Chip

Now I know there will be arguments for both sides on this as we too have diplomats abroad and I think that this mans immunity, if there is credible evidence should be removed and he should face trial.

Saudi man 'should lose immunity'


Mrs Roche described the case as "distressing"
The Saudi government has been urged to waive the diplomatic immunity of a man who is accused of sexually assaulting an 11-year-old girl.
Labour MP Barbara Roche told Radio 4's Today programme police should be allowed to carry out an investigation.

The man, 41, was arrested on suspicion of assaulting the girl in west London on 26 July but was later released.

Mrs Roche said it was a "difficulty" for an accused person to be seen to "get away with" a serious crime.

'Extremely distressing'

Mrs Roche, MP for Hornsey and Wood Green, north London, said she understood diplomatic immunity existed to protect British diplomats in countries with less developed justice systems.

"But I cannot believe that we have signed up to diplomatic immunity on the basis that thinking it would cover such serious cases as this," she said.

"This is an extremely distressing case for the complainant and the family and I can only imagine how difficult it must be for them at this time."

The case has been reported to the Foreign Office who say they are in contact with the Saudi Arabian Embassy in London.

The embassy has confirmed it is conducting an inquiry.

Stinks doesn't it!

Chip.

messiah

Totally agree that it Stinks.

Don't see why someone can be allowed to break the law because of their job.

Chip

The same should also apply to our diplomats in other countries. They should respect that countries laws whether they like them or not.

Chip.

Andrew Dixon

Yet at the same time they would need protection from spurious charges brought upon them for political reasons. Tough one.

I presume though that 'diplomatic immunity' doesn't necessarily mean 'getting away scot free'. I'd expect that if there is evidence of an offence then the Saudi's would still take action against the diplomat? Perhaps even handing him over to the UK authorities?

Aaquil

If its true...h'es scum and should be dealt with properly!!!

Reffro

The Saudi's will consider the evidence (evidence - what's that you ask, I don't need no stinking evidence to know he's already guilty) and if the man claiming immunity has committed an offence, he's likely to be brought to trial in Saudi Arabia. Not much chance of them removing immunity from this man.

Bubba po

So female diplomats should have to walk around inside a black tent in those countries that demand it, then?

DubaiNeil

Actually they would be, if they were ever posted to such a country. The difficulty they would face is that they would not be accepted as high level officials in some of the more strict Muslim countries - as the locals would only want/wish/expect to deal with men, as per their traditions.

Local customs should be followed by diplomats when posted in foreign countries to avoid offending the local population. Only within the Embassy grounds (which counts as national territory) would they be able to remove the hijab.

David Lock

But if he's tried under his own countries' law they will probably chop it off?

DubaiNeil

Abso-bl00dy-lutely although they tend to either go for the hand (theft etc) or the head (anything else they can think of!) rather than other bodily parts - tends to be in public too

What you never know though is if he would actually be tried for the crime, or if it would just be 'forgotten' about. The government is Saudi is very still tribal, unelected and non-democratic.

It would probably depend how senior the guy was, who he was related to etc etc before anything would neccesarily happen to him 'back home'

Geezer

From the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations, 1961......

Article 29
The person of a diplomatic agent shall be inviolable. He shall not be liable to any form of arrest or detention. The receiving State shall treat him with due respect and shall take all appropriate steps to prevent any attack on his person, freedom or dignity.

Article 31
1. A diplomatic agent shall enjoy immunity from the criminal jurisdiction of the receiving State. He shall also enjoy immunity from its civil and administrative jurisdiction.

4. The immunity of a diplomatic agent from the jurisdiction of the receiving State does not exempt him from the jurisdiction of the sending State.


Article 32
1. The immunity from jurisdiction of diplomatic agents and of persons enjoying immunity under Article 37 may be waived by the sending State.


So, we can't touch him, but they can. So he will go unpunished then.

Geezer

tucker101uk

not if me and my machette get hold of his manhood first!!!

mwahahahahahahaha

JDM

How do you think this would work in reverse?

Imagine the scenario: By some unlikely means I get myself posted to Saudi Arabia as a diplomat.

I then decide to go out onto the streets wearing a "F**K THE HOUSE OF SAUD" T-shirt while swilling on a bottle of vodka and eating a bacon sandwich.

Does diplomatic immunity apply in my case or do I just get a good kicking followed by a limb-lightening?

tucker101uk

PMSL

OllyK

I suspect you would be deported forthwith and a major diplomatic row would blow up between the 2 countries.

tucker101uk

Then Blair would begin to make allogations that saudi has been hiding nuclear warheads for the last 30 years, and that the chemical weapons that there is 'substancial evidence to prove are under the control of saudi' must be handed over....

Then he requests the help of his bumchum bush who swears to join Blair on his godsent mission to destroy all of the middle east!!!

tucker101uk

actually, can i change that word to obliterate? i thought it sounded better!!!

Chip

No way, Uk has got too many arms and oil deals for Tony to even think about upsetting the Arabs of Saudi Arabia.

Chip.

Holy Ghost

at first glance, yes this is pretty disgraceful state of affairs.

however, it's a two way street that allows our diplomats - and embassy intelligence officers posing as diplomats - the relative freedom to operate without harassment in countries with unaccountable, unjust, undemocratic, theocratic, ideological or military dictatorships. countries that would otherwise leap at the chance to hassle and harass any and all western diplomats in the pursuit of their own political agendas. or countries with a less than rigorous judicial system. like saudi for instance. or china. or iran.

right now, i'd be unhappy as a diplomat in the middle east, africa or any muslim state without the back-pocket protection of immunity. hell, i'd be unhappy without it full stop. and i'm sure the feeling is mutual.

necessary but it's the price we have to pay: the pragmatism of politics & all that. petitions will be made behind the scenes by the foreign office i'm sure and this individual will almost certainly be shipped backed home as a consequence.

Aaquil

Rape proven in Saudi means execution. I wonder what this would bring if he is tried properly. He should not be able to get away with it if he did it...

Leslie

Its a matter of degree of course. There are some offences which should never be excusable, such as this one. Justice should be done and the best way is if it was meted out by his own embassy and this was seen to be done.

Les