I-am-Cos

iTrader: (6)

Can anyone give genuine honest feedback on their experiences using the EBC Bluestuff NDX pads. (On track preferably).

I understand a few were given free pads to evaluate & while those that have may be 'tempted' to praise them as they were given to them free, honest appraisals would be welcome.

I'm primarily after feedback from users who have done trackdays using the standard newage 4 pot calipers, as this is the set up I'm having issues with.

To give you the brief back story:

I have a 2005 blobeye WRX PPP. Did the recent Snetterton 300 novice trackday. (My first ever trackday). Decided I'd want to go for a better trackday pad than the mintex I had installed (Although never had a problem with the mintex on the road). Was recommended to the bluestuffs, so fitted these about 300 miles before the trackday on fairly new discs supplied by Ian at Godspeed.

2 laps in - severe juddering felt through the wheel. Pull in, wait to cool, out again, 2 more laps, severe juddering felt through the wheel, pull in, wait to cool, out again & repeat................ (I was by no means breaking any records out there )

This also happened to 2 others on the trackday running the same caliper set up. (It appears less people suffer problems with the STi Brembo & other uprated brake set up's - unless you know different?), so feedback from '4 potters' would be extremely helpful. (I've heard feedback from others using different pads with this caliper set up with no apparent problems).

There is another thread running on Beds & Bucks Scoobys forum (BABS) here: http://babs.forumotion.com/t5675-ong...ddering-issues (May need to be a member to read - membership is free)

I have to say, they appear to be fine on the road, but they are sold as 'Track only' pads & have been recently told 'NOT TO USE ON THE TRACK'

See this thread: reply #119

https://www.scoobynet.com/845503-ebc...4-2-1-a-4.html

Which is a strange line to take on trackday only pads

Thanks for any advice & feedback

Steve_PPP

iTrader: (3)

As you know, I've been promised these as the Bluestuffs on my car were destroyed in one evening at Brands.

I've yet to receive anything from Andy @ EBC but he's said they will be with me soon. I'm at the Nurburgring in two weeks so hoping they arrive within the next week to give me a chance to fit them in time, and clean up my disks as they're covered in deposits from the smeared NDX's. Might also now have the chance to do another open pit at Brands at the end of June (if Andy wants some of the new NDX 'blend' tested) - but its dependent on spare cash and the car being fine after Germany.

I clearly didn't have the problems with judder as badly as you. I did 15-20 minute runs at Brands without any noticeable fade. Beyond this, they overheated and faded quickly, to the point that the pads smeared and melted. For the first 15 minutes or so, the braking was excellent - far better than the Mintex pads I was previously using.

Please make sure this thread stays objective and factual - rather than becoming a slanging match. I'm sure Andy is looking for facts, to help EBC improve this pad - which will benefit all of us in the end

dazzer98

iTrader: (3)

i have the bluestuff pads in my four pots on my classic, i recently did a 10min session at castlecombe (performance action day) and the pads performed perfectly for me, there was no brake fade what so ever and no juddering, but this is the first performance pad i have used so can only compare to standard pads, and obviously there are a much better pad to standard ones. will be doing a proper trackday there in august so looking forward to testing them a bit more.

but interested to read that they go off after 15-20 min runs.

I-am-Cos

iTrader: (6)

That is my intention

53

iTrader: (41)

Sorry I can only comment on Brembos and they are awesome on my classic, took longer to bed in on my Newage but again awesome. On track they were superb.

Billet

iTrader: (60)

i haven't got them in my car, but reading the other thread, it seems that the juddering problem only occurs with wrx 4 pots and they are fine with brembos. apparently the wrx 4 pots drag too much, causing the pads to heat up too much and in one case over 1000 degrees.

MalcB

I'll let know ...............got 2 sessions at Japfest on Saturday. Fitted Bluestuff a couple of weeks ago.

P1 Daveyboy

I had them on my Alcon 330 mm discs they warped the inner disc after 6 months
Alcon would not entertain any sort of claim or refund either
Stopped like hell tho even cold

Dave

stef_2010

iTrader: (3)

are the wrx 4 pots the same as the classic sti 4 pots then ?

scoobygaz1

iTrader: (3)

I`ve a classic with four pots with blue stuff new discs and fluid not tracked it but it wobbles on braking

Steve Whitehorn

iTrader: (13)

Quite often there can be other issues behind the brake judder.
DS2500s were changed for NDX Blues and the judder is still there.
But only when very hot.

The Blues work very well.
I tested them hard braking down from 150mph to 40mph several times yesterday and they worked great. Get alot of heat into the brakes then judder big time.

However to get to the bottom of the problem. EBC are going to thoughly check alignment, hot spots ect.

Once the underlying problem has been solved I will report back with our findings and also give the Blues another hard work out to see what is what.

(Car - lightened classic, 450-500hp. Ian Godney refurbished 4 pot subaru calipers, Braided lines, 335mm groved Godspeed discs, Bulkhead brake bias mod, NDX Blue stuff pads)

cster

Sounds like a lot of power for those calipers to handle to me.
Mind you - I have a big ar5ed 2.5l Spec D.

Steve Whitehorn

iTrader: (13)

Agree. It all works pretty well.
But a caliper upgrade is one of few things I might do in the future.

DannyBoy007

iTrader: (7)

I've only ever had them fade once and that was on a very spirited drive along a road with alot of tight corners. Apart from that they have been fantastic. Scoobyclinic 6 pots on front (with Godspeed discs) and brembo 2 pots on the rear

From what everyone is saying on here:
It would appear the newage with the 4 pots are just to heavy for the thin little discs, The pads seem to be too good (Work really well for 15 minutes), The discs can't take the heat and then distroy the pads.

There doesn't seem to be many problems on those with bigger brake kits. Subaru put the brembo's on the STI's for a reason!!

To be honest, if your going on track I wouldn't rely on the standard 4 pot brake set up, use the money from a track day and get better brakes instead.

53

iTrader: (41)

Without wishing to offend, why would you run EBC Blues if you aren't tracking your car, yellows are pretty awesome on road. And secondly if you are tracking the car why would you rely on wrx 4 pots ? Right tool for the right job IMHO.

Perhaps EBC made a mistake offering blues for smaller sized brake setups without caveat. It would seem wrx sized setups do not have the capacity to dissipate heat like a larger brembo setup.

Interesting though

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

Interesting reading other people's experiences with NDX pads, although I don't use them myself.

One observation I would make is that there are quite a few remarks on the various threads about Subaru brakes regarding the suitability and use of 4 pot calipers for track work. Of course there will always be a desire for upgrades to better equipment, but there are plenty of instances of Group N cars giving their brakes absolute death and only running standard 4 pot calipers and not having serious problems with pads or discs attributable to heat retention.

Not being argumentative, but I don't think they should be dismissed out of hand for track use, that's all.

Godspeed Brakes

iTrader: (259)

I ran a Group N Impreza for a couple of years , I used either Carbonne Lorraine or Ferodo DS3000's , discs will last me 200 miles , pads would go slightly more , the seals would need changing at the same time as the pads as they would be melted !

So your comment above is wrong , you can get them working , but at a cost

I-am-Cos

iTrader: (6)

Thanks for all your replies so far.

It appears that some people have issues with 4 pots using Bluestuff, whilst none have reported (so far) problems with 4 pots on other pads. Although dazzer98 seemed to have no problems after 10 minutes of running the Blues. It would be good to know if they would have stood up to a bit more abuse over a longer time.

The general consenus is to go for larger brakes as in the Sti - which is a valid statement & one I'll be looking into. However, as has already been said, if the WRX 4 pot caliper set-up isn't up to the job of track days, why make a pad for them specific for track days? & besides there are others who've had no problems using different pads.

I'm currently still waiting for Andy Freeman (EBC) to send me either a set of Pagids or Ferodo's to test alongside the replacement Bluestuffs he's already sent me.

As soon as these are received and I get 5 minutes off work, Ill try them both & give my feedback.

I appreciate there are quite a few variables here and I just want to resolve this problem, so the more feedback from the Subaru community the better.

Thanks again for taking the time to share your experiences.

Blue by You

iTrader: (23)

Ian I wouldn't pretend to have either the knowledge or experience of someone like yourself.
I didn't say anything about the expected lifespan given harsh treatment.
All I implied was that they didn't exhibit issues like some people have experienced with 4 pots and NDX pads in combination.
It would be interesting to have heard your eperiences of the 4 pot/NDX combination though, had you had the opportunity to try it.

stockcar

we always used Pagid rs15's and a good quality cast iron disc on the grpN cars and seals would last for over a season (never had any joy with ds3000/carbon lorraine with our customers) so i personally fail to see how the specific issue raises its head with the new blue stuff

the hamster

iTrader: (7)

This makes interesting reading for me.

I have a 2000 classic with 4 pots and i'm off to the Nurburgring in June. I usually do 2 laps per day (with a break between laps) over a weekend as a bit of fun (9-10 min laps) plus I'll be doing a trackday at Cadwell this year. This will be my 1st year at the Ring in an Impreza.

As the car spends 99% of its time on the road but gets driven quite hard I was going to go with the Godspeed drilled/grooved disks and kevlar pads all round but was tempted to get the Blues. I've run EBC Redstuffs on most of my cars i've taken to the ring and they work perfectly but on the road they take ages to heat up so i'm hoping for a better all round pad/disk combo. Hopefully the Kevlars will do what I need?

s70rjw

iTrader: (2)

Don't think Ian recommends the kevlar pads for trackdays. Bob

micaredwrx

iTrader: (3)

My first thoughts on the NDX pads...

Post 235

https://www.scoobynet.com/786248-ful...l#post10034461

EmzWRX

iTrader: (2)

Don't you have k-sports Jon?? X

micaredwrx

iTrader: (3)

Not yet EMZ, But it's the next thing on the (never ending) shopping list
My Brembo's aren't really up to the job anymore.

EmzWRX

iTrader: (2)

Arrrrrr but you are on more than wrx calipers!!! Cos was looking for feedback on WRX calipers!! get it spent

micaredwrx

iTrader: (3)

I've tried WRX 4 pots on track and am at a loss to understand why anyone would expect them to perform with any sustained abuse tbh?

EmzWRX

iTrader: (2)

Yer I know, what do they know about anything......

Marin

iTrader: (1)

I have the Ian Godney discs and kevlar pads on my RB5 in the standard size -the kevlar pads are nice for normal road use and the odd quicker blast but have had them fade after 3 big stops into roundabouts on a deserted dual carraigeway. I don't do track days but don't think the kevlars would last long before giving up on a standard 4 pot set up on track.

scoobyd00999

iTrader: (1)

Its worth noting that changing the fluid to a better quailty one and braided hoses all round will make a big difference.

Also when people are talking about the bluestuff/wrx 4 pots is this with 2 pot rears or just the single pot???