Bluemoon

Just about to buy this car - havent owned a Subaru before but seem to have been bitten by the Subaru engine/peformance bug . Anyone have any comments on the car - any feedback much appreciated
regards

Squizz

Nice car - I doubt you'll be disappointed !!

pwebb

have test driven two...

excellent suspension and ride - brilliant handling - (sorry folks but better than the impreza I stepped out of) -
not as quick as it is a heavy car and it is spoiled by two things - overly light steering (though strangely there is still plenty of feel) and a colossal flat spot in the engine in betwen the primary turbo and secondary turbo kicking in - quite spoils the performance.

Serious press on types will want to upgrade the 2 pot brakes too.

Inside the car is much 'swisher' than an impreza - make sure you get the full leather spec. heck it even has carpet on the boot lid!

make sure you find a good independent garage to service it - plus be aware that there are a lot of very complicated things to potentially go wrong on the B4 - also not much scope for modifying beyond cosmetic changes.


all in all a very nice car - I would love one - and would buy one of Mr Litchfields right now if someone would buy my sti for a reasonable sum !!!

go for it - a rare and unique car.

Paul W

Bluemoon

THanks for the comments. Agree about the flat spot in between the turbos but the postives seemed to far outweigh the negs. Should pick it up a week or so - looking forward to it
regards

Bluemoon

what would the cost be of a new RSK B4 be in the UK? Duty free in Cyprus is C£16.5k (GBP18K)

regards

blp

Park Lane in Alton have several in stock I believe...

pwebb

B4 uk prices...
litchfield imports £21K, park lane/hendrys circa £24k - not many others doing these at the moment...

you can't really compare the duty free price in cyprus though as joe public couldn't just turn up there and get the pink forms to buy duty free. (unless you can tell me otherwise !) You would also have to pay VAT on arrival in blighty - (or, if you had owned the car in cyprus for 6 months first - you could avoid vat but be restricted to keeping the car for a year in the UK before selling) cyprus pound is quite strong again so you only get .87 for 1 UK pound.

all in all not as an attractive route as it used to be.

are you buying from Katamis in Nicosia or the '6 star' place in larnaca? - I think for servicing it would probably be worth the trip to nicosia.

cheers,

Paul W

HunterB

Bluemoon,

I'm told the flat spot between the turbos is curable by fitting a larger cat-back exhaust system. I've one on order for my '96 Legacy RS so I'll post my findings once it's been fitted. You'll enjoy the B4!

Brian

Ed Hodgson

Don't worry about the flat spot - just keep the revs above 4500

Seriously - I've just bought one & am very impressed. There are some advantages in the power coming in higher up the rev range though. It does mean you're not as tempted to drive fast all the time.

Make sure it's a manual though...

HunterB

obi,

Still waiting for delivery - ordered it on 16 Jan and was told it would take 4-5 weeks so, hopefully, any day now. I'll post results here in time.

Brian

obi

[QUOTE]Originally posted by HunterB:
[B]Bluemoon,

I'm told the flat spot between the turbos is curable by fitting a larger cat-back exhaust system. I've one on order for my '96 Legacy RS so I'll post my findings once it's been fitted.

Has it been fitted and did it work? I own a '97 RS which is an excellent 'Q car' and you soon learn how to use the gears to jump the lag band..but if it can be eliminated then let me know.

legacyb4

Bluemoon,

If you have any doubts about the car, don't... I run the legacyb4@yahoogroups.com with about 70 members or so and we all love our B4's... [Ed is also a member of the list].

I've got a website running at

legacyb4

Coincidentally enough, a post on the mailing list tonite yields:

- quote -

A definitive VOD cure? Convert the motor to a 2.2-litre single turbo...

Realistic solutions? The best you can do for a reasonable price is to
switch out to a *good* cat-back muffler, a good air filter, and the
earthing kit. All total around 70,000yen - depending on availability. I
actually recommend this for the current B4/e-tune models, for the above
with a fujitsubo evo R muffler and zero sports air filter, along with the
earthing kit, has really made the 3000-4000rpm range useable, so much so
that I'm actually shifting at or into that range. Has made city driving a
pleasure instead of a chore. The muffler and air cleaner were very nice,
but the engine really didn't come into it's own till the earthing kit. For
a cheap amount of 40-60amp wire and connectors, it's a must-do for every
subaru owner.

The tuners recommend changing out the exhaust manifold - much more
expensive, and you have to pull out the engine. You will also lose the
boxer sound. A cheaper solution is to put in a new center pipe, but you
trade off with a loss of low end torque to get rid of the VOD, and risk
blowing the turbo's from overboost.

Now, one minor point here. If we are talking the previous twin-turbo's,
there is some minor differences. I owned a 96 RS twin turbo, and what got
rid of the VOD for me was an adjustable blow-off valve. This was because
the first-gen tt's had this absolutely ****ty plastic blow-off attached to
the intercooler that couldn't hold back a breeze, much less the
fluctuations of boost. The second-gen tt's had a much more reasonable stock
unit, so I don't think an aftermarket unit would help.

Paul Hansen

- unquote -

legacyb4

A quick note on larger cat-back exhaust systems; if you go too big, you *will* lose a lot of low-end torque (less noticeable on older RS's but pronounced on the new B4's).

I mentioned earlier that I had the HKS Hypermuffler; it has the option to run with a silencer in or out and I've found that unless I'm on the track, I prefer to run with the silencer in as it gives me more response on the low end.

On the other hand, if you get the Fujitsubo Legalis Evolution R, as this will yield much more pleasant low-end without sacrificing the high-end.

Cheers.

Subie Gal

jealous...

jealous...

cant read this thread any more...

<B>JEALOUS!!!!</B>

rant/ Beautiful stinkin car that we cant get here cuz i live in the crap states that doesn't allow 'real' cars in.. nooo we cant have 'real' cars with 'real' power and styling... bahhhh!!! /rant

j.

Subie Gal

while i'm at it...
is there a known place where one can buy a B4 emblem???

huh???

is there???

thanks!!

j.

Branners

Another sequential turbo car, I thought it was just the RX7s and us Supras that had sequential systems.

How does the B4 do the sequential bit and why is there such a VOD? The Supras have a minor hesitation at transition but certainly nothing that could even warrant being called valley of death...

thanks
JB

obi

Now, one minor point here. If we are talking the previous twin-turbo's,
there is some minor differences. I owned a 96 RS twin turbo, and what got
rid of the VOD for me was an adjustable blow-off valve. This was because
the first-gen tt's had this absolutely ****ty plastic blow-off attached to
the intercooler that couldn't hold back a breeze, much less the
fluctuations of boost. The second-gen tt's had a much more reasonable stock
unit, so I don't think an aftermarket unit would help.

Paul

I own a 97 RS ( E-BD5) saloon. Did changing the blow off valve solve the VOD problem or should it combined with the DIY earthing system? Any advise would be gratefully received

Thanks obi

Legacy GTB

SubieGal,
Sorry, but I've already got one of these tasty Legacy's, only mine's the stationwagon (estate) model which is known as the GTB. Check it out at

legacyb4

Richard,

You certainly summarized that well!

Even cruising through the city, it's scary how quickly you are doing 80 km/h down some side street without realizing it... all the more easily done when the stereo is cranking and the throb of the engine reduced to a nice rumble under your accelerator...

I have been looking at possibly upgrading the hi-beam bulbs, as you mentioned since the normal HID bulbs are so bloody bright that using your hi-beams don't have too much added effect to visibility other than lighting up the bumper of the car that you are trying to get out of your way!

Cheers.

Legacy GTB

Hi Jeff,
First things first- your written english is excellent!! I would never have guessed it was your 2nd language.

I've already done the high beam bulb replacement and I've gone with some 130w halogens. In my car I found it was easiest to actually remove the headlight unit to do the job! It's made a big difference, but I was concerned about the potential for heat damage to the plastic headlight surrounds. So far, so good.

Paul Webb made a very good point about getting a good garage to service the vehicle. It is an extremely complex car with a great many of closely guarded Subaru-only secrets in it's assembly, so the local Scooby dealer might be your best bet. You'll pay a premium for that, but they do have the training and knowledge plus they work on these engines daily and know the problems and pitfalls. Trust me, I know!

Richard

Grant.revan

On the question of servicing - its only a problem if something big goes wrong. I take mine to a Subaru Dealer and they said that they do not touch the engine tune at all. They basically just check the levels and change the oil. The ECU does the rest. They also said they have no diagnostics for twin turbo,s anyway? I have had mine for 18,000 miles. Not a fault - But I keep the oil topped up and get the services done every 7,500.

PS Every one is going on about the Valley of Death between Turbos - I sometimes detect the slightest hesitation as the second one kicks in but its very minor - I find that my biggest problem is poor quality petrol. When you get a good batch the car sings - if the petrol is poor the ECU winds back the power and the difference is amazing. It is particularly noticeable when doing fast starts. PS I thrash my beast and it just loves it. Has anyone ever tried to find the top end on a derestricted B4. I have seen mine up to 170 MPH reading 6900 RPM and it was still pulling (In Germany of course officer!).

My car has no Mods but I am going to try the earthing mod and Prova Links.

legacyb4

Grant,

We seem to cross paths all over the boards... :-)

Here's my official record doing 180 km/h at 5,000 rpm in 5th gear...



Cheers!

Grant.revan

Your figure of 180KMH at 5000 Rpm yields the following results. Each RPM on the Tacho equates to a speed of 0.0225 MPH. Therefore my car should have been reading 155MPH at 6900 RPM. This could quite well be true as the RPM reading is probably more accurate than the speed guage. (Most speedos read high and errors of up to 10% are the norm)It also equates to a top speed of 169MPH at 7500 RPM which is the top speed I have seen quoted for the B4.

What you don't realise is how amazing the car is above 120MPH. The acceleration at this speed is amazing as you are sat smack bang in the middle of the peak torque and power band for a long period of time while the car just pulls and pulls. The stability of the car at these speeds does not change - however the brakes fade very rapidly when coming down fast from these speeds.

Legacy GTB

Just a little word of warning from one who has been burned badly- don't hold the car at full throttle up a 1000ft incline for any more than a few seconds. It melts pistons and costs a lot of dinero!

We thing a faulty knock sensor might possibly have been the problem, but who really knows? I'm just looking forward to getting the car back (again!) so I can keep on rollin'.

Richard

legacyb4

Grant,

Unfortunately, removing my limiter is one of the things I haven't done so far; basically because short of the circuit, it's a bit too risky to run at speeds of 200 km/h unless I am willing to chance my license and a very hefty fine...

Maybe someday I'll get around to it.

Cheers.

HunterB

Update from 15th Feb:

Got the replacement exhaust fitted yesterday - a Blitz Realize TT (100mm tailpipe) - with a Blitz SUS Power panel filter. Excellent quality and a nice, fairly subdued burble from the Blitz, which is easy to live with - OEM exhaust was too quiet anyway . Initial thoughts are that it's reduced the power/torque drop between the turbos (but not eliminated it) and maybe moved it 250-300rpm up the rev range. Also feels like there's a slight drop-off in torque at lower revs, but that could just be because the boot's full of golf clubs just now . Once I've run it for a week or so, I'll post findings here if they're substantially different from these initial thoughts.

Must mention the great service I received from Jim Curley at Star Performance in Glenrothes, though - (Jim's the man with the four-wheel dyno that's become a favourite in Scooby/Evo circles in Scotland). Although traditionally a VW/Audi tuner, he's shown that he'll turn his hand to anything (his son's also Toyota-trained now) and he's becoming more interested in Subarus with the dyno runs being done at his premises. Wouldn't surprise me if he starts taking on more Subaru work in the near future. Top man.

Brian

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

Bluemoon - Where are you in Cyprus? I used to live in Episkopi Garrison.

Steve

legacyb4

Last week, I finally broke down and swapped out my HKS Hypermuffler for the Fujitsubo Legalis R Evolution muffler...

Both have their own pros/cons but I finally decided to go for the unit which gave me more low-mid end torque and sacrificing absolute top end.

The Evolution has a quiet, raspy growl inside the cabin compared to the HKS and a tighter, lower, more distinct 'buh-buh-buh' tune when standing behind the car.

In either case, both of the above beat having a stock muffler on the B4.

Cheers.
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