Sticky Stuff

Or am I just ignorant, perhaps it's always been the case...

I've just received a summons for not producing my licence for examination at the roadise. Since when have you had to carry your licence with you? Had loads of producers when I was younger, back in the 80's. Not once did I have any docs on me, no problem. So when did all this change?

What's the likely outcome of a prosecution for the above?

Seems like the Police are being very pedantic.

letdown

I didnt know that........never carried any docs with me!

ajm

What were the circumstances? Were you stopped? Were you asked to produce your documents at the time? Could they be thinking you have defaulted on a producer somehow?

Sticky Stuff

Long(ish) story...

Overtook a couple of Police officers in an unmarked Vectra, knowing full well they were coppers (the dayglo jacket of the driver and bullet-proof vest of his colleague kind of gave it away). They turned onto a road just in front of me, and had a good look as they did so (I was driving a Black Evo VII), then proceeded to travel down the road (Nat. Speed limit, clear of traffic) at 40mph, so I overtook them, making sure I didn't go above 60. For some reason they took offence at this, so gave me a tug!!!

While the one guy's taking my details, the other was on the radio checking out the car, etc.

Here's where it gets complicated...

I'd put a private plate on the car the day before, but it wasn't showing up on the PNC, so gave them the old reg, and it checked out as being insured, and that I was who I said I was. Was asked if I had any docs on me, to which I replied NO, and was given a seven day wonder.

Couldn't produce my licence, as it had been sent to DVLA for an address change the day before (bl00dy typical), and the insurance documents were still showing the old reg. no.

Waited a couple of days for receipt to come from DVLA re. the license, and went to produce.

Was then told that I would be reported for failure to produce a license, even though I have a form from the station which clearly states 'Copy of DVLA receipt attatched'

Summons arrived Sat am (Incident actually occurred on 15th May, and I'd forgotten about it)

So, according to summons, I'm being prosecuted for...

No insurance (was still in old reg. at the time)
Failure to produce a licence when asked at the roadside(!!!!)
Not having a license.

The insurance was an oversight on my part. Put the new plates on, but didn't think to inform insurance co. until following day.

Any legal bods care to offer a little help?

TDT

I suspect you have been stuck on for failing to comply with the HORT/1. The request for you to produce your DL is made at the roadside (for you to produce either at the time or at the station of your choice) hence the wording.

The insurance certificate was showing the old reg, therefore I suspect would be invalid - hence the no insurance part.

Have a word to a brief or post over on www.5ive-o.com

IanW

Section 164(1) of the Road Traffic Act 1988 states that:

"a person driving a motor vehicle on a road must, on being required by a
constable, produce his licence for examination, so as to enable the
constable to ascertain the name and address of the holder of the licence,
the date of issue, and the authority by which it was issued"

A person who does not produce the licence at that time is therefore in
contravention of section 164(1).

Section 164(8) states that:

"In proceedings against any person for the offence of failing to produce a
licence it shall be a defence for him to show that within 7 days after the
production of his licence was required, he produced it in person at a
police station that was specified by him at the time its production was
required."


So Sect 164(1) states that it must be produced at the time. That
in anyone's eyes is a requirement to carry it. The section goes on to say
that a driver will not be guilty of failure to carry it if he has complied
with the 7 day production, but that is entirely different from saying that
there is no requirement to carry it.


The driver is committing an offence. If he does nothing about it, he will
be convicted of that offence, at the date and time the requirement was made.
If the driver takes some later action in terms of a different sub section,
the original offence will not be pursued.

ajm

Sounds to me like the licence thing should be thrown out as a matter of course because they have blatantly ignored the fact that you proved your licence was with the DVLA.

As for the insurance, I would call your insurers and ask them if the insurance would still be valid immediately after a plate change. If so then get them to put it in writing and the no insurance should be flung out aswell.

Hopefully the judge will give the police in question a good b0llocking for wasting the court's time and send them home red faced.

Disclaimer: All this is assuming common sense is applied however!

Also, check your legal cover on insurance and get professional advise!

TopBanana

Write to the clerk of he court and ask them to drop it. It's a waste of everyone's time.

You must have wound up the police officers somehow!

Sticky Stuff

I'm seeing a solicitor at 11am today, just thought I'd post here to get any opinions.

I no longer hold a policy with the relevant insurance co. and getting them to send me copies of the policy is proving difficult. They have said that they can only provide such details if they are going to be required for a legal proceeding (Duh!), and they're dragging their heels a bit, imo.

TonyFlow

I had the same thing, but took all my docs except license (was at DVLA getting new address put on) - they gave me 28 days to get the license in to them (although they have to put you down for "faiuling to produce" - which was then deleted when I produced the license a couple of weeks later!

Dazza01

yes it will be, when i changed plates on the wife's car, she was a couple of days later involved in an accident, our broker knew of the plate change but had'nt passed on the info to the insurer, but we were told as all the other details of the car are the same there is no problem, ie, vin number, colour and all that.
And it can take 7 days for the PNC to update, but as long as the DVLA said you can put your plates on, it's ok, and im assuming they gave you a new tax disc and stamped ur MOT and gave u the green slip off ur log book with the new number written on it ????