2000TLondon

I've mentioned before that I have two male Rottweilers who are now coming up to 18months old.

I haven't had them neutered, as generally I don't / didn't see the point / need to do it. If it ain't broke........

I understand the risks of cancers are lowered and the dogs won't be as dominant to others. This is the main reason I am now considering having them done as when I go to local dog parks, Bruno just tries to hump other dogs , and Frank gets aggressive . So I either don't take them, or I take them on leads when it's quiet........

Anyway, I'm starting to think my life might get easier if I get them done and they'll be able to enjoy themselves more with other dogs.....

However, the main reason I bought them is that I live in Texas and they are for protection for my wife when I am away, I don't want them losing all their protective instincts.

Would appreciate it if anyone has experience / suggestions / advice please

wrx-kris

if you dont plan on breeding them-get them done!
it frustraights them to.... not get any pum pum.

and while they will chill out, they wont lose there protective instincts-FACT

///\oo/\\\

Agreed

OllyK

Oh they'll still want to protect, they'll just be too fat and unfit to bother

///\oo/\\\

Don't take too much heed of this ^^^

At 18 months they will have done most of their growing and muscle development, so should be fine weight wise.

Just make sure they are well exercised and food intake managed. Should be the same for any dog, to be honest, neutered or not.

Our male Rottie was neutered at about that age, and he's still lean 2 odd years later.

He was pretty dominant aggressive with other males (always loved the laydees and still does ) while he's still a bit of an **** with intact male dogs he meets for the first time, he's much more controllable with it.

Didn't change his personality generally one bit (aside from the aforementioned dominance aggression) - his protective instinct just the same.

He's still dominant though, and it may not stop them humping through dominance. Bitches will do that too.

Much, much healthier for them, and a far less frustration.

stilover

I have a pedigree Staffi, and when the time is right I'll make him available for some bitch to have pups. He'll get his rocks off, and I'll be singing "Money money money".

///\oo/\\\

You think?

The reality is you'll probably get a 1 off fee or choice of the litter.

Don't give up the day job

OllyK

Smilies Diablo, smilies!!

///\oo/\\\

I saw them, but as weight gain can be a side effect, it was probably worthy of a comment.

Hey, if you're the dog, this is a serious thread

wrx-kris

yeah.... ill pimp my bitch out!

not sure what the going rate is just now tho.....
shes 10 months just now, so still have to wait another 8-9 months

2000TLondon

[QUOTE=///\oo/\\\;6904847]Don't take too much heed of this ^^^


Our male Rottie was neutered at about that age, and he's still lean 2 odd years later.


[QUOTE]

Cheers.... Did he seem to miss 'em? They pay their nuts a lot of attention at the moment and wondering if they'll become depressed and withdrawn without them?

To be honest, I'm bucking to prejudice a bit.... As they are Rotties and already seen as devil dogs, especially by people in Texas (most people here own a pitbull, but the rotties have a bad image! ) hopefully it's going to make my life a lot easier in public and allow them a better social life........ If they were labradoodles, I wouldn't have to bother as it's sweet and funny when dogs like that behave aggressively......

If the only real downside is weight gain, I can live with that as they get plenty of excercise.......

Has anyone ever heard of other side affects?

Now I just need to work on getting Frank to be as calm and obidient as Bruno....

///\oo/\\\

[QUOTE=2000TLondon;6905614][QUOTE=///\oo/\\\;6904847]Don't take too much heed of this ^^^


Our male Rottie was neutered at about that age, and he's still lean 2 odd years later.


Don't think he misses them, and he's neither depressed or withdrawn.

Its probably fair to say he became more submissive with us, but he can still be a hooligan at 4 when the mood takes him

Yes, is will probably quieten them down a bit, but only because they are no longer living on their nerves.

***Caveat alert - the following refers to encounters with other dogs, not people***

The main difference is that while under certain circumstances he will happily hold his own in any situation that he cannot avoid finding himself in, and will happily kick *** metaphorically speaking, he is 100% controllable with it, whereas before if he felt challenged it was all instinct first, think later.

***caveat over***

From a training standpoint, he was much more responsive afterwards, and has now reached senior advanced level. But then, he's a clever sod, as the breed are generally.

Apart from weight gain (which is as much down to the dogs becoming more relaxed and less stressed with nervous energy as anything else) Side effects are only applicable to neutering dogs before they are fully developed physically. Otherwise you can stunt muscle development, etc, although not in a harmful way.

In terms of breed traits, he's as confident, intelligent, protective and, dare I say it, arrogant as he ever was.

Still ***** his leg at every lampost/tree/whatever, and aside from his nuts, ever inch a heterosexual male

If you are anything like me, the biggest issue is in your own head. Boys sticking together and all that - felt like I was letting the side down, but with no intention of breeding, it was 100% the best thing to do and we have no regrets whatsoever.

2000TLondon

[QUOTE=///\oo/\\\;6905749][QUOTE=2000TLondon;6905614]
Nice one mate, spot on!

Alas

Hi m8
Couple of pics as promised in the PM. First one after some ditch running, 2nd relaxing


Cheers
Alasdair

2000TLondon

Superb! Cheers for the PM!

Spoon

Neuturing your dogs won't cure aggression, only training does that. 18 months is also to young for having them done as they still need their growth hormones and haven't reached maturity.

If you insist on having them done wait a little longer or train them properly. Having 2 is always going to be difficult when out walking them but properly trained they shouldn't be dog aggressive in the slightest.

As for using them for protection work then they will need to work off commands and listen, otherwise it's pot luck whether or not they won't just fear bite. Obviously the latter only makes them a liability.

The others that think breeding is a joke and a money spinner then think again. Bettering the breeds should be the reason for breeding and not for just finding your dog a bonk for cash. It's no wonder there are so many cross breeds and generally poor conformed dogs about.

2000TLondon

The vets were trying to get me to neuter them at two months old but at that time I didn't believe there were any positives to doing it.

You're quite right about training and I'm not just looking for a quick fix. Bruno is very well trained and works well off leash and his only issue is his excitement levels around other dogs, and the fact he'll try to play with smaller dogs without realising he's over 9 stone in weight!

Frank is a real challenge, I think he may have been the runt as he is much more attention orientated and a lot harder to connect with, I use the same techniques and am pretty much training them constantly, still.

When I said Frank was aggressive, that's probably the wrong word, especially when I'm talking about Rottweilers! He can't control himself and he wants to dominate everydog he meets, which leads to the obvious problems, he's not actually going out trying to kill other dogs, as such.....

They were being socialised with other dogs from eight or nine weeks old everyday, but we cut it back when they started packing on the weight.

I don't want to sound like I'm making excuses and am lazy with them, but my hope with the neuturing was that they'd be calmer and the dominance issue wouldn't be so present, therefore I could train and control them better around other dogs and we could all have a calmer, better experience.

As far as protection goes, I have no interest in training them to attack, but want their natural territorial and protective instincts to remain so I don't have to buy a shotgun for the house!!!

Spoon

Advice you were wise to not listen to.

I'd say Bruno's excitement level is down to inexperience around other dogs, coupled with his age. I know you say you socialised them early but you also 'pulled back' at a critical time. Familiarity soon becomes second nature and somewhat boring to them, thus calming them down.

Frank has the same issues but just deals with them in a different way. If he was aggressive, as you've intimated, he'd cause serious damage so it's only a lack of real socialisation that he is showing.
Ideally you never want to train 2 together anyway. Each dog needs to bond with you and not each other. I appreciate you wont be lazy with 2 Rotties and you say Bruno is well trained. Obviously there is well trained and well trained. I don't know your your parameters here so can only guess. Personally a dog trained to Schutzhund 3 or to Personal Protection standards is what I class as well trained, certainly for certain breeds. Good obedience for most breeds are perfectly acceptable however.

To own 2 Rotties and work full-time and expect they will be well trained takes pure dedication and commitment. To own 2 well behaved rotties takes less time but still needs commitment. The fact you take them out now together suggests you don't have 2 complete nutters so just work on that, complete with *****!

You did mention you wanted the dogs to protect your wife and that's why I mentioned it.
Protection training isn't all about training the dogs to attack though, that was my point. A trained PP dog has nerves of steel and is controlled. It will work off commands and will stop working on commands. You don't want an uncontrollable dog protecting somebody as those dogs are quite capable of turning on the one person they should be protecting, during it's burst of excitement.

Good luck

2000TLondon

Thanks Spoon. Having looked at your website, I think I'm on a bit of a different / lower / unporfessional level, and I am indeed talking about basic obidience when I say "well trained".

I bought two as we had just moved to Texas from London, and I wanted the peace of mind of having dogs in the home, rather than firearms. I also very much want dogs to be part of our lives in general. I intended / intend to be a responsible owner and want the dogs to well-balanced and well-behaved.

Out of interest, are working K-9's neutered generally?

Some of the links from your site offer truly amazing services!!!

Spoon

I agree the level of dogs on the site are in some case extremely high. I have a dog here that looks and behaves like Atom on the site and actually I would say, sharper in response. He will do everything on a single word command and remain on that command unless I say otherwise. He won't let anybody come near the car and go behind my eye line without growling, yet he won't do anymore unless I give him the word. He can find anything I ask him to from a scent I give him. On top of his basic obedience there are a few more disciplines he can do also.

My nearly 12 month old puppy is learning fast but has a way to go and needs to be older yet before he's put through any real PP work otherwise he could easily be broken and ruined for any further development.

Working K-9's as a general rule aren't neutured simply because they are usually from excellent working lines and are also valuable as studs, if they are titled that is. Despite their outwardly looking aggression they can be immensely loving. My dog will cuddle anything that's stationary, so his all round temperament is superb.

Keep going with your 2 and maybe talk to someone near you from a link on the site.