vava voom

iTrader: (6)

Hi Guys

Ive passed by boring Audi Q7 to the wife and am looking at a 2008 Hatch STI 60k with full dealer history for £11k, can i get some information in relation to faults and what i need to look out for?

The car has not been modified at all and has 2 previous owners but am i correct in thinking the belt needs to be done around 60k? if yes how much will this cost?

I know the running cost may be a bit high as well as the tax but any other downers?

Thank you in advance for all your help

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Thread at top of the page in General section - 2.5L engine failures. Read it and weep!

Please think seriously before spending your hard earned on a hatch STI, you may need an extra £3K at any moment for an engine rebuild. Others will come on here and tell you it's nonsnese, but read the evidence in that thread. Not saying it will happen, but it could!

If you have a spare £3k set to one side then no worries

mrmadcap

Have you got something on your computer that flashes when someone on any forum anywhere on the planet mentions a Subaru 2008 STI Hatch?

thenewgalaxy

Unfortunately the blunt words of that lardgy-German barge lover above are spot on.

The Hatch STi is the fastest and most able of the Impreza STis to date but is unfortunately let down on our shores by an engine that is prone to head gasket and piston failures.

£11k is a bargain for one in good condition, you are certainly getting a lot of ability for not much money. But there is the uncertainty of an engine failure hanging over all owners of these cars.

I would suggest buying it and forging the engine for peace of mind, or going for one that has had a set of forged pistons and uprated head gaskets fitted with a remap. These tend to be fine.

If you buy one of these cars it is wise to get keen on modifying them, as they can be turned into devastatingly quick machines (even quicker than the formidable base product) with a bit of work.

Suberman

Aside to the weak pistons in the 2.5 STI, it's otherwise a very good road car. Very happy with mine for the past 6 years. 65k on the original engine and still running strong.

Weak areas:
Power steering pump
Factory pistons doesn't withstand to frequent hard driving

So if you are prepared to do a forged piston rebuild, there's nothing much you have to worry about. Give it a tune and an exhaust and you'll have yourself a very quick road car.

thenewgalaxy

If the OP has £11-12k budget you should get in touch with this chap about this forged hatch https://www.scoobynet.com/showpost.p...ostcount=11400

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Nope, I just get sick of the stupid advice from the Subaru apologists on here who say buy it and just make sure you have a spare £3K lying around to rebuild the engine as if £3K is just pocket money! The model has a design fault for which it should have been recalled and was in the US where they have proper sales laws!

People need to be aware before parting with their cash that this is a serious issue! They'd be better looking for one that has already been rebuilt for peace of mind IMO!

thenewgalaxy put a post in that failures thread the other day which is pretty much the best summary of the situation I have read. It's here:

https://www.scoobynet.com/showpost.p...postcount=1354

There was a good follow up pst by API too, it's here:

https://www.scoobynet.com/showpost.p...postcount=1358

mrmadcap

The OP has just given his missus a butt ugly Q7 so I don't think the fact that an engine ****ting itself (if it ever does) will be much of an issue financially, particularly if he end up with forged internals or whatever the specialists do to these things.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

As I said that is the problem on here, most people seem to think a £3k engine rebuild is nothing more than a minor inconvenience as you have just amply demonstrated!

As for a Q7 being butt ugly it will be a good match for the hatch STI then

mrmadcap

Yes, its only an inconvenience if you can afford it, but a few people on here throw cash at their cars even if the engine is good, and some of these are 20 odd year old classics.

And as for the Q7, what's the price of one of those munters compared to Subaru?

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

I think the OP will decide if he can afford it or not, not us!

Q7 worth anything from £10K upwards depending on age, condition.... not sure why that is relevant really!

salsa-king

that is so true we all know ppl who will spend thousands on a 'classic' that now 14yrs+ old and cost as little as £1200 on SubaruSwapShop on FB.

In the bigger scheme of things £3-4k on a engine build that will see 400bhp isn't that bad.. is it?

you could also buy a HawkEye and also get engine issues... not every car has gone pop though.

thenewgalaxy

Agreed Phil.

My R32 could drop its DSG gearbox at any minute and our Ford is fitted with the 1.6 that's famous for having a turbo that ****s itself.

Four figure bills if it goes wrong.

Expensive failures are part of owning a car these days, the fact that a Subaru is a high performance car with a complex engine means those costs are high. However given Subaru's record of reliability and excellence it is not acceptable the way they dealt with the 2.5 issue (e.g. sweeping it under the carpet).

Various 911s and Evos have recognised engine problems too as I recall! and I have been told in conversation about problems with Focus RS's coming out now.

If you like the hatch STi, know what you're buying and get stuck in. It's a brilliant car. And a better one if you want to throw some money at it!

salsa-king

oh my wife's 2005 Ghia 1.6 TDCi had the Turbo let go a few years ago.. luck she had extended warranty and it was covered.. almost £2k. Google search shows it's not an uncommon issue, but not big enough for a recall... but there was TSB sheet for it as the dealers were aware of the issue and the 'fix'. It came down to a wrong oil problem, the turbo broke up and dropped in the engine. Engine need flushing three times and of course a new turbo fitted.

My sisters 2007 Golf GTsport 2.0TDi has also had a new turbo a few years back also!!!

Kedlestone

iTrader: (9)

Sorry OP off topic, when I was researching past service history on our hatch I spoke to the dealer that first sold the car and she flat out denied that there had been any engine issues with the 2.5. I decided to try and correct her and she basically stood there and kept lying to my face. She asked me where I was getting all the info from, I told her through sites, forums and more importantly owners! She still denied there were any issues Could have handled better....definitely

thenewgalaxy

One dealer told me that for them the issues with the p1 were a far bigger problem than the 2.5 ever has been.

I'm quite sure some dealers have had very few warranty claims and others many more.

But denying the problem, that's naughty

vava voom

iTrader: (6)

I agree and thank F1 FAN, i was hoping to buy this car as a weekend toy as i have my company car to drive in the week however spending another £3k over the £11k is not something i wish to do and looking at the hundreds of people angry over the engine failures has turned me away

The Q7 is a bit expensive but having the 3l diesel engine in it helps as these engines and boxes are very strong and good for 150k miles+, mines just been run in at 30k miles

Do the new 2011 saloon sti suffer from the same engine problems? i've seen one for £17k in a garage with 30k on the clock

thenewgalaxy

I don't believe we have seen one yet, there are only 120 or so.

But do the maths, you're saying you won't throw £3k at a hatch but you'd spend £6k more on another? If you want one, just get one and know what you're letting yourself in for.

If you really want a thrill why not have a look at the engine reliability rate of your fancy Audi? It'll horrify you!

I am not sure the failure rate is as high as it appears to be on here to be honest, were it a wider issue there would have been a recall.

I know plenty of people who have owned hatches and hawks without any problems.

vava voom

iTrader: (6)

Yes but for the few grand more i get a newer car with a bigger boot and better looks, also if the newer 2.5 dont suffer from the same issues as the hatch do then its a win win situation. Having read all the info on this website about the hatch 2.5 it makes me want to think twice before putting my foot down in a hatch as it may go pop, my question is did Subaru sort the newer 2.5's out?

No the Audi engines are more or less bullet proof, yes you do have ones which fail but they tend to go if they are not looked after and not simply because you put your foot down.

thenewgalaxy

I'm not going to get into a slanging match but "Audi engines" and "bulletproof" are not words that go together.

Audi are famous for high engine failure rates and having had three close friends experience diesels and petrols going in and out of warranty I can assure you it is not just an isolated problem. Having had a string of petrol and diesel Mercs in the family over the years, I'd go so far as to say Mercedes cars are wholly unreliable (three gearboxes, a complete electrics failure, two engines and two sets of suspension in five cars all within four years of first registration) but you tolerate that as the product is otherwise good.

Audi engine failure rate is second across all manufacturers within initial warranty period - http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-new...ngine-failures

That doesn't take into account know issues across the VAG range with their gearboxes and general electrics. Got a late MkV golf myself mate it's a temperamental so and so, only five years old too.

I'm not going to make any excuses for 2.5 engines having suffered one myself on a Hawkeye that was five years old but the fact is that you take a risk on any car as most models these days have a known fault. It would appear that some 2.5s blow up, as for numbers it's hard to tell. The latest models appear to suffer from the issue less but the revisions were small and anything less than a well forged engine would not suffice for me.

salsa-king

the saloon boot is no bigger, if anything not as big.. that's why I went HATCH... i get two pushchairs in fine and the associated baby bags that go with them etc. and can still pull the cover over.
When we looked at the saloon there didn't seem the same sort of room in it.

Tidgy

Jdm or rebuilt hawk sti, hatch isnt a proper impreza,,,,

Ding ding, round 1,,,,,,, lol

salsa-king

but you only have a rebulit WRX in a copy colour of WR1 blue

Tidgy

Different colour to wr1, plus it has alot less layers of paint on the wheels and stickers on the car than yours, o plus mine sounds Like a scoob should,,,,,,

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

Er if you do the maths on the hatch it's worth £11K even if it blows its engine and costs you another £3K ergo you are -£3K whereas if you spend £17K on a car that doesn't blow its engine you are evens!

thenewgalaxy

In my mind the outlay there is potentially £14k vs £20k worst case scenario.

Would you be confident that the engine in a 2.5 saloon isn't going to suffer the same fate as similar engines with little in the way of internal revision since 2004?

I wouldn't touch a 2.5 without a set of forged pistons myself.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

My maths scenario included the assumption that the 2011 car wasn't going to suffer this issue as otherwise vava voom wouldn't be buying it as he had already indicated.

I am not of sufficient knowledge to say whether the engines in the later cars have the same issues or not, but your reply to suggest he does the math was IMO slightly misleading as really what you mean is the 2011 car could suffer the same issue in your opinion.

I guess all I mean is that if you buy a car for £X that costs an extra £3K for an engine rebuild it it will still be worth £X and you will be -£3K whereas if you buy a car for £YK that doesn't needs an engine rebuild (i.e. a different car or an already forged hatch) you will be evens all other things being equal!

lordharding

iTrader: (1)

Reading the famous engine blown thread there has been a couple of salloon engines gone pop allready including I lad from the North east and there wasn't many sold 100-130?
So seems like the problem is starting with them too along woth a couple of boxer diesels too
Think the way forward is. A forged STi if the op is patience and waits untill a good one pops up for sale although at 08/09 STi will be getting cheaper as anyone in the know will not buy them with the standard engine
The values will go down as dealers will struggle to sell them and maybe there will be some bargain STi in a few months time as any newby coming in here is given the correct facts about the engines instread if the saleman in the dealerships

thenewgalaxy

That would indicate something like 1.5 to 2% within a three year warranty period if it is just a couple in 100-130 or so. Is that acceptable for a high performance engine?

I believe that problem was caused by the main bearing in the first boxer diesels not being up to the job. As far as I know the issue has been sorted in the 2010MY engines onward.

-> Thoughts, this must have been a big issue for them to revise an engine so soon as they've done very little about the 2.5 STi.

Spot on John but the hatch STis are already a bargain if you ask me. I would go for an already forged car built by a well-known specialist but even if you can't get hold of one and buy a stock car I don't think adding the price of a forged rebuild is that big a deal for what you're getting out of it.

The OP here is potentially looking at a car that he could march down to say API in Warwickshire and end up with a reliable fast spooling and very torquey 365bhp for a total outlay of £14k, assuming he doesn't haggle at any point.

If you don't think it's worth it go and buy an older car. Newage Blobeyes start around half that.

f1_fan

iTrader: (9)

This is where I think the problem is though. You are looking at this completely through enthusiast's eyes.

Yes he could do that and he would have a great car, but let's say he lost his job and needed to move it on he still only has a car worth £11K whereas if he spent £14K on a car wth a book value of £14K he would have a car worth £14K - all other things being equal of course.

Some people can't afford or don't wnat to just 'lose' that £3K to get a car that Subaru should have already been providing in the first place!

If it was me I would try for an already forged example or l would look elsewhere!