logic1980

Ok after being silly in another thread ( my first sorry ) I thought id change the question for a start at a new project im planning.

Blob Impreza 450 BHP - the bench mark is to take on my dads 911 GT3 ( which he is planning to get ) and not get spanked so we looking at 0-60 times of about 3.7 seconds. But i wont be using the car to thrash it everywhere so still needs to be a smooth drive if possible.

Now back to the question - to get this kind of power what routes would need to be taken to achieve this figure in a STI and a WRX and what are the likely costs for each of the mods along the way.

thanks guys and gals

The Pink Ninja

iTrader: (23)

Turbo of choice and injectors firstly, Then a front mount and induction kit to get the benefit of the turbo and mapping, This will get you near your target and hope the clutch holds out, Around £3k all in IMO

legacy_gtb

iTrader: (3)

If you want to get GT3 performance from a wrx (assuming you mean real world and not just straight line), then power isnt top the list!

Brakes, Tyres, chassis and suspension, then when all thats sorted you can think about power!

If you start with an sti youll get some of these things already, but you should still expect to spend more on supporting mods to make the most of the engine than the engine itself.

A decent 450+ car is easily £20k+, cut corners and you'll spend miore in the long run as theres alot of cheap parts out there but the saying "buy cheap, buy twice" was never more fitting than when modding a subaru.

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

If he starts with an sti.

logic1980

and thats on the STI i assume

logic1980

sorry Matt didnt see your post -

Wow £20k mmmm - looks like i need to have a re-think in end goal. I want the car to be safe and reliable too.

so how much for the engine parts only

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

Does it have to be a blob.
I know the classic shape is getting old now but with the weight taken into consideration a 330bhp stripped out classic is a real weapon. And more importantly for you, very affordable.

logic1980

guess i am worried about the state of the old body work - but that can be looked at cant it.
guess the tax is cheaper as on the old engine size and not emissions standard - i always wanted a P1 when i was about 16-17 but they still fetch a fair bit -

logic1980

also the older the car the higher the mileage usually too and i want to keep that as low as i can afford

logic1980

forget that bit i said about tax - the p1 and the 04 sti are both £270 same as the wrx

sunnyjones003

iTrader: (12)

20k......i dont think so. Ive got my bug wrx close that that figure and didnt spend half of that figure.
At the top of my head i think i spent 9k on the car. And thats everything listed, engine, suspension etc....

Before anyone starts all the parts wernt all brand new !!!

logic1980

I guess it depends on how deep you go and which parts you buy - some people buy the best of the best ,other get cheap and most are somewhere between

toyney83

iTrader: (3)

There's a wr1 in the for sale section with a forged 2.1 stroker in it for around 10k. That would be a cracking start

legacy_gtb

iTrader: (3)

£9k?????

Good work is that!

But considering

-a built engine is easily £5k,
-a 450bhp turbo that isnt so laggy its real world (road) slower than a decent 350bhp.
turbo is a minimum of £1k
-a 6 speed conversion to cope with 450bhp is £2k
-an ecu fitted and mapped is another £1k

.... thats the £9k already without having touched wheels and tyres, brakes, suspension, bushes, fuelling, etc ..... not knocking your build sunny, but there must be some compromises in there somewhere. All the little bits add up and the jump from 350 to 450 is a big financial one!

Logic, i mentioned turbos earlyer ..... you could buy a TD06 which is good for 450bhp, but its a big old cheap turbo, so youd have a faster real world (and more likely to trouble your old mans beetle) road car if you went for a spoolyer 350bhp ..... all im saying is dont chase numbers on a budget! If you do its very easy to make it slower!

legacy_gtb

iTrader: (3)

Toyney has a VERY good point! Best way to get a modded, fast road car, on a budget is to buy a second hand one thats already built!

logic1980

I did say that my enjoyment comes from the building in another post - I guess with my build at the moment im just getting the feelers out to see what other think.

I started life thinking 2003 wrx 450bhp - then STI - 450bhp and now thinking 350BHP STI lol

i would like an engine rebuild for alot of the power as thats the fun bit for me - the engineering rather than slapping on induction and turbo and moving bits about - after all when spending money you simply have to enjoy the build and transformation.

been looking at the P1's again - seen some around £6k - would that be a good platform to start from too? aiming now between 350-400BHP

another thoughts for a £5-£6k car to start with

legacy_gtb

iTrader: (3)

Start with an sti RA (or P1) and 350bhp will feel like 450 in a heavyer newage.

sunnyjones003

iTrader: (12)

I know how much i spent legacy gtb!!!!! No cheap stuff on the car.. running a md321. I didnt have an engine rebuild and ive still got the 5speed. Im not a slow driver the car has abuce everyday with me and the box is fine and coping well before you say ITS GOING TO BLOW. Itall depends how you look after it. 2 years on the car is still pulling

Im not trying to argue here legacy but thats what i spent. Sti engine, md321 turbo, lateral injectors, walbro fuel pump, rcm full exhaust, sti suspension with stiffer coils, powerflex bushes here and there, simtek pro ecu with lag and launch. Those are the nain things. Some little bits here and there as my budget was 10k also its my day to day car with my child. If it wasnt for him i would make my car into a track car.

Gear Head

iTrader: (2)

I think you really need to work out what you want. let us know where you are. I'm sure someone local will be more than happy to take you out in their scoob, just to give you an idea.

Personally, even if I could build a car that would beat a GT3, nothing compares with knuckling down, working hard and being able to actually afford your own GT3!

Plus, if it just for road use, you really can't use the power anyway.

Sorry, I've just turned 30 and it is starting to show!

From the age of 21 to 24 I had 3 Imprezas (1 UK Turbo and 2 STI's), MR2 turbo and an Integra Type R. The STI's (classic shape) were easily the fastest for most of the time. The MR2 was dangerous (exciting though!) and the Integra Type R had to be driven at 100% to really make sense. When you did, the drive was amazing. But it felt crap just driving around town.

sunnyjones003

iTrader: (12)

Ive alwys wanted an integra R how was it for you?

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

Whats the spec chap ???

logic1980

lol - i hear ya - although i said to beat a GT3 they aint my thing - TBH iv always liked performance cars to be like Impreza's that are achievable.

I do see your point about knowing what i want and speaking here past days has made me think abit about whats important.

Guess when the chips are down on a normal road I want to be in a car that beats most things you expect to come across with ease - no ST-3 or R32 trying luck and saying "dude i almost had you"

i have patience with the project and if extra costs means more time in building and tweeking thats cool too.

guess if i buy a STI runner il have to wait another year where as I could get the non-runner WRX sooner which was in my mind.

legacy_gtb

iTrader: (3)

Not being argumentative, and im not going to say your boxes days are numbered! Your absolutely bang on that mechanical sympathy and how you use it will dictate how well the box lasts!

However, peak torque is peak torque, no matter how sympathetically you drive, and the peak torque associated with 450bhp is beyond the limits of the 5 speeds.

Does your simtec datalog? If it does, then go give it some "abuse" and check your tps sensor is regularly sitting at 100% .... Not using a car to 100% doesnt make you a slow driver, but it does mean your not giving the box all the engine has available! If im on a spirited road drive i probably rarely give it 100% that often, but on track its at 100% more than at anything else.

And launch control is a box killer, does it get used often?

Alan Jeffery

30? Jesus, book your place at the "Happy Stay Home" mate, you're done already..

Gear Head

iTrader: (2)

A very capable car in the dry with an engine that really could 'sing', especially if you removed the air box lid! The gearbox was also like winchester rifle. One of the best transmissions I have ever had the pleasure to use.
It felt like a race car for the road. But, because of that, if I managed to get myself one again, it wouldn't be my everyday car. It is very stiff, noisy and very uncomfortable on our 'usual' UK roads. Plus, at 4500rpm at 65-70mph, long distances were 'difficult' to say the least.

I do miss it though and that says it all.

sunnyjones003

iTrader: (12)

Yes legacy it datalogs i didnt know you could check how i dive. Ill give my mapper a ring to see how i do that.

Ive never launched the car as that does worry me lol

legacy_gtb

iTrader: (3)

Not sure on a simtek, but on a syvecs its really easy.

Comes in bloody handy for figuring out problems.

Sorry to the op for going off on a tangent, but a syvecs log of a blat through the gears looks like this.

logic1980

not at all - interesting stuff -

L.J.F

iTrader: (31)

I am sorry but if you are running 400 from a Wrx you are not driving the car to the full potential of the spec because otherwise you would have already seen cracks in the reliability of the engine/ transmission!


@ the OP- are planning on using a classic or new age car?

tubbytommy

iTrader: (20)

logic, have you even been in a tuned impreza? only asking as a 450 bhp car is not something for the inexperienced on the road.
they have no traction control or modern driver aids.
its fine having a big power impreza but you need to budget for brakes and suspension too otherwise you will end up very dead.