Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

Scoob has currently got 139500miles on the clock and with the recent and on going power increase I don't really expect it to last much longer..

Hoping it makes it to the summer so I won't mind being outside switching an engine..

So I have a few choices... wait until it blows and then find either a short engine (either new or secondhand) or a complete engine again new or secondhand.

Obviously I want to keep the price down and hopefully get another 140,000+miles out of it lol. If the car is off the road I am going to be in more of a rush to find a replacement engine and it is unlikely to be a bargain..

I was thinking a secondhand short engine would be a good bet to store in my garage and I could get new head gaskets and cam belt sat there waiting.. then when she pops it shouldn't take long to switch it over as no delay on getting the engine, and I can spread the cost.
But am I silly using heads that have done 140k miles? I should really regrind the valve seats etc etc.. cams are likely to be worn etc..

So am I better buying a complete engine? or buying up secondhand parts that become available and building an engine?

I like the idea of a 2.5 STi short engine but being realisic the cost of a new gearbox and other items to enable me to be reliable with the extra power I am probably better sticking with a 2litre, despite there not being a huge difference in price between 2.5 and 2 litre short engines.. (Thanks Mark for the quotes)

If I go for a new short engine then I don't see the point in getting it now.. I may as well risk the wait on the engine when this one goes.

Any thoughts? advice? anyone else stored an engine?
Are the heads and cams the only bits off my engine that I would fit onto a short engine that are likely to be effected by the mileage (other than the turbo)?

Thanks

Simon

Pavlo

second short engine not a bad idea, doing a planned change is better as you may damage valves/heads if engine litterally goes pop.

Paul

APIDavid

iTrader: (4)

JGM. IM do a recon short engine for the EJ205 series. With discount it comes at about 720.00 plus VAT and the best value around at the mo! I can't compete with that price. It has a £350 surcharge against the old unit which like the P1 unit must be hole free and like for like.

It has a 12 months guarantee against free replacement if fitted away from a dealership. Labour and transport are not covered for cash and carry sales. That's possibly not legal but you know IM.

They are usually off the shelf and I can't think of a single reason why you'd contemplate a used motor against a deal like this.

We NEVER sell a used angine that we haven't had to bits it just isn't worth it.

On your old engine you'd need to rebuild the heads to get the best out of the deal but that's not a problem to any company such as mine and we can usually turn heads around in a working day.

Pair of heads gaskets probably a new oil pump, 30 quids worth of seals and off you go on your next 140,000 adventure.

Good luck David API

Pavlo

that is indeed a good deal

dowser

Why would you not go for the 2.5 short motor?! Just turn the bloody boost down (and port the wastegate sufficiently) and get 200k more miles instead of 140k

Richard

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

Because the reasonable TD05 on the 2litre would be too small on a 2.5 so need a larger turbo.. I believe the magic 300lb torque that gearboxs seem to hate would be achieveable with low boost on a 2.5.. there are just more and more costs.. as much as I want to go that route.

I cannot see me realistically not being able after spending the money to not turn the boost up.. also insurance is more..

2litre is sufficent.. (ATM)

Paul,

Hear what you are saying about a scheduled change and that is indeed a good price David.

Hummmmm.. maybe a summer week off work then.. cam belt needs doing in about 10k miles I think.. so that might be a suitable time.. my only thoughts being.. the current short engine mine go on and on as it has done mainly motorway miles.

David,

Do the cams need work??

Rough cost??

Thanks

Simon

TopBanana

Surely a TD05 would be OK, you'd just run less boost?

I'd get a 2.5 bottom end meself and keep it low power until I could afford a new gearbox!

Is the 2.5 short engine any heavier?

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

I think the TD05 would be like the TD04 on the 2litre.. which is imho too small.. I like the go of a 1.8 below 3000rpm and then all the power about 3000rpm.. hence why a reasonable size turbo on a 2litre is ideal for me.. reasonable mpg when cruising about and lots of go when I want it. TD05/6 20g sounds perfect on the 2.5..

Other costs as well with the 2.5, insurance, heads are going to need work or replacing (may be needed anyway but not to the same extent), and if the price quoted above pans out then it is more expensive to buy.. although would be new rather than reconditioned.

Although it would be nice!!

Weight difference would be next to nothing..

JGM

dowser

I still say 2.5; as you identify the 05 wont be able to produce the goods much over 5k (a guess so far), but you don't want the power anyway.....just turn the boost down past 5k, but run more up until that point. I guess the biggest issue will be controlling creep due to higher flow levels.

Insurance is a valid point too

Richard

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

After going to the expense of a 2.5 short engine and insurance and spending the time fitting it you really think I could be disciplined enough to turn the boost down over 5000rpm?!?!

LOL...

Simon

R19KET

Simon,

NO problem.........

Who would be mapping it ?

The TD05 would be fine on the 2.5, and it could then be converted into a TD05/6 later.

Mark.

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

Yeah but would his gearbox?

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

It gets more and more expensive with the 2.5 but I am not yet writting off the idea.. but does seem a waste to go to the trouble of a 2.5 and then detune it!

and we always want more power.. if the 2.5 is there I'll end up using it and breaking everything else.. but then the gearbox will need changing at somepoint..

Talking of mapping Mark... yhm

Simon

TopBanana

Just don't crank up the boost! Discipline man, discipline!

john banks

The TD05 will be lovely to drive on the 2.5, the 20G has virtually no lag and 1 bar at 2600 RPM even with headers & FMIC. I think without headers on a TD05 you would be spooling up boost for boost earlier than a TD04 on a 2.0, and even then you will have to run far less boost for the same power. Approx 12 PSI will have a similar effect to 18 PSI on a 2.0, and my early results back this sort of ratio up.

Swapping to a 2.5 is not complicated and it is not difficult to map. Since I've had my new engine in I've only reflashed my ECU 4 times to get it in the ballpark and I'd never mapped anything other than a 2 litre before.

The only issue I could forsee is if the TD05 boost creeps - if it does port the wastegate out and it should be OK.

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

I don't like the power delivery with a small turbo..

Hated a mates scoob with the TD04.. much prefer the slight (not too much mind) lag and then power high up the rev range.. gives the two cars in one appeal.

So I wouldn't want a TD05 on a 2.5 I don't think I would like it.

So go to the TD05/06 20G and oh look even at low boost I am in breaking the gearbox torque figures..

But all that power would be nice

Swings and roundabouts.. all hinging on money.. as bl00dy usual.

LOL

Simon

dowser

You're plain weird

vindaloo

Into the hat goes another idea.....

Are the USA spec. gearboxes any more resilient or just plain better? Would it be possible and cost-effective to import one alongside an engine/short engine?

Vindaloo.

TopBanana

Sounds lovely to drive, John.

[Edited by jlanng - 12/11/2003 1:16:25 PM]

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

Has been said before.

Simon

APIDavid

iTrader: (4)

JGM, never seen damaged cams on a running old age engine. The only potential might be to upgrade to STi cams which have a bit more lift etc.

David APi apologies for the delay our servers been down today.

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

Just thought.. if I am doing a scheduled change.. would it not be cheaper / less hassle to get a rebore done??

Simon

The Fixer

Simon, full Sti 7 motor if you fancy it?

Jolly Green Monster

iTrader: (4)

We spoke via email about the short engine etc..

Engine would cost nearly as much as the car is worth.. lol

Simon

The Fixer

Simon, drop me a mail, I may be able to help.

Conrad