Don't buy any new brakes till you read here
19 February 2002, 11:11 PM
#1
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Do not buy anything yet as there is shortly to be a kit available that will completely ou perform anything current and will be considerably cheaper.
All I ask is that you wait a couple of weeks until the final tests have been completed.
Trust me I'm going to put them on my STI320.
They look the B*******ks too.
All I ask is that you wait a couple of weeks until the final tests have been completed.
Trust me I'm going to put them on my STI320.
They look the B*******ks too.
20 February 2002, 08:43 AM
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Completely outpeforms anything available today AND considerably cheaper....
If it sound too good to be true it probably is.
I don't think anything new and cheap can match the parts that AP-Racing makes. After all they've made high-peformance brakes for quite a few years, and I can't see any way a "new" company could make anything better.
Possibly Brembo or Wilwood could match the quality but it won't be much cheaper.
If it sound too good to be true it probably is.
I don't think anything new and cheap can match the parts that AP-Racing makes. After all they've made high-peformance brakes for quite a few years, and I can't see any way a "new" company could make anything better.
Possibly Brembo or Wilwood could match the quality but it won't be much cheaper.
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20 February 2002, 10:40 AM
#8
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Oooh....they look just like the Brembo calipers on our forthcoming STi7's.....
http://www.kad-uk.com/calipers.htm
http://www.kad-uk.com/calipers.htm
20 February 2002, 03:59 PM
#11
Dave , sorry missed that one , the calipers use the same pads as the AP's , but this caliper uses the smaller type pad , slightly smaller than the standard subaru calipers , These KAD calipers are very well made though , probably one of the nicest ones I have seen ,
We can offer these calipers with our 308mm disc and bells kits , complete with mintex M1144 pads and brackets for £1000 inc VAT
Cheers , Ian
[Edited by Ian Godney - 2/20/2002 4:04:28 PM]
[Edited by Ian Godney - 2/20/2002 4:09:37 PM]
We can offer these calipers with our 308mm disc and bells kits , complete with mintex M1144 pads and brackets for £1000 inc VAT
Cheers , Ian
[Edited by Ian Godney - 2/20/2002 4:04:28 PM]
[Edited by Ian Godney - 2/20/2002 4:09:37 PM]
25 February 2002, 06:01 PM
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I am happy to share my findings with one and all but get put off by the muppets that always think they know, but don't.
Yes they are KAD brakes but no they are not the ones mentioned above they are even bigger and better than those.
The grade of the aluminium hes gone up as has have the piston sizes and the braking ability.
The discs are being manufactured to similar specs to Porsche and the calipers will out perform any mainstream manufacturer.
They will be less expensive than their equivalent competitors and the finnish will be a work of art.
Let me finnish by saying that KAD are huge in Japan where their brakes are used in high level races and we are well aware that the Japanese know a thing or two about perfomance and cars.
Nuff said visit the wedd site yourselves it is the G Caliper.
www.kad-uk.com
J.
Yes they are KAD brakes but no they are not the ones mentioned above they are even bigger and better than those.
The grade of the aluminium hes gone up as has have the piston sizes and the braking ability.
The discs are being manufactured to similar specs to Porsche and the calipers will out perform any mainstream manufacturer.
They will be less expensive than their equivalent competitors and the finnish will be a work of art.
Let me finnish by saying that KAD are huge in Japan where their brakes are used in high level races and we are well aware that the Japanese know a thing or two about perfomance and cars.
Nuff said visit the wedd site yourselves it is the G Caliper.
www.kad-uk.com
J.
25 February 2002, 06:14 PM
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I must say, they seem EXTREMELY expensive to me. Their 'G' calipers are £610 plus vat each compared to the Hi Spec 6 pot which is more or less identical apart from the fact that it has a larger piston area (more powerful) and only costs £225 + vat per caliper :O.
Maybe maths wasn't your strong point at school..
MS
Maybe maths wasn't your strong point at school..
MS
27 February 2002, 07:34 PM
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Larger piston area does not mean more powerfull at all.
Get your facts right.
It means a larger piston area.
Why don't you ring KAD and ask them.
Or better than that tell them seeing as you know it all.
J.
Get your facts right.
It means a larger piston area.
Why don't you ring KAD and ask them.
Or better than that tell them seeing as you know it all.
J.
27 February 2002, 10:22 PM
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Larger piston area, means that the master cylinder has to flow more liquid. NOT ALWAYS A GOOD THING.
The first set of uprated calipers had pistons that where too big, so I didnt get a good brake pedal until it hit the floor.
I have not seen or been in a car with the KAD setup, so cannot comment. I have however seen and been in a car that has the Hi-Spec 6 pots, now theres a set of calipers.
Dan
The first set of uprated calipers had pistons that where too big, so I didnt get a good brake pedal until it hit the floor.
I have not seen or been in a car with the KAD setup, so cannot comment. I have however seen and been in a car that has the Hi-Spec 6 pots, now theres a set of calipers.
Dan
28 February 2002, 12:23 AM
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Joseph, you contradict yourself.
You say:
"The grade of the aluminium has gone up as have the piston sizes and the braking ability."
Which it is not unreasonable to assume means that you are saying that larger pistons equal better braking ability, so make your mind up mate.
The Hi Spec 6 pots have just very slightly larger piston area than the AP six pots, but use a slightly smaller pad. This means that they are more effective on the road as the pads reach their optimum temp more easily, yet will not have the ultimate stopping power of the AP6 on the track.
I would say the AP6 is still the ultimate track caliper, not so much beacuse of the caliper design, but because of the extra surface area provided by the larger pad.
IMHO of course!
MS
[Edited by Martin J Stirling - 2/28/2002 12:51:05 AM]
You say:
"The grade of the aluminium has gone up as have the piston sizes and the braking ability."
Which it is not unreasonable to assume means that you are saying that larger pistons equal better braking ability, so make your mind up mate.
The Hi Spec 6 pots have just very slightly larger piston area than the AP six pots, but use a slightly smaller pad. This means that they are more effective on the road as the pads reach their optimum temp more easily, yet will not have the ultimate stopping power of the AP6 on the track.
I would say the AP6 is still the ultimate track caliper, not so much beacuse of the caliper design, but because of the extra surface area provided by the larger pad.
IMHO of course!
MS
[Edited by Martin J Stirling - 2/28/2002 12:51:05 AM]
28 February 2002, 08:29 AM
#20
Martin , You say the Hi-Spec calipers are more suited to the road as the smaller pads reach there optimum temp quicker than the AP 6 pots , All you need to do if this was the case is change to a more suitable pad compound , The bigger pad calipers will work better , I have the AP 6 pots fitted to my rally car with my own 335mm x 32mm discs , I changed recently from the AP 330 4 pot kit , And the difference is amazing , it has made me about one and a half seconds a mile quicker , which in rallying terms is a lot . The pads in the Hi-Spec 6 pot calipers are the same pads as the AP 4 pot calipers so I cant see they are going to be any better , You could argue that there is a longer area which the pads are clamped , but as the pistons are smaller you dont have the width as you do on the AP 4 pots , The AP 6 pots uses a much bigger pad.
The Kad calipers 6 pot calipers also use the same pads as the AP 4 pots , We have used these calipers in the past and they are very good , very well made , I have not used the Hi-Spec ones yet but they also look very well made , But out of all the calipers available to me to be used with my discs I rate the AP as the best .
Cheers , Ian
The Kad calipers 6 pot calipers also use the same pads as the AP 4 pots , We have used these calipers in the past and they are very good , very well made , I have not used the Hi-Spec ones yet but they also look very well made , But out of all the calipers available to me to be used with my discs I rate the AP as the best .
Cheers , Ian
28 February 2002, 01:05 PM
#21
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Ian.
fair enough mate.
I agree that the AP 6 pot is superior, I never doubted it. I have heard from other people's experience that the AP 6 pot was 'overkill' for solely road use and was not as effective from cold as the 4 pot due to the size of the pad. For rally use, I'm sure they are ideal, but I am talking about road use here.
All the best,
MS
fair enough mate.
I agree that the AP 6 pot is superior, I never doubted it. I have heard from other people's experience that the AP 6 pot was 'overkill' for solely road use and was not as effective from cold as the 4 pot due to the size of the pad. For rally use, I'm sure they are ideal, but I am talking about road use here.
All the best,
MS
28 February 2002, 03:57 PM
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one thing about movits, as some might claim I'm a bit of an expert on them
the movits are more or less OEM porsche kit, the calipers are a great monobloc design, but one of the best things is the discs themselves, or to be more specific the 'vane' system used to cool them. One assumes that if that could be replicated that would help as well.
interested to see pics and pricing info on the new KAD kits though. Have seen advert for KAD brakes in a mag before, did look good.
As for "better than AP's" well, we'll have to see about that. probably start an argument along the lines of movit's better than AP's. Suffice to say that I think AP's movits, Hi Spec and Godspeed kits are all excellent, it's all about what you're after and what you want to pay for what your after.
the movits are more or less OEM porsche kit, the calipers are a great monobloc design, but one of the best things is the discs themselves, or to be more specific the 'vane' system used to cool them. One assumes that if that could be replicated that would help as well.
interested to see pics and pricing info on the new KAD kits though. Have seen advert for KAD brakes in a mag before, did look good.
As for "better than AP's" well, we'll have to see about that. probably start an argument along the lines of movit's better than AP's. Suffice to say that I think AP's movits, Hi Spec and Godspeed kits are all excellent, it's all about what you're after and what you want to pay for what your after.
02 March 2002, 01:50 AM
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Martin I was not contradicting myself I was saying that It is not just about piston size..
Many other factors have to be taken into account such as flex or rather rigidity, heat dispersion, quality of materials. Disc play an equaly important role and again all if the above apply.
Then you can also take into account that most of the other callipers are cast in a mould which is cheaper and of a lesser quality than those that have been machined from a solid billet of alluminium which should give improved performance.
If a brake is tooo powerful it is likely to lock the wheels and therefore you would loose control and not stop as efficiently.
The comparison is like a TVR and an STI. One much more powerful the other much more balanced and overall the balanced car will be quicker overal. (if it is driven by the same person uder the same conditions on varying surfaces).
J.
Many other factors have to be taken into account such as flex or rather rigidity, heat dispersion, quality of materials. Disc play an equaly important role and again all if the above apply.
Then you can also take into account that most of the other callipers are cast in a mould which is cheaper and of a lesser quality than those that have been machined from a solid billet of alluminium which should give improved performance.
If a brake is tooo powerful it is likely to lock the wheels and therefore you would loose control and not stop as efficiently.
The comparison is like a TVR and an STI. One much more powerful the other much more balanced and overall the balanced car will be quicker overal. (if it is driven by the same person uder the same conditions on varying surfaces).
J.
02 March 2002, 02:33 PM
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Mark A,
yes, both the HI Spec 6 pot and the KAD 6 use the same pad as the AP 4 pot. This means that there are larger options in terms of pad choice. The caliper itself is slightly more powerful than the AP4 though. A good compromise between the AP 4 and the AP 6 pot IMHO.
MS
yes, both the HI Spec 6 pot and the KAD 6 use the same pad as the AP 4 pot. This means that there are larger options in terms of pad choice. The caliper itself is slightly more powerful than the AP4 though. A good compromise between the AP 4 and the AP 6 pot IMHO.
MS
02 March 2002, 10:31 PM
#28
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You are talking compleat Bollocks and you are vary much mis informed.
The calliper I am speaking of are much bigger than the ones you are.
Have a look on KAD's site and get up to date.
It is the G calliper NOT the F.
Bye
J.
The calliper I am speaking of are much bigger than the ones you are.
Have a look on KAD's site and get up to date.
It is the G calliper NOT the F.
Bye
J.
02 March 2002, 10:45 PM
#29
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Just so you all know that I know what I'm talking about
The type F calliper my friend above is thinking of has a piston size of 30.6cm2 and a pad area of 48.74cm2
The G calliper I am reffering to has piston 37.8cm2 and pad of 57.4cm2.
A little bit bigger wouldn't you say?!
J.
The type F calliper my friend above is thinking of has a piston size of 30.6cm2 and a pad area of 48.74cm2
The G calliper I am reffering to has piston 37.8cm2 and pad of 57.4cm2.
A little bit bigger wouldn't you say?!
J.
03 March 2002, 07:38 PM
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This is so funny!
YOU, I am afraid is the one talking from your rear aperture.
The AP 4 pot caliper has a pad area of 57.4 cm2 which as I CORRECTLY stated earlier is the same size pad as the one used in both the 'G' KAD 6 pots and the Hi Spec 6 pots. Check the link below if you dare doubt me!
http://www.apracing.com/roadcar/cali...?family=CP5200
The AP 6 pot is ultimately more powerful than either the KAD 6 pot or the Hi Spec 6, because although having roughly the same piston area, it has a much larger pad of 76.8cm2. Again, if you dont believe me check this:
http://www.apracing.com/roadcar/cali...?family=CP5555
As far as I can see, the Hi Spec 6 and the KAD 6 are near identical apart from the slightly different piston sizes. Both are CNC machined from billet aluminium etc, the price is the only real differentiator; the KAD are a rip off!
I think I deserve an apology..
MS
YOU, I am afraid is the one talking from your rear aperture.
The AP 4 pot caliper has a pad area of 57.4 cm2 which as I CORRECTLY stated earlier is the same size pad as the one used in both the 'G' KAD 6 pots and the Hi Spec 6 pots. Check the link below if you dare doubt me!
http://www.apracing.com/roadcar/cali...?family=CP5200
The AP 6 pot is ultimately more powerful than either the KAD 6 pot or the Hi Spec 6, because although having roughly the same piston area, it has a much larger pad of 76.8cm2. Again, if you dont believe me check this:
http://www.apracing.com/roadcar/cali...?family=CP5555
As far as I can see, the Hi Spec 6 and the KAD 6 are near identical apart from the slightly different piston sizes. Both are CNC machined from billet aluminium etc, the price is the only real differentiator; the KAD are a rip off!
I think I deserve an apology..
MS