or without some small upgrades.

£9k should be your budget there but do bear in mind the Hatch Impreza is probably the most modifiable Impreza out there, it is quite easy to go bonkers improving the performance.

If you have a few hours to kill then have a look at the 2008 hatches thread in the members gallery there is a lot of info in there.

Shaun

If you're going to budget for a rebuild, you'd should be considering up to the thick end of £5k imo.

Dear is cheap and cheap is dear.

The fact of the matter is that there is higher risk associated to ownership of a 2.5 (over say a Newage 2ltr), engine reliability wise. This will increase if you consider track days.

Go into this with your eyes wide open and your journey will be more realistic.

SS333

Appreciate what you're saying Shaun and having rebuilt an engine, I know that it can get expensive rapidly.

I did start by looking at New Age wagons but I'm yet to see one for sale that isn't leggy and tired looking. Again, part of joining here was to see if I could find an enthusiast owned one for sale - not one that has been turned into a fire breathing beast but a cared for, enthusiast owned, 2005-2007.

I've probably got a decade in age on many of the members on here and so my days of gold wheels, dustbin exhaust and bright paint are past me. Nowt wrong with that, if you enjoy it, but I'm trying hard not to be accused of being a Laddad. My daughter is already at the stage where she finds me embarrassing... no reason to give her ammunition.

...now where is my Shamen album, glow stick and acid house t-shirt?!

PS- I have looked at buying a 2.5 for a Subaru dealer. I assume (but will check) that paying more than I would on a private sale will give me a 12-month warranty that might cover ringland failure?

stevie1982

iTrader: (16)

I'm sure you have but as an alternative have you considered a Forester STi I'm not suggesting this one although it is forum owned and been well cared for, not sure if it's still for sale but here
https://www.scoobynet.com/subaru-444...ester-sti.html

Also you can get a 04 model for 8-9k think there's one in the for sale section as well

Of you go for a hatch I would suggest stretching a little and getting a 330s, keyless entry / start and the recaros are much better than the standard seats

SS333

I did consider a Forester but a few things put me off it, including the overall height and that I find the style challenging. I have considered them a few times but the other issue seems to be the pricing; there is a very wide spread and as they are a grey import, no real benchmark.

What price are the 330s? And do they come up for sale often? Is the 330 also called the PPP kit?

As before, thanks for the advice.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Save yourself £10k and get a Blob WRX Wagon, spend £2k on a few light mods and a remap and it will do everything you want it to.

Mine has PPP and AP 4pot front brakes and up-rated bushes and springs, sure it's not the fastest thing out there but it's plenty quick enough in the real world, for what it stands me at which is around £4.5k over 3yrs and 20k miles all in including tyres and servicing it's peanuts and I don't have to worry about anything that happens to it, where I park it or what I throw in the back of it, etc.
Did my first sprint in it a couple of weeks back, kicked it's head in in 1st and 2nd gear then drove it home. No 2.5 engine woes, no fancy paint or seats, just decent brakes, good tyres and geo settings.

There is a lot to be said for driving something that you don't give a toss about.

It's very discrete and just does what it says on the tin.

SS333

Ditch, this is exactly the idea I started with but then, slowly, have talked myself up.

And, as mentioned above, the issue I have found is that too many older cars have been let go and I don't want to be driving a pile of junk, or throwing money into something that isn't worth the price of the repairs.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Just had a quick search and this one cheap as chips and just had a load of money thrown at it and got the PPP.

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classifi...true?logcode=p

This one looks like mine except mine has STI wheels.

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classifi...reza?logcode=p

Don't worry about milage as they wear it really well, I bought mine with 92k on the clock and it's been trouble free for 20k and you will see loads with 150k+ that are still fetching £3/4k I call them throw away cars, something major goes wrong just leave the keys in it and call a taxi.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Been there, done that with my STI Type R, I started out wanting something like an MX5 for track days weekend blasts after driving one on holiday in Cyprus, talked myself up into the Type r £15k later it's in bit's in my garage wanting another £15k to get it to where I always dreamed of I think I'd be better off selling it tbh.

SS333

I see your point but is the 2.5. Engine really that bad?!

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

In a word YES and for what your thinking of doing you can pretty much guarantee at least the head gasket will let go sooner or later, and as Shaun above said think more like £5k if you want it to be up to the track. The silver one at £2.5k is a steal and less than it will cost for a rebuild let alone the car.

Honestly mate save yourself a **** load of headache / money and buy the silver one, if it goes tit's up it's only £2.5k, but my bet is it will be fine and like mine just do what it says on the tin.

A 330s hatch is around £15k then £5k rebuild, with that cash you could drive that wagon to engine tuner and they would give you a reliable 500bhp monster with all the trimmings.

Edit to add, And some change.

SS333

Do the 05-07 2.5s suffer from the same issues or did the problems start with the third generation 08 onward?

That Silver car does look like good value, although my car-OCD doesn't like the condition of the body and I know I'd end up spending money to fix it!

SS333

Thanks for all the advice guys - much appreciated. Ditch, thanks for the links - the Silver WRX looks like reasonable value but by the time I've sorted the body, I think you'd be into it for what a non dinged/dented/scratched to hell version would cost. The black one looks better but I'd rather not have black and it is a long long way from me.

Señor Ditch has made some excellent points and whilst I am almost sure he is a figment of my imagination, trying to talk down my man-logic and make me be sensible, what he is saying does make a lot of sense.

As much as I'd love to use a £10k+ STI as a weekend bike carrier/family wagon, I think my car-OCD would get the better of me and I'd end up being precious with it... 'you're not getting those muddy boots in my car!', 'we're not taking that junk to the tip in my wagon', 'you want to put what in my clean car?'... yeah, you get the point!

So, a few questions if I may:-

Did they make an STI-Wagon in the 'Blob' headlight?

If I bought a standard 2005 WRX wagon, can I still purchase the PPP kit?

If I can't buy the PPP kit (or even if I can!) is there a better route to go to make the car a little quicker but not effect reliability?

PS - anyone looking to get rid of their mint wagon?!

bustaMOVEs

iTrader: (31)

They didn't make sti in the blob wagon, tbh you don't really 'need' PPP if your going to mod it. You'll get better power with a bespoke map and a few mod tweeks.
1st stage of mods will get you around 270-290hp
2nd stage will get you around 330-350hp (I'd leave it here as you may need a gearbox above this).
This used to be my family car until I spoiled it and modded

SS333

Very nice!

I won't lower mine (once I find one!) because I don't want to decrease the ground clearance but the rest of that wagon looks spot on.

I guess leather isn't very common? Nice to wipe clean (no smutty jokes intended) and easier to keep looking.

bustaMOVEs

iTrader: (31)

It's an SL model less popular but do come up from time to time, I had a rubber boot liner too so yes easier to keep clean. Heated seats too. So for me it was a bit of luxury and power in one.
Now I wouldn't buy a car for both sinarios (fast and family) so I have a daily estate now and a weekend/track toy.

JGlanzaV

iTrader: (3)

The bug wagons comei n STi form but no others

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Your obviously a man of contradictions so I'll tell you straight, you can't have a car that is for the weekend mountain bike trips, track and general "dirty duties" and start caring about it, that's what your posh daily is for. The mentality you need to run this kind of car is "I want it to be a cheap **** box that I don't give a toss about" otherwise your on a hiding to nothing and will end up spending a fortune on it or something else less suited to treating it badly.

Mine really is no oil painting close up, in fact it's pretty battered bodywork and paint wise tbh, but I really don't care because that's not what it's for, I have had more new cars than most people can dream about through work and they really hold no fascination for me what so ever, as well as the fact that I really don't care what people think about me or the car I drive because i'm beyond that, when you get to my age you just want something that performs the task with no fuss or drama, it is however mechanically sound and gets pampered in the engine and drivetrain department because reliability is important to me, it also has to make the round trip from Croatia to the UK about 4 times a year, which it does with a plumb and returns 36mpg while it's at it.

I think you need to sit down and decide what it is exactly you want this car to do and then go from there because from where i'm sitting you seem to be rather confused as to what it is you want this car to be. All is not lost, you can have your cake and eat it too, but you need to make a decision and stick to it.

P.S, I wouldn't touch a hatch with someone else's pole, they are just a big bill waiting to happen, which is why I don't drive one, if Subaru would have put the 2.0L engine in the 330s there would be one on my drive.

bustaMOVEs

iTrader: (31)

Jdm hatch is an option too but more money, but worth it.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

yeah but they don't pop up very often and you won't see much change from £18k, which basically totally defeats the object of the OP, well at least the paragraph that i'm referring to, which is weekend muddy boots, bikes on roof general dogs body, and a bit of fun, which = Wrx wagon and that's exactly why I have one and the fact that I know more about Subaru Imprezas than any other car on the planet.

SS333

I agree with most of what you've posted above; however, there is one point we seem to disagree on.

Like you, I've had my fair share of new cars and the thrill of a new motor has lost much of its appeal. I still get a little buzz - I don't believe you can call yourself a petrol head and not! - however, it is tempered with the knowledge and experience of depreciation and the hassle of having to deal with often (but not always) cheesy salespeople. This Impreza purchase isn't about buying a new car.

Also, like you, most of the time I couldn't give a rats **** what people think about my car. I also agree that I don't want to spend a lot of a car that I intend to use as a family weekend wagon.

Where I believe we may differ is that no matter the value of what I have, I like to keep it in nice cosmetic condition. This doesn't mean I'll be precious about using it but rather I will maintain both the mechanical elements and the cosmetic. Again, like you, I'm not 20 anymore. I work hard - don't drink excessively, don't smoke and don't gamble. My discretionary money goes into cars. I like to drive something that puts a smile on my face and that includes the cosmetic condition of it. It isn't about what other people think but rather what I think. The silver WRX PPP you linked to would have been ideal but with dings and dents in every panel and scratches in various places, I know it would have annoyed me enough to have had it fixed.

I started at £5k and began to talk myself up because I wanted to find a car in both good cosmetic and mechanical condition. £7k was getting me into a 2.5 Hatch and I was offered an 08 STI for £9k; this is what started me thinking that I could justify an extra 2.5-5k. However, that was before I knew that the 2.5 has 'issues' and that another 2.5-6.5k could be just around the corner if the engine decided to detonate itself.

This thread, and the opinions on it, have definitely helped steer me back toward my original budget of £5k and clarified my target: a 2005 (ideally) 2.0 WRX Wagon.

The ones that look ideal are currently at the other end of the country, so I'll keep looking - I don't have the time to drive 400+ miles return to look at a car and I'm sure a good one will come up close to home.

As before, thanks for all the advice - it has helped massively.

bustaMOVEs

iTrader: (31)

Make sure you go for a 2005 model 54/55/06 but watch out for the 2006 road tax hike change.
As all these ones had a facelift interior same as hawk.

fat-thomas

iTrader: (4)

Hatch,wagon both sh1te,much better buying and different marque.

Only performance imprezas worth having of that age are 2.0 sti or a JDM car

edsel

iTrader: (2)

If you're older than me you're one really old *******. To reiterate what was said about Fast and Sensible
My mid life crisis goes something like this. After a couple of "super car experience days" I decided I needed a 300bhp+ track day car but it had to have some character and be usable on the road hence an impreza. The world and its brother own M3's and Ford RS's so they were off the list.

I might add that as a life long petrol head (working in engineering) I had every intention of doing all the work myself.

I bought a nice Standard "ish" V2 type RA that knocked its big ends out on the drive home from the sellers house. Nice middle age chap, receipts for recon engine blah blah.... £3.5k not very well spent.
What started off as a DIY engine refresh ended up as a professional forged rebuild, I stopped adding up the receipts at £4k.
Then the gear box went pop, 6 speed conversion £3k.
And of course all the stuff in between, brake upgrades, cosmetics, premium tyres etc etc. The car is now nothing like the car I wanted to buy in the first place. Its a no comprise track day nutter *******, I hated it when I had to use it every day for work.

My son owns a standard bug wagon with 100,000+ on the clock, its a nice quick car and the only compromise for daily use is the fuel consumption. If he was to use it for track days it would be ruined in no time but If he was to throw a few grand at it on top of the £2k purchase price it could be a very capable track day toy.

The best advice I can offer is research the car youre buying in depth, subarus get abused, finding a good straight one can be a nightmare. Find a good one and they are capable of very high mileages. I Dont know what part of London you're at but if you want to compare our two cars drop us a pm.

Steve

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I'm pleased you've gone back to your original remit, because you'll save yourself a fortune and a big headache.

When I bought my STI with the intention of competing in sprints and hill climbs and the engine went pop 2 weeks later, I too went the whole hog up-rating everything like edsel above, I also hated driving it every day and soon realised if I wanted to be competitive in sprints etc, it has nothing to do with how good a driver I am it's more about how deep my pockets are and there will always be someone that is prepared to throw more money at it than I was, then I just got sick of throwing money at it and using it less and less, which brought me back to my senses and somewhere around where you are now.

To be totally honest I wish I'd have gone down the route your headed in a long time ago and kept it simple the way I am now, I don't have time to be on track every weekend and I'll always be an "also ran" I do the Nurnburgring once or twice a year and recently got in with the local motorsport club out here in Croatia with whom i'll be able to compete in the odd sprint and join in open track days a few times a year on the cheap for about £30 a pop.

You don't have to go mental or spend a fortune to have some fun, there will always be a better faster car out there no matter what you buy, the trick is just to enjoy it for what it is and make slight improvements as and when required.

Handling and braking are the two most important things and cheap by comparison to power, they are also the two areas that the WRX needs most attention so I'd look there first. A few polly bushes, better springs, anti roll bar, good tyres and geometry setting improve things no end while keeping it useable on a daily basis.

The PPP is also a good up-grade despite what the 'nay sayers' say about it, it's cheap and easy these days with the parts and simple ecu re-flash available from members on here. The most important thing about it IMO is that it's a very safe map that gives good gains over standard power especially in the mid range which is where you want it.

P.s, I do like my cars to look nice but it is almost 10yrs old with 110k on the clock and there's a 500m dirt track to my house out here so I kind of learned not to be too precious about it.