Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Hi All,

As I've been overseas much of this year - my car has pretty much done 200 road miles and then 3 Blyton Park trackdays.

At the start of the year I noticed after a full track day that my drivers' caliper would take on a slightly darker tone of gold - but after cooling down would no longer be noticeable.

I run RC5+ pads on track, but swap them out for road use as they're noisy and dusty. I last had the pads out in July approx 150 road miles and 2 trackdays ago and they all looked fine, loads of meat.

I finished my (likely) last trackday of the year on Sunday, so monday morning I swapped my pads out for road stuff - and was quite astonished at what I found!

Passenger caliper:

Driver caliper:


And then my RC5+ Pads...


The front left pad there is the "inside" pad of my drivers' caliper - so evidently it has been stuck on for much of the day and has caused the caliper to overheat (colour) and scrub off all the meat.

Oddly, when I swapped the pads out - I had no issues manipulating all of the pistons to get my road pads back in, it doesn't feel as if anything has seized.

Needless to say, these calipers will be getting a full refurb and repaint over winter - but I was curious as to whether anyone has seen/achieved this before?

I've not been particularly happy with my trackday braking all year - but then my only comparison for reference are a couple of Clio 182's that I get to ride in, which can brake so much later than I can and are much more stable too... though they have most definitely got physics on their side.

I'm hopeful that a good refurb and new pads will fix my braking for next year, but also am considering an AP kit too.

Any thoughts?

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi there

At first I wouldn't compare braking with Renault or most of the cars,those cars doesn't run power like you are running and they're lighter and on other side,I think their brakes are bit over power steered,we have previously Megane 225 and this car has stopped lot later than Subaru with AP or K-sport

And about the yours calipers,I've seen only once something like this,but I would suspect those brakes pads are more aggressive in therm of the pad deposit,friend has have similar issue on his EVO with some brake pads,when they discolored his newly painted brake calipers or as you are suggesting they are sticking,when I'm looking on uneven brake pad wear,did you tried contact seller of those pads ?

Something similar happens to my brother when one caliper on his EP3(rear one) has started to stick and he have similar not even pad wear,but everything has worked,we can easily replace pads,nothing obvious,but we can agree,its sticking

You will see how you get on,but you will see there

Thanks,Jura

bustaMOVEs

iTrader: (31)

Looks like a sticky inner caliper to me.
I see a lot of pad deposits there too,,the rc5+ I think is more of a 'mixed type compound hence the deposits as its only good for fast road in a newage,IMO if you are tracking it hard (especially in a newage which is quite heavy compared to other on track with you)
I can only 'think' the rc5+ will only be good on clios and classic imprezas etc, but for a newage I'd say rc6 is the only way to go, with rc6 you won't get any pad deposits whats so ever. I think the difference between the 2 pads is more/less metallic compound.
But rc6 will be more dusty and dirty as you say, but will perform better in a newage. I loved mine in the wagon.

Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Thanks Gents,

Jura - I know I can't beat physics, but the sheer performance advantage of the clios even on stock brakes/pads/etc is shocking and I'd like to close that gap if possible. Being able to brake later would be nice, but my main concern is braking stability. The issues that have caused my toasted caliper above may be contributing to my instability issues - so I'm hoping a caliper rebuild or AP upgrade will solve both problems

Busta, you're right the pads are depositing more and more. It only seems to be the last trackday in which they've dumped so much onto the disks. Either I'm driving harder now (which I am, learning and pushing boundaries etc) or the pads have done enough "cycles" and are giving up on me.

Other than this little hiccup, the RC5+s have been excellent to me - so moving onto the 6 is something I wouldn't hesitate to do. Noise/Dust isn't much of a concern for me, as I swap back to some generic kevlars for road use anyway.

I may look at some brake cooling mods over winter too, perhaps some tubing from the fog covers but not sure how much I'm pissing into the wind with that one. I do respect the brakes and always do a cooldown lap of no brake usage and sometimes run up and down the paddock too.

bustaMOVEs

iTrader: (31)

On your last track day, when you say you are pushing harder etc, did the pads preform as good as they were?
If not, then I think you are finding the limits of them on a newage motor.

You might be better off getting a spare set of track wheels as I know your so **** of a clean car lol, or get some iron x and wash after trackday

Cadwell is a tight twisty track and the rc6 preformed good on there for me for a good 30-40 mins sessions.

Your car is never going to be as quick as clios, mx5s and simlar round corners and braking zones, only the straights is where you'll make it up I'm afraid.

What tyres do you run on track?

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi there

I know what you mean,when we are been on track day last time,some cars has braked lot later than we are,but on straight and in corners there has been different story there

Yes late braking would give you some advantage,we are not run ABS and this has give us bit better brake feel,although first time we didn't know that as our Dash2 didn't show us ABS light,but we are like a lot this

And about the upgrading to AP,did you think about the upgrading or running different pads,I've very good experience with PF pads and PF discs they will handle lot more than stock discs and pads,not sure I've not tried RC5+,I've run only DS2500 and Pagid and PF pads

Did you tried AP setup on similar car like you are running?

Brake cooling,yes something brake ducts definitely can help,ducting to the fog can be great idea,some people run this with great success

Thanks,Jura

Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Thanks again Jura.

Although I'm running reasonable pads, I'm still running "cheap and cheerful" disks so perhaps I would gain a lot by refurbing my Brembo's and swapping out disks and pads for something a little meaner.

It will of course be cheaper than going AP - but if I don't gain much then I'll be still tempted by the AP route, and will end up spending twice on my brakes!

Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Pads didn't really let me down all day - not in terms of fade anyway. My braking distances don't appear to be any different based on previous GoPro footage.

I was running brand new R888's this weekend and I do run them on their own wheels. My PFF7's are my "tart" wheels

Godspeed Brakes

iTrader: (259)

I doubt it will be a piston sticking , it's more likely corrosion built up under the pad plates causing the pads to jam in the caliper , the pads dragging has caused the discolouration of the caliper and the one worn pad , it could be a piston if the dust boot is damaged , but of the caliper we get it to recondition , it's mostly the pad plates.
Both are a fairly easy fix
Cheers Ian

Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Thanks Ian, based on my ability to easily push the pistons in and out - I'm inclined to agree with that diagnosis.

I'll strip my calipers down I think... if nothing else I need to paint them as having a brown caliper isn't the "in" thing I don't think

Do you sell the refurb kits? I could do with new pins/clips the works too - to tart them up a bit

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Hi there

Yes agree you are running reasonable pads with which you should have good braking,but as above/bellow pointed out Ian then best way probably will be refurbing the brakes

It will be cheaper to stick with Brembo,but still I would at least think about the going with AP setup,you can buy used set for reasonable money and you will gain with them too,really depends what you want

If you are thinking go with better discs and pads then this will cost you more plus refurb calipers and piston set plus everything is not cheap etc,really I would go with AP,when I'm just think on that

Thanks,Jura

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

By the sounds of it you need a set of AP's in your life. I'm not even using the best pads in the world (ds2500) and I have zero problems, they just do what it says on the tin.

I think you'll be wasting your money on the brembo's because by the time you have bought new pads, new discs a refirb kit and painted the calipers your a good portion of the way to a set of AP's, add to that the £350/400 you will get for the brembo's and you would only be a couple of hundred quid off shiny new AP's.
You could even wait for a decent secondhand set, I have seen about 3 sets go this year for between £600 and £800 and that's without me looking for them.

Even if you do refirb the brembo's they will never be as good as AP's, there is a good reason they command a premium over just about any other brake set up on the market.

Fonzey

iTrader: (5)

Sold

jura11

iTrader: (7)

Agree with Ditch,you need AP and I would start with blank canvas with AP,as above pointed out Ditch,its easy to buy now used AP for £600-£800,I've seen 6 pot AP with 355mm for £900 last time with Pagid RS pads

Thanks,Jura