AlexM

Hi,

It sounds like my agency is not at all well... they aren't paying invoices and are meeting with their bank tomorrow.

Unfortunately they owe me five weeks work, which I have already invoiced for. There is an additional week that I have not yet raised an invoice for.

Luckily I'm not tied into them, so I will be under contract with a different agency from tomorrow onwards and my losses are capped.

If anyone has any advice or has been in this position, I'd be very grateful, particularly with regard to the period I have worked but not yet invoiced.

At this point it would not be advisable to mention them by name as their bank may extend them a line of credit, and everything may yet work out (I can hope anyway ). If you have any outstanding invoices it may be a good time to chase payment!.

Thanks in advance,

Alex

P.S. The first 'you can afford it' comment will result in a tactical nuclear strike .

[Edited by AlexM - 10/29/2002 6:17:47 PM]

SimonEvoExtreme

Alex
If you are not going to work for them again, its time to get agressive! First, invoice any outstanding stuff immediately. Your next step depends on the normal terms you get paid on. If they are in breach, which they seem to be, give them a written warning that if they do not pay within 48 hours you will proceed with a winding up order. I personally would get my solicitor to do that, but he is a m8, it wouldn't cost me much and he wouldn't spend time giving me all the legal BS regarding other options!

If you make a credible threat to get a winding up order/ injunction against them it will have 2 possible effects. They might pay you to give themselves time to refinance because if you carried out the threat, they would never get new finance. Another posibility is that they might wind the company up straight away, in which case you would be no worse off than if you had done nothing! Or, they could just call your bluff.

People don't call my bluff because they know I will act. Good luck.

Jolly Green Monster 2

Invoice for the outstanding now..

As they might not be aware they owe you and obviously finance wise they will be working out what they owe etc..

I am currently invoicing weekly because I was worried something like this might happen to my agency.

JGM

neilbbb

now im not an IT contractor (i assume you are)but just want to add my 2c

you're right you should invoice up to date and if they are late paying you this needs to be addressed urgently

a winding up order seems a bit extreme IMHO as surely you will just go on a creditors list and be paid (?) at some undetermined point in the future..

better have frank and open discussion now and outline concerns/ financial decisions etc.

if not given a satisfactory resolution (ie paid in full) then time to play hardball...

but saying noone f*cks with me (as previous post suggests) strikes me as an invitation for them to do just that

polarbearit

A collegue of mine worked for an agent who went bust earlier in the year... He was owed for 2 months work and I believe he negotiated a deal with his employer who ended up paying him a month when he explained the situation.

AlexM

Thanks for the comments so far.

I will raise an invoice for the outstanding time tomorrow. At the moment it is too early to say if the agency is going to tank.

I don't think that the agency will have been paid for the period in question by my client, but I imagine that they are obliged to pay them on receipt of an invoice. They don't have any direct contractural relationship with me, so I don't know if they are in a position to withhold payment and make other arrangements with another agency or pay me directly.

The agency in question didn't even place me - I was approached directly by the client, and 'put through' one of the agencies on their preferred suppliers list. Does this alter the nature of our relationship?.

Cheers,

A.


[Edited by AlexM - 10/29/2002 10:38:16 PM]

GaryK

Alex,
I dont think your relationship changes anything, Ive gone direct but had to work thru preferred suppliers and the contract is the same. I had a company go down on me (ooer ) but fortunately had a good relationship with the directors so managed to get some (not all) of my invoiced amount back. Someone mentioned on here a winding-up order as extreme, f**k it I say, I did it last year (another non paying scumbag) and it was effective, you are not in business to make friends. Saves all the crap and long winded small claims court. However as also said if they do go into administration whether you issue proceedings or not you will be way down the creditors list.

Good luck!

Gary




[Edited by GaryK - 10/29/2002 10:57:32 PM]

Diablo

I disagree. There will be a number of creditors chasing payment. If you are at the front of the list the chances are you'll get paid before the agency fails.

The threat of a winding up order is the ultimate debt recovery measure - you don't have to carry it out.

Simon is right on the ball. The tough get paid, the nice don't.

Time is probably against you - move now if you can.

D

(Speaking with 14 years of business recovery/insolvency experience)

AlexM

Just received notification that Monroe Systems is in receivership. I guess that I will be whistling for the majority of the money they owe me.

****.

MarkO

I'm sure if the client hasn't already paid Monroe, and you speak to them directly, there'll be a good chance of them helping you out. After all, they'll be saving money since they won't have to pay Monroe's cut.

Maz-old

They might just be looking for an increase on the overdraft, or a loan.

Or they might be going bust, in which case: Bear in mind this - if this is a company (i.e. a separate legal entity with Ltd or plc after name) and they are about to go bust, you're position is that of a creditor. The invoice is simply evidence of the work you have done. However, you are at the bottom of the food chain as far as being a creditor is concerned. You're unsecured for a start.

People ahead of you will be the bank (overdraft), any secured loans, floating charges, court orders etc. If, after all that, there is any money left, then they'll pay you.

Getting tough is going to get you nowhere if they do not have the money to pay you. Also, the fact that it is a company mens there is limited liability - i.e. the directors of the company do not have ot pay out of their own pocket if the company goes bust. Unless, they have been negligent, in which case you'll have to sue them and for 5 weeks' work (no more than £3-4,000 I would have thought) is it worth it? Given the court costs and the fact that they may not have the money to pay you, probably not.

If they do go into administration - keep hold of the number of the firm that is dealing with it and let them know you are owed money. If they can pay you, they will.

Don't plan on ever seeing it again, because if the situation is bad enough for them to fold, then they simply don't have the money to pay you. Fulll Stop.

All of this is not advice and I accept no responsibility for it. It is information only and you act on it at your own risk.

AlexM

Yup - that is essentially correct. Unfortunately there are twenty nine working days unpaid all told, which is worth quite a bit more than 4k to me.

I did query the non-payment of the first three weeks, and was told that they couldn't see why it hadn't gone through, and that it would definately go through in the next payroll.

The balloon went up just as it became apparent that I hadn't been payed two weeks later either.

Interestingly, I can see from their records at Companies house that the banks took a charge over their assets on the 17th of October. Presumably they would have known at that point that they were likely to go into recievership, but I don't know if they have any obligation to inform me when it becomes clear that they won't be able to pay any invoices.

It is now in the hands of the receivers, and I will probably have to wait to get a small proportion of what I'm owed back.

The lesson here is to ensure that your credit control is as tight as it can possibly be, and investigate under what grounds you can terminate your agreement with the agency if they fail to pay you.

[Edited by AlexM - 10/30/2002 6:19:05 PM]

Jolly Green Monster 2

If the company is Contractor Financial Planning Limited (previously known as Dignatio Limited), I might have some info for you..

Nothing major and you might already know about it..

I think I am okay to put the name as it is now official that they have ceased trading and a provisional liquidator had been appointed.

JGM