Scottish Independence
08 September 2014, 12:24 AM
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But surely now you realise that the revenue is much smaller than you thought as it's tax revenue, it doesn't help you as much whether it's per capita, or 97.3% of it?
I don't understand (well, I do, it looks better) why per capita as a measurement of Scotland's wealth has been bandied around so much by the SNP anyway. All the oil companies are not Scottish, so all the profits they make will not benefit Scotland, only the tax revenues they create, which whilst nice and enough to allow Scotland to go it alone, are not going to allow for the Utopian future Salmond likes to paint.
I don't understand (well, I do, it looks better) why per capita as a measurement of Scotland's wealth has been bandied around so much by the SNP anyway. All the oil companies are not Scottish, so all the profits they make will not benefit Scotland, only the tax revenues they create, which whilst nice and enough to allow Scotland to go it alone, are not going to allow for the Utopian future Salmond likes to paint.
I do relies its not tax revenue now good job jonc give credit where credit is due
I will happily admit when I am wrong when proven wrong.
maybe so but as long as we manage I will be happy
and jonc might go on about Iscotlands deficit but RUK's deficit is going to be astronomically higher but I would like him to address that as he is addressing Iscotlands
so go on Jonc after independence if we get it how will RUK deal with their deficit of what could be between 90 to 185 billion ?
if you are not happy with this figures 90 to 185 billion as I did get the numbers from a newspaper find a document to say other wise
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013...n_4430765.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/b...d-deficit.html
Last edited by nizmo80; 08 September 2014 at 03:05 AM.
08 September 2014, 07:53 AM
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Yeah - thought not
.
08 September 2014, 09:11 AM
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So my choices are
Scotland with a deficit with scotland making its own choices and policies which i agree with
Or stay in the uk with a massively bigger deficit and westminster making our choices which a large amount of their policies i am completely against
You fellas seem to forget RUK will be running a massive deficit as well LOL
but because we are trying to seperate you point out our deficit and forget about your own !
Yea still a massive yes vote from me
Last edited by nizmo80; 08 September 2014 at 09:19 AM.
08 September 2014, 09:28 AM
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Yea compaired to what RUK's 90 to 185 billion black hole deficit
So my choices are
Scotland with a deficit with scotland making its own choices and policies which i agree with
Or stay in the uk with a massively bigger deficit and westminster making our choices which a large amount of their policies i am completely against
You fellas seem to forget RUK will be running a massive deficit as well LOL
but because we are trying to seperate you point out our deficit and forget about your own !
Yea still a massive yes vote from me
So my choices are
Scotland with a deficit with scotland making its own choices and policies which i agree with
Or stay in the uk with a massively bigger deficit and westminster making our choices which a large amount of their policies i am completely against
You fellas seem to forget RUK will be running a massive deficit as well LOL
but because we are trying to seperate you point out our deficit and forget about your own !
Yea still a massive yes vote from me
Anyway, I wouldn't worry anything else apart from the fact that you will be invaded by the US to get control of your oil, as you won't be a NATO member, an EU member, or part of the UK
08 September 2014, 09:45 AM
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The UK's deficit is bigger, but it is a much bigger economy. A Scottish government will undoubtedly make policies that are unpopular.
Anyway, I wouldn't worry anything else apart from the fact that you will be invaded by the US to get control of your oil, as you won't be a NATO member, an EU member, or part of the UK
Anyway, I wouldn't worry anything else apart from the fact that you will be invaded by the US to get control of your oil, as you won't be a NATO member, an EU member, or part of the UK
Yea i can just see it now USA invading LOL
Its one thing to invade places like iraq where terrorists are rife and blame their invasion on terrorist while grabbing the oil.
And another thing to invade peacefull countrys like scotland is it
LOL i dont see USA invading norway , sweden or southern ireland do i LOL
LOL you say bigger when you should be saying massively bigger ha ha
With what i read today is a 1.2 trillion national debt which has been confirmed to be the uk's debt and not scotlands LMFAO
http://yes2014.net/2014/09/03/uk-tre...national-debt/
yea lets see your bigger economy pull its way out of that one from which it got itself into in the first place ha ha
Plus we will be saving billions not wasting money on trident as well
08 September 2014, 10:01 AM
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Hinteresting, No campaign are saying scotland wont keep the pound even after the last round, so i'm guessing that there's more to it than the yes campaign are saying.
The vote is simply a p1ss1ng contest, not a fact contest, really shame really cos i can see scotland going **** up because of the media
The vote is simply a p1ss1ng contest, not a fact contest, really shame really cos i can see scotland going **** up because of the media
08 September 2014, 10:03 AM
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PMSL
Yea i can just see it now USA invading LOL
Its one thing to invade places like iraq where terrorists are rife and blame their invasion on terrorist while grabbing the oil.
And another thing to invade peacefull countrys like scotland is it
LOL i dont see USA invading norway , sweden or southern ireland do i LOL
LOL you say bigger when you should be saying massively bigger ha ha
With what i read today is a 1.2 trillion national debt which has been confirmed to be the uk's debt and not scotlands LMFAO
http://yes2014.net/2014/09/03/uk-tre...national-debt/
yea lets see your bigger economy pull its way out of that one from which it got itself into in the first place ha ha
Plus we will be saving billions not wasting money on trident as well
Yea i can just see it now USA invading LOL
Its one thing to invade places like iraq where terrorists are rife and blame their invasion on terrorist while grabbing the oil.
And another thing to invade peacefull countrys like scotland is it
LOL i dont see USA invading norway , sweden or southern ireland do i LOL
LOL you say bigger when you should be saying massively bigger ha ha
With what i read today is a 1.2 trillion national debt which has been confirmed to be the uk's debt and not scotlands LMFAO
http://yes2014.net/2014/09/03/uk-tre...national-debt/
yea lets see your bigger economy pull its way out of that one from which it got itself into in the first place ha ha
Plus we will be saving billions not wasting money on trident as well
As for Trident, it does cost us a lot of money, but then again, where do you think all the employment, investment and knock on economical benefits will go when UK pulls of out Scotland. We are not going to keep our nuclear fleet in a separate country.
The comment about the US was obviously tongue in cheek, and no they wouldn't invade. But, they don't have to. Look what the US have done to Venezuela, that is nothing to do with terrorism. Just be careful how you set up your burse........
Edited to add: Where is southern Ireland, exactly?
Last edited by Geezer; 08 September 2014 at 10:05 AM.
08 September 2014, 10:09 AM
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Hinteresting, No campaign are saying scotland wont keep the pound even after the last round, so i'm guessing that there's more to it than the yes campaign are saying.
The vote is simply a p1ss1ng contest, not a fact contest, really shame really cos i can see scotland going **** up because of the media
The vote is simply a p1ss1ng contest, not a fact contest, really shame really cos i can see scotland going **** up because of the media
and a deficit somewhere in the region of 90 to 185 billion each year
you lot point out scotland deficit but are blind to your own which is out of control,
and if westminster deny scotland access to the bank of england then its going to keep that 1.2 trillion pound debt isnt it as this has been confirmed by westminister.
concentrate on how RUK will survive after independence instead of looking at scotland
08 September 2014, 10:17 AM
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Again, it's a much bigger economy. £1.5 trillion is not good, but for Scotland alone it would be the end of you. Our national debt is piddling compared to the US, but their economy is much bigger than ours. Don't get hung up on absolutes, it's all relative. iScotland's financial woes will be just as hurtful, just the figures are lower.
So you are telling me scotlands financial woes are similar to RUK's but just lower numbers
so its going to be the same whether I vote yes or no in terms of deficits and debt,,,,yea ?
but with a no I get a government I dont want
and with a yes I get a government I do want
so still a yes vote from me
As for Trident, it does cost us a lot of money, but then again, where do you think all the employment, investment and knock on economical benefits will go when UK pulls of out Scotland. We are not going to keep our nuclear fleet in a separate country.
Thats one of the big issues of my yes vote as I want the nuclear fleet out of scotland so your point is a positive to me
The comment about the US was obviously tongue in cheek, and no they wouldn't invade. But, they don't have to. Look what the US have done to Venezuela, that is nothing to do with terrorism. Just be careful how you set up your burse........
Why would they do anything like that to scotland we are not Venezuela and are at the other side of the planet
Edited to add: Where is southern Ireland, exactly?
Ok south Ireland
So you are telling me scotlands financial woes are similar to RUK's but just lower numbers
so its going to be the same whether I vote yes or no in terms of deficits and debt,,,,yea ?
but with a no I get a government I dont want
and with a yes I get a government I do want
so still a yes vote from me
As for Trident, it does cost us a lot of money, but then again, where do you think all the employment, investment and knock on economical benefits will go when UK pulls of out Scotland. We are not going to keep our nuclear fleet in a separate country.
Thats one of the big issues of my yes vote as I want the nuclear fleet out of scotland so your point is a positive to me
The comment about the US was obviously tongue in cheek, and no they wouldn't invade. But, they don't have to. Look what the US have done to Venezuela, that is nothing to do with terrorism. Just be careful how you set up your burse........
Why would they do anything like that to scotland we are not Venezuela and are at the other side of the planet
Edited to add: Where is southern Ireland, exactly?
Ok south Ireland
how that for you
08 September 2014, 10:33 AM
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The UK is already going t!ts up if it wasnt it would not be in 1.2 trillion of debt
and a deficit somewhere in the region of 90 to 185 billion each year
you lot point out scotland deficit but are blind to your own which is out of control,
and if westminster deny scotland access to the bank of england then its going to keep that 1.2 trillion pound debt isnt it as this has been confirmed by westminister.
concentrate on how RUK will survive after independence instead of looking at scotland
and a deficit somewhere in the region of 90 to 185 billion each year
you lot point out scotland deficit but are blind to your own which is out of control,
and if westminster deny scotland access to the bank of england then its going to keep that 1.2 trillion pound debt isnt it as this has been confirmed by westminister.
concentrate on how RUK will survive after independence instead of looking at scotland
Once Scotland goes independent they can use the £4 billion saving to tackle their 2-3 billion deficit (that will be left) and set up everything they will need from scratch. And to cover all the costs Salmond has promised on top of the current position !
Good luck with that
08 September 2014, 10:36 AM
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The UK is already going t!ts up if it wasnt it would not be in 1.2 trillion of debt
and a deficit somewhere in the region of 90 to 185 billion each year
you lot point out scotland deficit but are blind to your own which is out of control,
and if westminster deny scotland access to the bank of england then its going to keep that 1.2 trillion pound debt isnt it as this has been confirmed by westminister.
concentrate on how RUK will survive after independence instead of looking at scotland
and a deficit somewhere in the region of 90 to 185 billion each year
you lot point out scotland deficit but are blind to your own which is out of control,
and if westminster deny scotland access to the bank of england then its going to keep that 1.2 trillion pound debt isnt it as this has been confirmed by westminister.
concentrate on how RUK will survive after independence instead of looking at scotland
be interesting to see what happens to your water bills if scotland goes indy, prepare for 'brace yourself, im coming in dry' lol
08 September 2014, 10:40 AM
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Keeping the debt means they get to keep all the assets.
and getting none of our assets either
good luck with having next to no oil which we will be happy yo charge you for receiving or Scottish fresh soft water for that matter good luck when you have water shortages during summer
Once Scotland goes independent they can use the £4 billion saving to tackle their 2-3 billion deficit (that will be left) and set up everything they will need from scratch. And to cover all the costs Salmond has promised on top of the current position !
yea we will see wont we
Good luck with that
you're too kind
and getting none of our assets either
good luck with having next to no oil which we will be happy yo charge you for receiving or Scottish fresh soft water for that matter good luck when you have water shortages during summer
Once Scotland goes independent they can use the £4 billion saving to tackle their 2-3 billion deficit (that will be left) and set up everything they will need from scratch. And to cover all the costs Salmond has promised on top of the current position !
yea we will see wont we
Good luck with that
you're too kind
08 September 2014, 10:54 AM
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Keeping the debt means they get to keep all the assets.
and getting none of our assets either
good luck with having next to no oil which we will be happy yo charge you for receiving or Scottish fresh soft water for that matter good luck when you have water shortages during summer
and getting none of our assets either
good luck with having next to no oil which we will be happy yo charge you for receiving or Scottish fresh soft water for that matter good luck when you have water shortages during summer
08 September 2014, 11:02 AM
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I don't know if it is out of desparation or lack of comprehension (or both) that you are trying to massage figures to support your arguement/point, but all the figures are all their in black and white to support the official figures. (http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2014/03/7888/6)
If you choose to use your financial wizardry skill to concoct a £25bn of oil tax revenue for 2012/2013 to support your point of view, well good luck to you and your oil bonanza.
08 September 2014, 11:26 AM
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All the serious debate aside you have to admit this getting pretty funny now.
Listening the that sanctimonious arrogant **** Osborne attempting a desperate bribe yesterday was nothing short of hilarious and is a good example of what happens when you are so arrogant you think you can ignore something you can't. Hope it blows right up in Westminster's faces and Scotland is all the better for it
Listening the that sanctimonious arrogant **** Osborne attempting a desperate bribe yesterday was nothing short of hilarious and is a good example of what happens when you are so arrogant you think you can ignore something you can't. Hope it blows right up in Westminster's faces and Scotland is all the better for it
08 September 2014, 11:27 AM
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Again you are using the wrong figures; one is per capita and the other is geographical. They represent two different things
I don't know if it is out of desparation or lack of comprehension (or both) that you are trying to massage figures to support your arguement/point, but all the figures are all their in black and white to support the official figures. (http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2014/03/7888/6)
If you choose to use your financial wizardry skill to concoct a £25bn of oil tax revenue for 2012/2013 to support your point of view, well good luck to you and your oil bonanza.
I don't know if it is out of desparation or lack of comprehension (or both) that you are trying to massage figures to support your arguement/point, but all the figures are all their in black and white to support the official figures. (http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2014/03/7888/6)
If you choose to use your financial wizardry skill to concoct a £25bn of oil tax revenue for 2012/2013 to support your point of view, well good luck to you and your oil bonanza.
and jonc might go on about Iscotlands deficit but RUK's deficit is going to be astronomically higher but I would like him to address that as he is addressing Iscotlands
so go on Jonc after independence if we get it how will RUK deal with their deficit of what could be between 90 to 185 billion ?
if you are not happy with this figures 90 to 185 billion as I did get the numbers from a newspaper find a document to say other wise
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013...n_4430765.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/b...d-deficit.html __________________
so go on Jonc after independence if we get it how will RUK deal with their deficit of what could be between 90 to 185 billion ?
if you are not happy with this figures 90 to 185 billion as I did get the numbers from a newspaper find a document to say other wise
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013...n_4430765.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/b...d-deficit.html __________________
and yes I am not the best with my financial wizardry as you say but at least I try to answer questions instead of focusing on one country and being totally blind to your own countrys massive deficit and dodging questions on it always going back to Iscotlands hence the one trick pony line
you dont have opinions on whats happening in RUK you have no excuses for RUK debt and deficit problems
so why do you hold on to Iscotlands deficit when you cant even answer your own ??
you certainly come across as a hypocrite dont you LOL
Last edited by nizmo80; 08 September 2014 at 11:59 AM.
08 September 2014, 11:29 AM
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08 September 2014, 11:59 AM
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You say you get a government you want, that's fine. However, the government you want has been unable to demonstrate how they will fund the promises they have made, in all likeliness will make just as many stupid and unpopular decisions as Westminster do too. All governments are unpopular. What exactly do you think this government is going to give you?
You will have a deceitful, unpopular, self promoting government in Holyrood instead of Westminster!
Tridet: You see thousands losing their jobs as a positive? I'm sure all the families who are hit with that will thank your for your idealogical policy there. iScotland will not have the financial clout to replace that lost business by ordering a new fleet of their own. You won't replace it with commercial ship building, Asia has seen to that (hell, even continental Europe gets more ship building deals then us!)
What has Venezuela being on the other side of the world got to do with anything? It's also on the other side of the world to Iraq, but the two are inextricably linked. iScotland has to trade in dollars for oil. If iScotland has trouble buying dollars to trade (and that is what keeps the US economy going, it's a free ride) then they possibly might set up a burse to trade oil in something other than dollars. No one has done that, except the Chinese, the US cannot take them on. Have a look and see what happened to any country that tried to get away from trading in dollars
Of course, I don't imagine the US would move so obviously, but they could make things very difficult for you.
Add to these the clear intentions of RBS (you can't get much more Scottish than that!) and Standard life to move to the UK in the event of a Yes vote, you can see a big flow of money out of Scotland.
Sure, you have oil, but it won't last and there is not much else in Scotland to replace it. Actually, now I think of it, a Yes vote is good, 'cos once it does run out, we will have to support you lot even more! Good God, the whole of Scotland will be like "Benefit Street"
As for south/southern Ireland, it's the Republic of Ireland
You will have a deceitful, unpopular, self promoting government in Holyrood instead of Westminster!
Tridet: You see thousands losing their jobs as a positive? I'm sure all the families who are hit with that will thank your for your idealogical policy there. iScotland will not have the financial clout to replace that lost business by ordering a new fleet of their own. You won't replace it with commercial ship building, Asia has seen to that (hell, even continental Europe gets more ship building deals then us!)
What has Venezuela being on the other side of the world got to do with anything? It's also on the other side of the world to Iraq, but the two are inextricably linked. iScotland has to trade in dollars for oil. If iScotland has trouble buying dollars to trade (and that is what keeps the US economy going, it's a free ride) then they possibly might set up a burse to trade oil in something other than dollars. No one has done that, except the Chinese, the US cannot take them on. Have a look and see what happened to any country that tried to get away from trading in dollars
Of course, I don't imagine the US would move so obviously, but they could make things very difficult for you.
Add to these the clear intentions of RBS (you can't get much more Scottish than that!) and Standard life to move to the UK in the event of a Yes vote, you can see a big flow of money out of Scotland.
Sure, you have oil, but it won't last and there is not much else in Scotland to replace it. Actually, now I think of it, a Yes vote is good, 'cos once it does run out, we will have to support you lot even more! Good God, the whole of Scotland will be like "Benefit Street"
As for south/southern Ireland, it's the Republic of Ireland
08 September 2014, 12:09 PM
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08 September 2014, 12:13 PM
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You say you get a government you want, that's fine. However, the government you want has been unable to demonstrate how they will fund the promises they have made, in all likeliness will make just as many stupid and unpopular decisions as Westminster do too. All governments are unpopular. What exactly do you think this government is going to give you?
A chance to rid us of westminster for a start
and to honest neither has westminster been able to demonstrate how they will fund things as if they could the UK would not be in 1.2 trillion of debt and counting would they
You will have a deceitful, unpopular, self promoting government in Holyrood instead of Westminster!
westminster has been proven many times all the above wheres your proof hollyrood will be ?
Tridet: You see thousands losing their jobs as a positive? I'm sure all the families who are hit with that will thank your for your idealogical policy there. iScotland will not have the financial clout to replace that lost business by ordering a new fleet of their own. You won't replace it with commercial ship building, Asia has seen to that (hell, even continental Europe gets more ship building deals then us!)
Straight up dont care
against nukes on scottish soil so dont try and sugar coat why nukes in scotland is a good thing
park that sh!te on england 40 miles from a major english population and see how people react as you said it will boost jobs for you
What has Venezuela being on the other side of the world got to do with anything? It's also on the other side of the world to Iraq, but the two are inextricably linked. iScotland has to trade in dollars for oil. If iScotland has trouble buying dollars to trade (and that is what keeps the US economy going, it's a free ride) then they possibly might set up a burse to trade oil in something other than dollars. No one has done that, except the Chinese, the US cannot take them on. Have a look and see what happened to any country that tried to get away from trading in dollars
Of course, I don't imagine the US would move so obviously, but they could make things very difficult for you.
Could is not will is it
you dont know what they will do will you
Add to these the clear intentions of RBS (you can't get much more Scottish than that!) and Standard life to move to the UK in the event of a Yes vote, you can see a big flow of money out of Scotland.
as jonc stated I am no financial wizard and I will not answer what I dont know about
Sure, you have oil, but it won't last and there is not much else in Scotland to replace it. Actually, now I think of it, a Yes vote is good, 'cos once it does run out, we will have to support you lot even more! Good God, the whole of Scotland will be like "Benefit Street"
how will you need to support us if we are independent ?
As for south/southern Ireland, it's the Republic of Ireland
well so you are saying the republic of ireland is not south ireland as well
where is it situated then
A chance to rid us of westminster for a start
and to honest neither has westminster been able to demonstrate how they will fund things as if they could the UK would not be in 1.2 trillion of debt and counting would they
You will have a deceitful, unpopular, self promoting government in Holyrood instead of Westminster!
westminster has been proven many times all the above wheres your proof hollyrood will be ?
Tridet: You see thousands losing their jobs as a positive? I'm sure all the families who are hit with that will thank your for your idealogical policy there. iScotland will not have the financial clout to replace that lost business by ordering a new fleet of their own. You won't replace it with commercial ship building, Asia has seen to that (hell, even continental Europe gets more ship building deals then us!)
Straight up dont care
against nukes on scottish soil so dont try and sugar coat why nukes in scotland is a good thing
park that sh!te on england 40 miles from a major english population and see how people react as you said it will boost jobs for you
What has Venezuela being on the other side of the world got to do with anything? It's also on the other side of the world to Iraq, but the two are inextricably linked. iScotland has to trade in dollars for oil. If iScotland has trouble buying dollars to trade (and that is what keeps the US economy going, it's a free ride) then they possibly might set up a burse to trade oil in something other than dollars. No one has done that, except the Chinese, the US cannot take them on. Have a look and see what happened to any country that tried to get away from trading in dollars
Of course, I don't imagine the US would move so obviously, but they could make things very difficult for you.
Could is not will is it
you dont know what they will do will you
Add to these the clear intentions of RBS (you can't get much more Scottish than that!) and Standard life to move to the UK in the event of a Yes vote, you can see a big flow of money out of Scotland.
as jonc stated I am no financial wizard and I will not answer what I dont know about
Sure, you have oil, but it won't last and there is not much else in Scotland to replace it. Actually, now I think of it, a Yes vote is good, 'cos once it does run out, we will have to support you lot even more! Good God, the whole of Scotland will be like "Benefit Street"
how will you need to support us if we are independent ?
As for south/southern Ireland, it's the Republic of Ireland
well so you are saying the republic of ireland is not south ireland as well
where is it situated then
Last edited by nizmo80; 08 September 2014 at 12:22 PM.
08 September 2014, 12:18 PM
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08 September 2014, 12:29 PM
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All the serious debate aside you have to admit this getting pretty funny now.
Listening the that sanctimonious arrogant **** Osborne attempting a desperate bribe yesterday was nothing short of hilarious and is a good example of what happens when you are so arrogant you think you can ignore something you can't. Hope it blows right up in Westminster's faces and Scotland is all the better for it
Listening the that sanctimonious arrogant **** Osborne attempting a desperate bribe yesterday was nothing short of hilarious and is a good example of what happens when you are so arrogant you think you can ignore something you can't. Hope it blows right up in Westminster's faces and Scotland is all the better for it
It is sure going to be funny finding out
08 September 2014, 12:31 PM
#930
Scooby Regular
Thread Starter
you keep going on about Iscotlands deficit but dont mention your own RUK's
and yes I am not the best with my financial wizardry as you say but at least I try to answer questions instead of focusing on one country and being totally blind to your own countrys massive deficit and dodging questions on it always going back to Iscotlands hence the one trick pony line
you dont have opinions on whats happening in RUK you have no excuses for RUK debt and deficit problems
so why do you hold on to Iscotlands deficit when you cant even answer your own ??
you certainly come across as a hypocrite dont you LOL
and yes I am not the best with my financial wizardry as you say but at least I try to answer questions instead of focusing on one country and being totally blind to your own countrys massive deficit and dodging questions on it always going back to Iscotlands hence the one trick pony line
you dont have opinions on whats happening in RUK you have no excuses for RUK debt and deficit problems
so why do you hold on to Iscotlands deficit when you cant even answer your own ??
you certainly come across as a hypocrite dont you LOL
I have already told you of my opinion of what might happen to rUK financially and how it might cope with it. If you choose to ignore it, that is not my problem. It's obviously clear you only want to see what you want to see; the only thing that interests you is how great it will be for iScotland and how cr@p rUK will be. Again, that is also not my problem and this thread is about Scottish independence, not how crap Westminster are.
Last edited by jonc; 08 September 2014 at 12:52 PM.