wrx271

iTrader: (1)

Hi guys I bought a 97 v4 1 week ago and today I was going to get the belt done and a full service so we took the cam cover off to check the belt first only to be greated with a new belt great so on went the cam cover and out came the oil and antidfreeze upon running the car up I noticed a knocking the dealer I bought it from said the rattle on test drive was a heatsheild and I took for granted it was as the noise was only apparent at 2-3k then it appears to go quiet but today it was confirmed that the big ends are dying so I'm having to go down the claims route which is rubbish times. So why I'm doing this I was hoping some one could give me some advice on what route I should go down to get the car running do I sauce a used v4 engine drop it in job done or do I go 2.5 bottom end and my v4 heads or do I go v8 engine turbo etc and who do I get these bits from I havent got rebuild money but I should be able to clear used or short block money and if I change to the 2.5 short engine what will I need any help would be great as Im proper gutted after today's anticts

Kind regards

Dave

Pink_Floyd

If you did indeed purchase from a dealer (?) then you will have some recourse through them.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Well depandant on ecu, but if you go 2.5 you will need a remap, new ecu or esl daughter board which will be bare minimum of extra £300 notes just for a map if you already have aftermarket ecu.

Cheapest route is another v4 bottom end, but you need to have some history/know if it's been rebuilt as you could well find yourself in the same situation in 6 months.

I would suggest you get yourself down to trading standards and go for a full refund as it's only been a week since you bought it, this will be by far the cheapest option..

Not fit for purpose......

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Did you disconnect the crank sensor and turn it over till the oil light went out

And why on earth did you buy a car off a dealer that was not freshly serviced

Sorry, but dude wtf were you thinking...

marcevs72

iTrader: (5)

give pete@s/e imprezas a bell mate and see what he's got in

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

I've owned my fair share of cars and with everyone regardless of history will be serviced before I use them I've never disconnected the crank sensor after a service on any of my imprezas and I've never had problems.

I bought from a dealer as I'd searched high and low for a particular car for personal reasons this one was buy far the cleanest one on the Market at this time for what I wanted to spend as I'm getting married I've spoke to him today and he's playing the normal dealer tricks but I've been in the game to long to be messed about but we all miss things and that little rattle I did hear sounded much like previous cars I've had with loose heat shields.

Any way untill I've sorted things with the dealer obviously I am going down the unfit for use act, I like the car so I don't really wAnt to give it back I just want something to help towards getting her back on the road.

I'm thinking the heads might be ok so how much would I be looking at a rebuilt short block to sti specs im so confused on the best route because as you say I dont want the same thing to happen 6 months down the line.

Who is s/e is he a breaker ?

Regards

Dave

marcevs72

iTrader: (5)

check for member on here user name pete@s/e imprezas

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

I will have a search any more advice on a replacement engine would be good.
How easy is it to drop the full sti 8 engine turbo loom ecu etc what's involved

Kind regards

Dave

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Ok, wasn't trying to teach my granny to suck eggs and understand where your coming from and also where your at, as been there done that twice.

So in answer to the question about sti 8 full engine a lot of work, better off and cheaper to just look for a bottom end does not matter which one, there are a few in the for sale section just depends how much you want to spend, you could be as well rebuilding your block with sti internals, its not that difficult if your handy with the spanners, and as long as its not gone major knock knock then there is a fare bit you can get away with as long as you don't drive it till it's fooked, as in all you really need is crank rods and bearings if the bores are ok, but you wont know that till you split it.

Choices,choices.

Whats your budget?

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

Drop a V8 or 9 bottom end in. Very strong engine and will (if looke after) run at circa 400 all day long.
Can pick them up for around £1500 now which is money well spent in my opinion.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I agree with what matty says, but imo if you have the ability it's better to build a zero miles bottom end for similar money diy, then you know what it's done exactly.

Edit to say, if you have the skills and tools to do the cambelt then you can rebuild the bottom end as it's no more difficult than changing the cambelt along with every thing that goes with it..

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

No that's cool ditchmyster I feel a fool for buying it but I do actually really like the car the knocking isn't super bad but it's there between 2-3k and when you load it the car still drives sweet and ticks over quiet but the knocking is most certainly there when the engine is reved up.
I'm not brave enuff to do the work myself my mechanic does the stuff I can't but building engines isn't his thing either so I wouldn't want to put that burden on him. Plus I'd want to know it's been done the rite way if I'm going to be spending the wedding money
I've had a look about and lateral does a 2.5 short block for just over 2k and then I'd need I'm guessing a ecu oil pump belts tenioners etc
But I'm not sure it would be cheeper forgeing my bottom end if it's not a total loss my budget if all goes bad is 3k if it goes my way then I'd have some cash back from the trader

Regards

Dave

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I really can't stress enough, if your on a tight budget, steer clear of the 2.5 as it's more expensive in the long run as to do it properly costs serious pounds, and the torque will kill your gear box, you also need to factor in a clutch as that won't last long either.

If your after a bit more umph look into 2.1L stroker conversion, scooby clinic, Api, and engine tuner all do bottom ends within that sort of budget.

one thing is for sure DON'T drive it as that small knock is repairable, but once it sounds like the rent man at the door, it's gona cost more and can throw a rod, do a search on Wiley's thread for pictures of what can happen

Knowing what i know now if i were in your shoes i would just look out for a decent forged bottom end, there is a fully forged closed deck engine in the for sale section for £2,300. which is in your budget and you can drop it straight in and sell your heads for £300 or fit your heads and sell the ones that come with it, it's a relatively cheap quick fix, and a forged cdb is where it's at in terms of subaru engines.

Gear Head

iTrader: (2)

Sod you spending any money. Force the dealer to take it back. It wasn't fit for purpose!

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

This has crossed my mind about backing the car it's probably the most cost effective way of resolving if it goes straight forward I've never been in this position before I've looked on the net for advice and I'm 100% sure I've got a good case it's just how long it will take to resolve because I'm sure the trader will try anything and everything to get out of sorting me out my issue is I like the car it's straight for one solid underneath and as said I searched up and down the country for a good one I actually thought there wasn't any left in this condition.
In an ideal world I'd like to buy a recent forged 2.0 complete engine so I could just drop it in with a new clutch and be back on the road I'm not after huge power I just want something that's gonna last

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

The dealer will not refund the car that is for certain.
What he will do is offer to have the car fixed. This will be at a garage of his choice and to standard spec.
My advice is to talk to him and find out how much money he will front to have the car repaired. Then explain that you want the engine uprated at a specialist and that you will pay the extra.

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

I just want some costs of what the replacement would cost ie jap performance do a long engine for 1.400 so I would expect no little than that I'm not expecting to get a full forged lump out of him and nor is he or any of his garages going to be touching my car wile I own it I can't trust him what's saying he,s not going to bodge the repair

DJ_Jon

iTrader: (7)

First things first, don't drive the car anymore. After Bob Rawle worked his magic on my car it had the same death rattle at 2-3k revs, under load, as yours. to repair, you are looking at a new crank, bearings, chemical clean & modine. You could drop a second hand bottom end in there, but you would still need to get the heads cleaned properly, i.e. the gallery plugs removed & them chemically cleaned before refitting - the swarf form the knackered bearing will be all round the engine, not just in the bottom end.

If I were in your position I would look at getting the pistons & rods replaced with forged items. Get the dealer to pay for the labour & the cost of standard items , you stump up the difference for the forged items.

If you go down the 2.1 or 2.5 route it is going to cost big money, take it from me!

Shaks-STI

iTrader: (7)

+1

I have got my self into 2.5 route and its not cheap to do it rite, just get your engine forged and job done, buying a 2nd hand engine could put you in the same position in 6 months if you don't know the history of the engine.

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

The car is parked up now and won't be driven until it's fixed how much ruffley am I looking at to forge my bottom end if it's fixable which to be onist I beleve it could be as the knocking isn't terrible but there

MattyB1983

iTrader: (51)

Your car started knocking after Bob worked on it ?

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Would you like a bowl for xmas to go with your spoon

DJ_Jon

iTrader: (7)

Yup, mapped it then let me drive away without telling me it was fvcked, thanks Bob & AP Motors.

Now I'm sure he does great work but he screwed up on my car. It's done, dusted and in the past. Just another expensive life lesson. In future, go to Enginetuner & get the job done right!

DJ_Jon

iTrader: (7)

Roughly, i would budget £1500 - £2000 to do the job right. If you can do all the labour yourself then its going to be cheaper.

The other option is to take the engine out & send it up to David at APi - they will sort it properly & warrant the engine for around £1900 (that price was given to me about 3 years ago, so has probably gone up)

However that price is for a standard engine, not a forged one. If you are keeping the car standard, I would stick with a standard rebuild.

Adding the parts up using Laterals website:

Crank: £521
Rods: £539
Pistons £629
Modine £100

Total: £1789

I would say that is a bit pricey for a forged bottom end, I'm sure you can get those bits cheaper if you shop around.


HTH

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

I'm local to Mark at lateral so I'm looking to talk to him about what route to go down I'm looking at the 2.1 stroker kit I'm assuming this would be ok in my block with my old heads dependant on the condition when we strip the engine down. But as said this is the expensive route I'm being told I do have about 3k put aside I'd love to be able to get a relible built or pre built engine done for that money.
Theres a company on here that I've been looking at called scoobyspares has anyone delt with them before what are they like

DJ_Jon

iTrader: (7)

Yes, but you need to factor in a clutch & remap. What is your budget?

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

My budget is 3k I've got acess to a symtec for 500 and I'm lucky in the fact I can get a good clutch through my work obviously I'll probably add a bit to the budget for mapping and the ecu.

So do I forge it or std rebuild it as power isn't what I'm after 320-340 will do fine

Could I run the engine in with the oe ecu and then fit the symtec once it's run in ?

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

I would go standard sti centre thrust crank which saves on block work and is £200 cheaper, you can get forged rods and pistons for £600 then a set of acl race bearings and modine you should also get an oil pump and a new water pump and don't forget a full subaru gasket and oil seal set, as its ok quoting prices off web sites for the main parts but all the little bits add up to a fair whack as well, you need 3 oil filters and 3 lots of oil as well for the 1st 1000 miles.

you will also need a fuel pump for those numbers, you don't need a simtec for the numbers your after, esl daughter board @ £550 mapped will do everything a simtec will and at £500 plus 3/350 to map, it is much cheaper and almost pays for the gasket set.

In this rebuild game it's very easy to be seduced by sexy parts that are just that bit better and cost just a little bit more, but you need to set a spec and budget based on what the car will be used for and stick to it, otherwise the costs spiral out of control very quickly, and what starts life as a £3k build very quickly becomes a 5/6k build.

Ask anyone thats done it.

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Also i would not hold my breath waiting to get loads of cash from this dealer, i would dance for joy if he offers you £1k but i doubt that he will.

I think the most he would do is new bearings and a reground crank and rods, and will try it on like all buggery to give you as little as possible.

I really think you should give it back because this is going to cost you a small fortune for a car that is worth no where near what it will end up costing you.

Plenty more fish in the sea..

But it's your money so, "bas mi briga"

wrx271

iTrader: (1)

It's mind blowing at the moment I've had the worst headache all day thinking about the best plan.
2k can get me a complete engine 4k miles forged from a member on here which seems tempting and not out of this world expensive.
I'm going to have to have a ring around tomorrow and get some prices bloody stressful considering i sold my evo for an easier life lol


Dave