Decisions Dicisions!
01 January 2007, 08:01 PM
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Decisions Dicisions!
I'v got the modding bug back!! But unsure what route to go down in terms of intercooler. Do i go frontmount or do i go larger sti topmount? Any ideas out there?
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01 January 2007, 10:58 PM
#8
How far are you looking to go with tuning it Matt??
Id certainly say anything under 370bhp on a classic id go STI & topmount with a good intercooler splitter, good cold air feed to your intake and heat lagging/blanket over the turbo.
Unless youre going to spend proper money on a decent "extruded tube & fin" cored intercooler, stay with the STI topmount. The STI topmount is a VERY efficient cooler with good core design and quick thermal disipation when on the move. Its end tanks are reasonably thin walled, think enough to hold pressure but think enough as to not hold on to heat soak and disipate heat fast.
These cheap FMIC kits coming over from the far east have cheap crap bar & plate cores robbed from air conditioning units. They have virtually no internal fin design and very few fins inside.
This is great for flow because there is no restriction (due to a basically empty core) but useless for heat transfer, therefore the cooler does hardly anything to cool the air charge.. dont belive me.. test it yourself.
Ive tested a few of these units and seen massive charge temps with them... not good for your engine.
My STI topmount with a 20g turbo pushing 1.35bar is at most only 10-15 deg c above ambient in warm conditions and even cooler during this nice chilly period.
Crusing will show temps up to 4 deg c lower than ambient.
Some of this is due to my cold ram intake as i have no heat soak in my intake charge.
However the FMIC tests were also done with a cold air ram feed and the ACTs were significantly higher than that with the STI or even stock WRX cooler.
Also do not be tempeted to buy one of these crap large aftermarket TMIC, they are even worse than the FMIC kits. They have massive, massive heatsoak problems and are far worse than even a stock WRX cooler.
This is due to the crap core and thick endtank design, the endtanks are cast aluminium, thick and heavy, once hot.. they stay hot and get hotter!!!
That test in Jap performance is also laughable if its actually read properly.
The topmounts are tested with a stock airbox.
Then the FMIC is tested with an induction kit............... fair?
The idle test is also done with the fan still running..........
I dont know about you but when my car is at a standstill it doesnt have any airflow?
Im staying topmount for as long as possible. Hopefully we may see it break 400bhp this year depending on another possible turbo change. When a FMIC is finally required then it will be a bespoke unit designed by myself and Zak and made to our specs, and redesigned until it meets or even exceeds our expectations.
Hope that helps mate, anythin else you need help with, PM or call me.
Frayz
Id certainly say anything under 370bhp on a classic id go STI & topmount with a good intercooler splitter, good cold air feed to your intake and heat lagging/blanket over the turbo.
Unless youre going to spend proper money on a decent "extruded tube & fin" cored intercooler, stay with the STI topmount. The STI topmount is a VERY efficient cooler with good core design and quick thermal disipation when on the move. Its end tanks are reasonably thin walled, think enough to hold pressure but think enough as to not hold on to heat soak and disipate heat fast.
These cheap FMIC kits coming over from the far east have cheap crap bar & plate cores robbed from air conditioning units. They have virtually no internal fin design and very few fins inside.
This is great for flow because there is no restriction (due to a basically empty core) but useless for heat transfer, therefore the cooler does hardly anything to cool the air charge.. dont belive me.. test it yourself.
Ive tested a few of these units and seen massive charge temps with them... not good for your engine.
My STI topmount with a 20g turbo pushing 1.35bar is at most only 10-15 deg c above ambient in warm conditions and even cooler during this nice chilly period.
Crusing will show temps up to 4 deg c lower than ambient.
Some of this is due to my cold ram intake as i have no heat soak in my intake charge.
However the FMIC tests were also done with a cold air ram feed and the ACTs were significantly higher than that with the STI or even stock WRX cooler.
Also do not be tempeted to buy one of these crap large aftermarket TMIC, they are even worse than the FMIC kits. They have massive, massive heatsoak problems and are far worse than even a stock WRX cooler.
This is due to the crap core and thick endtank design, the endtanks are cast aluminium, thick and heavy, once hot.. they stay hot and get hotter!!!
That test in Jap performance is also laughable if its actually read properly.
The topmounts are tested with a stock airbox.
Then the FMIC is tested with an induction kit............... fair?
The idle test is also done with the fan still running..........
I dont know about you but when my car is at a standstill it doesnt have any airflow?
Im staying topmount for as long as possible. Hopefully we may see it break 400bhp this year depending on another possible turbo change. When a FMIC is finally required then it will be a bespoke unit designed by myself and Zak and made to our specs, and redesigned until it meets or even exceeds our expectations.
Hope that helps mate, anythin else you need help with, PM or call me.
Frayz
Last edited by frayz; 02 January 2007 at 02:28 AM.
02 January 2007, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by frayz
How far are you looking to go with tuning it Matt??
Id certainly say anything under 370bhp on a classic id go STI & topmount with a good intercooler splitter, good cold air feed to your intake and heat lagging/blanket over the turbo.
Unless youre going to spend proper money on a decent "extruded tube & fin" cored intercooler, stay with the STI topmount. The STI topmount is a VERY efficient cooler with good core design and quick thermal disipation when on the move. Its end tanks are reasonably thin walled, think enough to hold pressure but think enough as to not hold on to heat soak and disipate heat fast.
These cheap FMIC kits coming over from the far east have cheap crap bar & plate cores robbed from air conditioning units. They have virtually no internal fin design and very few fins inside.
This is great for flow because there is no restriction (due to a basically empty core) but useless for heat transfer, therefore the cooler does hardly anything to cool the air charge.. dont belive me.. test it yourself.
Ive tested a few of these units and seen massive charge temps with them... not good for your engine.
My STI topmount with a 20g turbo pushing 1.35bar is at most only 10-15 deg c above ambient in warm conditions and even cooler during this nice chilly period.
Crusing will show temps up to 4 deg c lower than ambient.
Some of this is due to my cold ram intake as i have no heat soak in my intake charge.
However the FMIC tests were also done with a cold air ram feed and the ACTs were significantly higher than that with the STI or even stock WRX cooler.
Also do not be tempeted to buy one of these crap large aftermarket TMIC, they are even worse than the FMIC kits. They have massive, massive heatsoak problems and are far worse than even a stock WRX cooler.
This is due to the crap core and thick endtank design, the endtanks are cast aluminium, thick and heavy, once hot.. they stay hot and get hotter!!!
That test in Jap performance is also laughable if its actually read properly.
The topmounts are tested with a stock airbox.
Then the FMIC is tested with an induction kit............... fair?
The idle test is also done with the fan still running..........
I dont know about you but when my car is at a standstill it doesnt have any airflow?
Im staying topmount for as long as possible. Hopefully we may see it break 400bhp this year depending on another possible turbo change. When a FMIC is finally required then it will be a bespoke unit designed by myself and Zak and made to our specs, and redesigned until it meets or even exceeds our expectations.
Hope that helps mate, anythin else you need help with, PM or call me.
Frayz
Id certainly say anything under 370bhp on a classic id go STI & topmount with a good intercooler splitter, good cold air feed to your intake and heat lagging/blanket over the turbo.
Unless youre going to spend proper money on a decent "extruded tube & fin" cored intercooler, stay with the STI topmount. The STI topmount is a VERY efficient cooler with good core design and quick thermal disipation when on the move. Its end tanks are reasonably thin walled, think enough to hold pressure but think enough as to not hold on to heat soak and disipate heat fast.
These cheap FMIC kits coming over from the far east have cheap crap bar & plate cores robbed from air conditioning units. They have virtually no internal fin design and very few fins inside.
This is great for flow because there is no restriction (due to a basically empty core) but useless for heat transfer, therefore the cooler does hardly anything to cool the air charge.. dont belive me.. test it yourself.
Ive tested a few of these units and seen massive charge temps with them... not good for your engine.
My STI topmount with a 20g turbo pushing 1.35bar is at most only 10-15 deg c above ambient in warm conditions and even cooler during this nice chilly period.
Crusing will show temps up to 4 deg c lower than ambient.
Some of this is due to my cold ram intake as i have no heat soak in my intake charge.
However the FMIC tests were also done with a cold air ram feed and the ACTs were significantly higher than that with the STI or even stock WRX cooler.
Also do not be tempeted to buy one of these crap large aftermarket TMIC, they are even worse than the FMIC kits. They have massive, massive heatsoak problems and are far worse than even a stock WRX cooler.
This is due to the crap core and thick endtank design, the endtanks are cast aluminium, thick and heavy, once hot.. they stay hot and get hotter!!!
That test in Jap performance is also laughable if its actually read properly.
The topmounts are tested with a stock airbox.
Then the FMIC is tested with an induction kit............... fair?
The idle test is also done with the fan still running..........
I dont know about you but when my car is at a standstill it doesnt have any airflow?
Im staying topmount for as long as possible. Hopefully we may see it break 400bhp this year depending on another possible turbo change. When a FMIC is finally required then it will be a bespoke unit designed by myself and Zak and made to our specs, and redesigned until it meets or even exceeds our expectations.
Hope that helps mate, anythin else you need help with, PM or call me.
Frayz
I agree with everything he says!
PS: How do you open the bonnet
02 January 2007, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Spec'c'57
Have to agree with frayz there if Not going above the 350ish mark stick with a decent top mount....
https://www.scoobynet.com/private-sa...ti-8-tmic.html
03 January 2007, 05:08 PM
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Frayz said it all with his reply, the only problem with top mounts is when sitting in traffic, there maybe some heatsoak issues due to the hot engine thats chucking out hot air underneath it, so best to get the car rolling before launching it when the traffic clears, I've only had this once with my STi TMIC but soon learnt to go easy for a few minutes before giving it some welly - but then again, front mounts get the same thing, they just cool down a bit quicker due to where the intercooler is.
I thought a newage STi intercooler was a complete ar$e to fit on a classic?? Something about moving the master cylinder and welding something up?? I could be wrong but best look into it first! Good luck Matty, 350bhp here you come
I thought a newage STi intercooler was a complete ar$e to fit on a classic?? Something about moving the master cylinder and welding something up?? I could be wrong but best look into it first! Good luck Matty, 350bhp here you come
03 January 2007, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by kin quick
I thought a newage STi intercooler was a complete ar$e to fit on a classic?? Something about moving the master cylinder and welding something up??
Are there any issues with the under scoop rubber skirt needing to be shortened or does it compress enough & still keep the seal?
Mark
03 January 2007, 08:41 PM
#16
Originally Posted by FLAT ERIC
So what is involved with putting a Blobeye STi topmount on a Blobeye WRX? If you were fitting new hoses Samco list 4 turbo hoses for newage STi but only 3 for the newage WRX? Interestingly Forge only list 3 which fit STi & WRX.
Are there any issues with the under scoop rubber skirt needing to be shortened or does it compress enough & still keep the seal?
Mark
Are there any issues with the under scoop rubber skirt needing to be shortened or does it compress enough & still keep the seal?
Mark
03 January 2007, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by frayz
Newage is a straight swap Mark.. ask Kin slow.. he has one
Mark
03 January 2007, 08:54 PM
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if you need anymore help
03 January 2007, 08:57 PM
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Luddite question coming up!
If FMIC are so good, why don't they come as standard??
I've got a pretty good idea who'll be answering this
If FMIC are so good, why don't they come as standard??
I've got a pretty good idea who'll be answering this
03 January 2007, 08:59 PM
#22
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Originally Posted by frayz
Viper don't make vehicle specific hoses, only straights, joiners, couplers, reducers bends etc.
Mark requires some specific hoses for his application.
Mark requires some specific hoses for his application.
03 January 2007, 09:12 PM
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Originally Posted by frayz
Pretty much mate, yes, and for engine response.
Very very good response can be had with a properly designed FMIC setup but its too expensive for subaru to fit and also not required at the stock power levels.
Very very good response can be had with a properly designed FMIC setup but its too expensive for subaru to fit and also not required at the stock power levels.
03 January 2007, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by FLAT ERIC
So what is involved with putting a Blobeye STi topmount on a Blobeye WRX? If you were fitting new hoses Samco list 4 turbo hoses for newage STi but only 3 for the newage WRX? Interestingly Forge only list 3 which fit STi & WRX.
Are there any issues with the under scoop rubber skirt needing to be shortened or does it compress enough & still keep the seal?
Mark
Are there any issues with the under scoop rubber skirt needing to be shortened or does it compress enough & still keep the seal?
Mark
03 January 2007, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by frayz
Viper don't make vehicle specific hoses, only straights, joiners, couplers, reducers bends etc.
Mark requires some specific hoses for his application.
Mark requires some specific hoses for his application.
I will have a word with Zak about some tailor made SFS's.
Mark
03 January 2007, 09:32 PM
#29
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Originally Posted by FLAT ERIC
Yes I did look @ the Viper site & like you say I would need loadsa measurements & angles & stuff & I am only good at maps.
I will have a word with Zak about some tailor made SFS's.
Mark
I will have a word with Zak about some tailor made SFS's.
Mark
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