fatherpierre

Not thread to slag them off - well, not UK ones anyway.

What are the training/testing standards for lorry drivers, and how does it vary accross Europe?

I ask because I drove back from Nottinghan today, down the M1 and was almost killed twice by a Polish lorry and a Romanian one.

Each time I was overtaking in the middle lane, broad daylight with my lights on (bit of spray) and was almost taken out by them not bothering to check if a 2 ton merc was next to them - and not even bothering to indicate. It was just luck that the BMW lane was free for me to swing into or I'd be in hospital now, or dead.

Then, near Luton I was about to move past another foreign lorry (can't recall where from) and he puulled right in front of me, causing me to brake hard. Again, no indication or apparent mirror checking.

I know there's a blind spot with LHD lorries, but all these occasions were just examples of bad driving, and I was so close to getting squashed.

Jamo

iTrader: (23)

dont start!!! lol

you should have come to say hello

GC8

In some Eastern European states there are a lot of HGV drivers with licences 'gained' during military service. I have heard that the entitlement is given out en-masse, making its value questionable. I dont have a particularly high opinion of the civilian standards required by any of the new EU states.....

GC8

The only 'blind' spot on a lorry is when youre too close behind (and even then they should see you in their reversing camera). If the feckless f***ers bother to adjust their mirrors properly, that is...

Dedrater

Wrong

GC8

You presume that I dont have an HGV licence.

Dedrater

I don't care if you have one or not, but I can tell you for fact that on LHD lorry's that being too close behind is not the only blind spot, maybe you don't know enough about your job?

GC8

Maybe I know how to adjust my mirrors?

GC8

Between your (minimum of ) five mirrors, you cant lose anything if you look properly.

vindaloo

...or not quite in front of them in the next lane....

GC8

If you mean what I think then you should get that in the 'scene view' mirror; as you would if someone undertakes you in the lane to your nearside in a RHD vehicle. It does depend on the driver looking properly and paying attention too.

Simon

fatherpierre

It wasn't you driving the Romanian lorry was it?

If it was, lose the porno tash - doesn't suit you

phil_wrx

iTrader: (2)

huge blind spot at the side of the lorry, hence why there are laws being brought in so that blindspot must be fitted

billythekid

To answer the first question, the training for the UK is undergoing some serious changes over the next 12 months. As of Sep 2009 (Sep 08 for bus drivers) the HGV test will be a lot harder. It will be a lot longer process and be a lot more indepth.

To add to this, existing HGV drivers have 5 years to carry out a week long training course to gain the same level of training as a new driver that takes their test in Sep 09.

My understanding is this is going to be a standardised EU training system.

The "Driver CPC" as its known should mean that most HGV drivers will get much better training. However, as with most things like this there will always be people who can dodge the red tape... it will also mean a lot of older HGV drivers will probably give up the job in 2014.

I only recently passed my C test about 6 months ago. I must say that the training I got was not the best - even though I passed first time, I found that a lot of legal and regulatory issues were not covered - because there was no need. About 6 months before taking my test I completed and passed the VOSA CPC for Operators, and this involves a lot more training.

I was shocked when my instructor did not even show me how to fill in a tacho, or go into any detail about drivers hours, vehicle loading, weights and dimensions etc etc. He said "oh thats all covered in your theory test book"... hm. My point is, there is a need in real life to know these aspects of the law / regs. I am amazed how often I speak to HGV drivers who dont know the basics like breaks or how to check their vehicle for defects.

GC8

If you hold a 'proper' CPC, does that exempt you from having to pass the drivers CPC test?

phil_wrx

iTrader: (2)

no

and if by "proper" you mean a national or international cpc in road haulage then they are completely separate entitys although some people will get grandfather rights for the drivers cpc till 2012

phil_wrx

iTrader: (2)

the thing is the haulage industry in this country is being strangled to death by red tape and legislation that really doesnt make it any safer on the roads, the cost ofthe driver cpc will tip some companys on to the brink and with very very tight margins as it is what do u think will happen, companys wont bother and just run the risk. as for european wide training system just wait too see who actually implement it, i bet it will be UK and maybe france just like the road time directive

billythekid

Yeah my OL CPC is nothing to do with driving - per say - although it does cover everything on the theory test, and much more.

I have a class C ticket so I will get Driver CPC GFR till 2014. My normal car photo licence will count as a CPC card till then. There after I will have to be able to present my CPC card to VOSA / Police if requested, but I will only get the card after I have done the 37 hour course.

As an operator I have no idea how the heck we will train our drivers up, its a week of training per driver.... who pays - us or them?!

GC8

I asked only because I had thought about gaining a certificate of professional competance. I dont read haulage industry or truck magazines so I dont know a deal about the drivers CPC; and I havent been interested enough so far to find out... Using the CPC acronym is misleading.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

I'm shocked, I saw a thread titled "Lorry drivers" and was wondering why there were no RTMs, I thought the system had broke.

Anyhoo, standards do vary alot.

All the more reason not to drive alongside a HGV for any period of time, and try to ensure you can get eye contact via the mirrors (can't see drivers head in mirrors, presume they don't see you, just being able to see the mirrors is not enough).

daddyscoob

from your previous posts you sounded like you were 'on the' ball but how can passing an exam in a classroom ( CPC) give you a HGV licence I have both National and International CPC and NO I can't drive a HGV

As for the mirrors perhaps you should go and stand in front of a parked up artic and see the difference in the mirrors between nearside and off side and maybe then you might understand the problems for LHD artics

GC8

I can only conclude that you have misunderstood what I have written. I have an HGV licence: I have considered gaining an international CPC.

With regards to mirrors, as someone who can drive an HGV, Im confident that what I have stated is correct. The driver of a LHD articulated lorry has no more of a blind spot on the right hand side than the driver of a RHD vehicle has on the left hand side and that driver will encounter similar problems every day in multi-lane traffic. If you pay attention, observe properly and have your mirrors correctly adjusted then you can see perfectly well.


Simon

mart360

Training? really???

if there soooooo trained they should understand that there governed lorry, can only do the same top speed as the other governed lorry in the lane next to them.

So why do they try to overtake on dual carriage ways, where they haven't got a hope in hell of completing the maneuver, but all they succeed in doing is blocking 2 lanes of traffic !!


training? common sense?

you decide


mart

GC8

All vehicles arent limited to the same speed: some operators limited their vehicles below the statutory limit, others are limited between 85kmph and 90kmph.

speye91

Load weights.

Jamo

iTrader: (23)

daddyscoob, simon has his HGV already. however there is a cpc test which entitles you to be a transport manager and now there is another cpc which all drivers must take to be able to drive after 2014 iirc? simon was thinking of going for the first type of cpc in the hope he would not need to take the newer second type. hope that clears that for you....

GC8

Jamo

iTrader: (23)

not so, my 2008 volvo will fly past a lot of other similar vehicles on the motorway as my lorry is limited exactly at 56mph whereas a lot of lorries are limited at 54 and other various speeds. it does make quite a big difference.

phil_wrx

iTrader: (2)

if it was as easy as "adjusting your mirror" why would thy bring in legislation to fit blind spot mirrors to all vehicles?

and unless u plan on running an international haulage operation dont bother with the international cpc plus if you only move your companys own goods u can use a restricted O Licence (i think)

GC8

Phil: I cant answer that question. I can reaffirm my opinion that when all five mirrors (principal NS & OS; wideangle NS & OS and scene view on the passenger side) are adjusted correctly, you can see everywhere. Further to that: it helps if you readjust your scene view mirror whilst driving abroad, to a more out and forward position, to cover the area that vindaloo mentioned.

I can see down both sides of an eight wheeler with just these mirrors, without blind spots.....