aaron_ions

Hi all, i am thinking of the near future about a full engine rebuild. My current spec is....
Uk turbo my00 td05 16 g running 20psi.
Full 3 inch.
Cosworth panel.
Sti6 topmount.
Walbro pump. Forge adjustable actuator.
Ecu tek map.
Rollerd at 325/280.

When i rebuild i was gona go for the new age top mount and a set of decent headers then push the boost to about 1.5 bar when mapped. So i should see around the 240 bhp mark i was thinking then...

So, what i want to know is what kinda gains will a 2.1 stroker expect to produce, and i am already aware of gearbox/ clutch upgrades after around 340 , so im just weighing up the gains against cost.

What other stuff will need to be done when fitting a stroker unit, is it mapable on a ecutek?

Thank you guys, need sme food for thought here

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi there

If its budget go with 2.1L stroker(OBD or CDB),we are run OBD 2.1L at 490bhp and 25bhp NOS shot

About the yours choices,really depends on the budget,but ARP 11mm head studs I would add,rods and pistons choices(again on budget,but Manley rods with Mahle pistons are supposed to be OK,we are run Manley rods),not sure what heads you are running,but would use V6 heads

With 2.1L you will gain better spool up,with right turbo and right supporting mods you will have great setup

Yes should be mappable via EcuTek,but still would spec budget for better ECU in future

Jura

aaron_ions

Ok so im looking at v6 sti heads? As mine are just v6 uk turbo 2000 at the moment the engine itself is completely standard.

What is obd and cdb that you refer too?

I was just wondering if it was worth going stroker on same turbo and heads setup and what gains to expect with that wiith my current setup.

Thanks for reply

Tidgy

cos of the limit of the gearbox your not gonna be able to go much mroe than you are now without risking it.

if your gonna be getting it built then worth looking at what youw anna do with it, are you going to use it on road or track it?

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi there

Depends on your target,I know now you will be running just smaller turbo,but in future you will be maybe looking for more power

ODB is Open Deck Block(usually have them WRX),CDB is Closed Deck Block

Yes is worth go on your current spec with 2.1L you will gain as I said on spool up(those 100cc will bring you spool to lower RPM without the doubts) and driveability etc.

Jura

aaron_ions

I just was looking at a nice road setup. Im taking off the road end of this year and if i do go for further engine developement, i was gna go for the 6 speed. Which is also big chunk of budget so was just wondering how much more just the stroker alone would add on. Cos i have been reading threads and these are supposed to produce good power and torque gains but theres no threads i can find using stroker kits that run same kinda spec as me they have all gone mental with turbos etc. Lol

Thank you

Tidgy

for fast road 2.5, def wanna do the gearbox as well, the extra torque is well worth it and built right will see 450bhp without too many concers

aaron_ions

And i wanted to do all the work myself, im good mechanically, but never done a full engine build. So would want to use this as a good learning curve when the engine is out and do all possible work myself ( other then the map obv) and get to know my car fully mechanically so. Know what all u enthusiasts are talking about most the time lol

aaron_ions

So you think a 2.5 may be a simpler and better way to go then? 450 would be great. I was thinking around the 400 mark!

Tidgy

a build is a build so no real difference as far as it goes in that way.

aaron_ions

Ok, so i need to do some reading on 2.5 going into classic.

Are all 2.5 engines the same or is there specific ones to avoid.

Is 450 possible out of the engines original components or do they too need internals strengthining too.

And pointers towards literature or build threads for me to view would be great

Maybe just buying a full 2.5 sti with a six speed would be a good way to go then breaking the rest of the car to make back cash.?

Thanks for advice. Aaron.

aaron_ions

Ok, so i need to do some reading on 2.5 going into classic.

Are all 2.5 engines the same or is there specific ones to avoid.

Is 450 possible out of the engines original components or do they too need internals strengthining too.

And pointers towards literature or build threads for me to view would be great

Maybe just buying a full 2.5 sti with a six speed would be a good way to go then breaking the rest of the car to make back cash.?

Thanks for advice. Aaron.

Tidgy

if your gonna buy a 2.5 sti just use that and sell current car.

im not an expert on the exact technical specifics, but its a question i have asked to a couple of folks who have built hundreds of subaru engines, and they came back witht eh same responce. for fast road decent built 2.5 is about the best you can get for drivability. low down torque they generate makes it alot more useable day to day

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi there

We are run 2.1 OBD(based on EJ205 WRX block) 490bhp on meth.452bhp on V-power and setup has been great and has been awesome like on track or drag strip

Stroker kit,really depends on parts used and try contact few companies about the price options,speak here with EngineTuner,WMS,ScoobyClinic,Lateral Performance or Advance Automotives( http://www.advancedautomotives.com/ ) or if you want best prices,USA is good option(I would say best option),we are used like Real Street Performance(speak to Trev) or No Limit Performance(speak to Adam)

Jura

trails

iTrader: (41)

Aaron you could go down the route that a lot of our cousins over the pond take; full swap out for a newage sti. That would mean swapping everything including the loom and ancillaries...so a pretty big and involved job.

Any newage bottom end will bolt onto your existing heads and ancillaries and you will be good to go. I'd forget the 2.5 and go for a JDM 2.0...plenty of people have run them to over 450\450.

Newage AVCS heads are not supported by your ECU, you will need a stand alone ECU and a separate wiring loom.

Gearbox options; I broke three boxes like yours at under 300 ft\lbs, so in order of strength these are your options;

sti 5\6\P1...I wouldn't run more than 400ft\lbs
five speed PPG guaranteed to 450ft\lbs
six speed newage box, a good few people running high 500s without issue.

It's really all about how much you want to spend.

Tidgy

problem is finding one though, 2.5 are dead easy to find and will prob get 10% extra torque over the 2.0.

but totaly agree, depends what your budget is. prob worth picking what company you want to use to do the work then speak to them about prices and options

trails

iTrader: (41)

there is a reason it's much easier to find 2.5s that 2.0 bottom ends though isn't there Tidgy

Aaron you may want to read this; https://www.scoobynet.com/828990-200...ilures-32.html

Tidgy

lmao, ignore that. standard they are ****, theres no dispute there. But were talking about rebuilt engine here

built properly they are esily good for 450 and last.

aaron_ions

Wow thats intresting so a 2.5 bottom end is a straight replacement for my bottom end as you said. This seems a good route for me to go. And i could leave everything else pretty much as is except the box and clutch yeah im not looking for any stupid power i was just intrested to see what easy conversions/ jobs i could do whilst the engine is out during the 6 speed box swap over and engine rebuild. But i do like the sound of the 2.5 indeed

Oh its the x reg turbo 2000 so they have the decent njectors as standard right? Will these be good enough to fuel the 2.5 or is that something to think over also?

So what power figures do u think would be achieved at my current spec running the 2.5 block on the td05 at 1.5 bar then?

Any write ups or guides on the conversion i Can follow step by step?

Very excited about the fact a 2.5 block is a straight swap for my block thanks for the info and replies all! Aaron.

aaron_ions

Ok gna read that article thanks.

Tidgy

440's so they will max around 320-340 so they aint great.

clinic do an sc450 package,

http://scoobyclinic.com/services_per...ning_sc450.htm

gives you some idea of what you need to achieve the figures.

aaron_ions

Lol

aaron_ions

9500 plus vat. Ok id rather build that myself. Ok ive got in mind the parts needed. Only thing that isnt standard on the 2.5 block the pistons then, crack and rods original? Big torque figures there nice! Only other things. Need to think about are decent headers, the turbo, ecu, injectors.

Uprated intake pipe... Is that the silicone style one, as i have this fitted already and im assuming my standard cosworth panel filter will need to be replaced with a proper intake kit.

Tidgy

for all involved (assuming your getting it built for you) thats cheap

forged pistons, uprated rods in a 2.5 and then avcs heads (hawk wrx or sti onwards) will do the power with no issues.

O also front mount, supporting mods are also pretty important once you get the that level as well.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Before you even start you need to check with your insurance, changing engine size for alot of insurers will either put your policy through the roof or make you uninsurable/higher risk.

Then you have the engine issue.... your car just isnt capable of the torque, your gearbox, clutch and brakes are insufficient to handle it so it starts getting real expensive and puts you in a position of "whats best" rather than "what to do next".

With the addition of an engine rebuild and all the supporting mods you would go out and buy a new age wide track STI and it will probably cost you less to insure too!

trails

iTrader: (41)

That's my point about the 2.0 JDM bottom end...you don't need to go forged to safely meet your 400\400 target and you will still have some headroom for the future.

As for the £9.5k you are looking at that and then some to cover off drivetrain costs too. If you have a bit of spare time and want to see a classic go from standard to change pretty much everything go have a read of my project thread. You will see how much I've changed and its all DIY

aaron_ions

Thanks for replies. Now i have food for thout lol. And thanks for the pm