Ahem, just thought I would step in from the 'other side'. I've got a Vectra VXR and been up against all sorts on the track and santa pod.

I've got respect for all cars and I'm not brand biased. The Vectra VXR certainly has its limitations and isnt the best car in the world. However...

Thought you might like to see this vid I made at the Nurburgring... 1 minute 30 seconds in I'm chasing down a white Subaru. Interestingly he couldnt catch me for the rest of the 10 miles through all those corners, so please dont underestimate the Vectra VXR I had passengers in the car so didnt take it to the edge, but still managed an 8 minute 57 second lap time from Bridge to Gantry, and I'm no racer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGAxjl8iuXY

Enjoy

 

At the end of the day mate, they're driving a Vauxhall. I think we know who the real winner is.

Plus I've heard the VXRs are an absolute pig for torque steer - and actually not particularly good to drive.

 

The subaru wasnt trying
Standard factory car below, no remap, standard everything, 18k in japan new in 2005
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPPXZGmfS9c

Good vid of yours though

Tony

 

lol

Thanks Tony,

And we all enjoy our cars whatever the make and model...

 

Fair play to you mate, tidy looking drive Would have been nice to hear the car though but I read why that wasn't there.
I honestly think the VXR's are great cars and extremely quick, I would never take one for granted. I think they look great too although I obviously still prefer by Scoobies, I have a healthy respect for the VXR's

Jeff

 

Well I do have 3 cars atm (4 at the end of the month ) need to sell 1 scoob as the other one is taking over and my little astra CDTI 1.9 16v 120 Design (not selling that one ) so best of both worlds

Tony

 

Well I'll let you into my secret as the VXR isnt my only car either... My runabout is a Fiat 500 1.2 sport with a huge 69 BHP. I've stuck coilovers on it and Ferodo DS-2500 pads so it corners and brakes really well. Loads of fun on the twisties, just like a go-cart.

As I said, I like unusual cars and especially making slow cars go fast, its more satisfying than making fast cars go fast

 

I have a pug 306 S16 as a project, it will get finished one day

Tony

 

Sounds good and good luck with it

I'll leave you guys to get back to your VXR bashing now then.

Cheers guys, have fun

 

Not got a downer as regards the performance (have about a few other things as regards the hatch, but that is for another thread ).

I just object to the whole 'Subaru have moved the game on' nonsense in the context of the OP. In some areas they have, but straightline performance is not one of them.

STI330S - 0-100mph -12.7s

1998 Type R - 0 -100 - 12.2s

Oh and btw the the current Impreza STI IS a hot hatch.

 

Hi guy's don't flame me straight away.

First thing the Astra and Vectra are very different with the Vec being a decent bit quicker once over the ton (std v std).

In a straight line (from rolling) a std Astra is probs around the same as a std STi (264bhp version) for pace and actually a tad slower than the 276bhp one(the vec is very slightly quicker than the 276 one due to ts loss and a higher top speed), in the twisties though obviously the Scoob will come out on top against either no question pointless arguing this one.

A stage 3 astra will be on par with an STI ppp 316bhp (pos a tad quicker) for pace and with rarb, coilovers and a diff will be potent in the twisties(same goes for the Vec) and will shock quite a few std scoobs, however a well setup scoob will be back in front again due to 4wd traction.

My m8 Scottvxr20 has a tuned STI running 350bhp\350lbs torque and also a S3 Astra and has said on many occasions on the straights the Astra will be on par with the Scoob but on the twisties it will leave it for dead(I concur as I have had many a drive in both)

Now when Scott and I go out for a blast in our cars( I run a 326bhp Vec with 400lbs torque) The result is always the same from standing start the Scoob turns me inside out and it takes just over 1/2 mile for me to catch him as my traction loss means I'm well playing catch up.

From rolling though it's different, traction is already there and I will pull imediately on his Scoob and once over 90 I start to pull further and he can't catch up again unless we hit mega twisties.

We figure due to transmission loss it will take 370-380bhp from a scoob for it to beat the vec on a roll and the only way the Scoob will win top end(the vec will hit 175mph on a vbox) is with different gearing.


In the end all 3 are very good cars but are all aimed at different markets.

the Scoob is point to point fun and was never designed for out and out straight line speed.

The Vec is a cruiser and built for high speed(although it is still very good in the twisties, just not in the scoobs league)

And the Astra in my eyes is a compromise of both(in a sense) it is very quick in the straights(a little slower than the Vec) and very good in the corners as long as it has rarb, diff and springs, but will still not be as precise as the scoob.


So in essence if you want an affordable cornering king go Scoobaru

If you want an affordable motorway\a road king go Vec VXR

and if you want a bit of both go Astra.

 

Nice write up Vox

Tony

 

+1 nice one.

 

any scooby driver that relies on 4wd to get them through the twisties or round a track cannot drive
HTH

The wet is no problem for fwd/rwd like it used to be
HTH

The impreza is no longer the PBOTD that it used to be
HTH

All you n00bs spouting the same old arguments that we did 9 years ago are wrong, the formula has been diluted and is no longer the stuff of legends, I mean when was SWRT last king of the stages?
HTH

You need 50-100bhp ATW to really hand someone their ***, anything within 50bhp ATW will be down to driver skill/error, finally, you NEVER REALLY KNOW FOR CERTAIN if the other driver was
a) trying
b) tuned or standard
so it is pure conjecture.

Funny thread
HTH

 

Anyone care to translate for me?

I googled PBOTD and got 'Poker Babe Of The Day'

So I tried ATW and got 'Asia in Todays World'

I'm confused.

However I would like to gently point out that 4 wheel drive is better at going round corners than 2. Thank you.

 

ATW = at the wheels

 

Performance bargain of the decade
At the wheels
4WD IS NOT better at going round corners, it is better at getting average drivers around corners, granted

 

ATW=at the wheels

Tony

 

Oh right, then how do you explain the 4 wheel drive Quattro and all the subsequent 4 wheel drive cars going faster round rally stages than 2 wheel drive cars?

I don't think you could describe rally drivers as 'average drivers'!

So McRae could have done just as well in an Astra then? Is that what you are implying?

 

Touring cars are fwd or rwd, they did bin the 4x4 volvo's though and F1 cars are rwd, we can keep this up for an age
Oh, grp B cars were fwd or rwd some were even 4wd

Tony

 

You're confusing handling with traction Westwood...

4x4's have masses of traction..ideal as a rally car on lose surfaces...on the tarmac stages the RWD rally cars lost little if anything to the Quattro's.

 

I'll agree the Scooby does flatter the driver. You don't have to be very good to make it go quickly and stay out of trouble.

 

excellent, now we're getting somewhere.

The Impreza is indeed an excellent car, but that age old arguement of "best in the twisties" or "grippy when its wet" really grips my ****.

It just isnt so and these cliches are the reason that other forums laugh at us...

 

I can tell you are getting bothered... no need to. Not at me anyway.

I'll also concede on the traction conversation...

To be fair though I suppose it depends on what you are comparing it to and under what circumstances. My first Impreza was a revelation in the wet compared with my previous Primera GT. You could just push a lot further before loosing traction.

Anyone would be forgiven for coming to the natural conclusion that his new shiny Impreza gripped better in the wet than his previous car.

 

indeed, which is why the scooby has been such a great success in the past...
It takes Mr. Average and catapults him into a driving God with the phenominal grip available

I'm not bothered, I have had a few Scoobs in the past but have now moved to another marque, in fact two other marques, but these two cliched thoughts of the average Scooby owner really let down the side.
A well driven RWD will easily keep pace with a well driven 4wd in most all situations (loose gravel excepted).

 

I fine the DCCD eliminates virtually all of the nasty turn-in scrub that's a trademark of the Impreza.... giving it better handling than most FWD cars (those without trick front diffs anyway).. As for RWD... well it's still king when it comes to dry tarmac ... god I miss my Cayman on dry days...(not on really wet days though )

 

I had dccd in open all the time

 

I'm not familiar with the old DCCD terminology,

The new system has Auto- and Auto+ (- for rear bias and + for front bias)

Auto- works a treat...

 

I have an astra vxr stage 3. 312bhp, RARB, LSD, bigger brakes, springs and so on. 0 - 60 believe it or not the astra at stage 3 doesnt do too bad with LSD against the sti and from a rolling start the astra blows the sti away with ease. I've never had any problems keeping up with a sti on corners untill i get to a very tight corner or a roundabout in the wet. Both completly different cars though... but you lot must admit being overtaken by an astra must make you think "what the heck"

 

Absolutly love these kind of threads!!!!

End of the day though it always comes down to 3 factors:
Car
Driver
Road Conditions

You can have a better driver in a lesser car and beat the better car with a lesser driver but also works the other way round. You could have jenson button in a 1.1 fiesta popular plus against someone who's s**t in a Enzo.

You could have a 400bhp vxr but get beat in the wet by a 300bhp sti due to traction etc Or the better driver so on and so on!!!!!!!!!!!!