escort cossie VS scooby which is better car
05 January 2002, 11:45 AM
#1
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i am sure the MG plot is just because the rev range at the bottom is shifted across, as you can see thats just a plot from the actual figures produced on the dyno put into a nicer format for a .gif file. Nothing dodgy about it.
The values on torque and power are correct, thats the sort of grunt needed to get a car to 255MPH. Even a very airodynamic one at that. For example, the car had no radiators, they just dumped cold water through it from a big tank in the car, that reduces drag masively.
http://www.mgcars.org.uk/news/news378.html
[Edited by johnfelstead - 5/1/2002 11:59:46 AM]
The values on torque and power are correct, thats the sort of grunt needed to get a car to 255MPH. Even a very airodynamic one at that. For example, the car had no radiators, they just dumped cold water through it from a big tank in the car, that reduces drag masively.
http://www.mgcars.org.uk/news/news378.html
[Edited by johnfelstead - 5/1/2002 11:59:46 AM]
05 January 2002, 12:05 PM
#2
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John, i also got some info an a MGF apparently 450 out of a 2.0l with a t3....
yeah right.
Plus aint the torque surpose to cross a little higher up the REV range
LOL I didn't see the above posts
Edited as dingy can't read
[Edited by dingy - 5/1/2002 12:07:15 PM]
yeah right.
Plus aint the torque surpose to cross a little higher up the REV range
LOL I didn't see the above posts
Edited as dingy can't read
[Edited by dingy - 5/1/2002 12:07:15 PM]
05 February 2002, 01:25 PM
#5
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Craig,
But it's a Cossie engine.....sustained revs over 8k only means one thing, BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM
Mike,
The skirt looks so much better on you. Must be something to do with the fact, you have a women-like body......but then again, there was only so much they could change during your sex change!!!
Regards,
Shaun.
[Edited by Shaun - 5/2/2002 1:28:16 PM]
But it's a Cossie engine.....sustained revs over 8k only means one thing, BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM
Mike,
The skirt looks so much better on you. Must be something to do with the fact, you have a women-like body......but then again, there was only so much they could change during your sex change!!!
Regards,
Shaun.
[Edited by Shaun - 5/2/2002 1:28:16 PM]
05 February 2002, 05:50 PM
#6
Adam,
500bhp and standard diffs don't mix....
Being near and going in one are two different things...
An Escort is 125Kg heavier than a Sapphire...
Rich,
Okay, I'm sure I'm going to let you drive my pride and joy when you free wheel your cars and don't know how to change gear...
Shaun,
That still makes me better than you...
LOL
Mike R
[Edited by Mike Rainbird - 5/2/2002 5:52:50 PM]
500bhp and standard diffs don't mix....
Being near and going in one are two different things...
An Escort is 125Kg heavier than a Sapphire...
Rich,
Okay, I'm sure I'm going to let you drive my pride and joy when you free wheel your cars and don't know how to change gear...
Shaun,
That still makes me better than you...
LOL
Mike R
[Edited by Mike Rainbird - 5/2/2002 5:52:50 PM]
19 April 2002, 07:27 PM
#7
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ok this should be a fun thread both are 4 x 4,personally i think the scooby is much better in everyway including looks, handling reliabilty and fun but i would be bias as i have a scooby 
and have also blown few cossies away but does anyone disagree and anyone else had a burn with an escy cos??
stu
[Edited by imprezaturbo555 - 4/23/2002 2:53:57 PM]
and have also blown few cossies away but does anyone disagree and anyone else had a burn with an escy cos??stu
[Edited by imprezaturbo555 - 4/23/2002 2:53:57 PM]
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19 April 2002, 07:54 PM
#8
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impreza will be a better car it is 10 years later.
But the cosworth escort still looks very muscular and grabs you in the guts when you see one, just like the integrale evolutions do too. Something no subaru achieves, even the 22b.
But the cosworth escort still looks very muscular and grabs you in the guts when you see one, just like the integrale evolutions do too. Something no subaru achieves, even the 22b.
19 April 2002, 08:05 PM
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In 1992/3 Clarkson was overwhelmed by the Escort Cossie.
In its day, yes, it was a good car that kicked ***. With all the latest competition though (from Japan), these cars are now a little un refined, and its image lets it down.
In its day, yes, it was a good car that kicked ***. With all the latest competition though (from Japan), these cars are now a little un refined, and its image lets it down.
19 April 2002, 08:28 PM
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I agree, why do you need 400 bhp ? Surely a 250+ Subaru is adequate, especially as the Scoob tackles corners as well as it does the straights
[Edited by Yorkie - 4/19/2002 8:28:59 PM]
[Edited by Yorkie - 4/19/2002 8:28:59 PM]
19 April 2002, 08:37 PM
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For big power there is no choice - got to be the escort cossie...
As for it being a much older car, while it may be based on the sierra it was only launched in the UK in 1992 if I remember rightly, oh and if you cast your mind back, the WRX was also launched in Japan that year
Out of the box I think the scooby handles better, and due to lower CoG has the most potential for handling, but the cossie can still be made to handle very well. Now personally I couldn't justify the cost of a cossie, especially when I can have my dream car for a similar price That said I recognise a good car, which the cossie is... Can't comment on reliability of the cossie, but I don't the scooby's is that fantastic from all I read on here (mine was fine though)...
Jon
As for it being a much older car, while it may be based on the sierra it was only launched in the UK in 1992 if I remember rightly, oh and if you cast your mind back, the WRX was also launched in Japan that year
Out of the box I think the scooby handles better, and due to lower CoG has the most potential for handling, but the cossie can still be made to handle very well. Now personally I couldn't justify the cost of a cossie, especially when I can have my dream car for a similar price
That said I recognise a good car, which the cossie is... Can't comment on reliability of the cossie, but I don't the scooby's is that fantastic from all I read on here (mine was fine though)...Jon
19 April 2002, 08:43 PM
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You are right Jon, I could list many good cars that I would add to my collection if only I could get me numbers up on the lottery. And the Escort Cossie would be close to an essential purchase along with an Integrale.
19 April 2002, 08:49 PM
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The Escort for looks and the Scooby for driving.People keep banging on about the unreliability of Ford but from owners I've spoken to it's good unless you go mental with the power.Like the previous post hinted at,there aren't many big power scooby's and from what I've read and heard from owners this is due to the engine not being able to take much more than 320ish bhp on stadard internals.As previously said though-you don't need as much power.
19 April 2002, 09:30 PM
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owning both they are very different. i also have original 3dr. both cosworths are tuned and both are still on original gearboxes! having owned cosworths since early seveties (rs1600bda) THEY ARE reliable and the brakes work too. as said they are different and im fortunate to own both . my scoobs are my96 uk turbo my00wrx choosing the drive to work is tough some days!!!!!!!!!!!
19 April 2002, 09:30 PM
#18
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"i totally agree the ford always seem so unreliable especially gearboxes and ford seem to have no build quality"
I have never heard so much rubbish!!!!!! I have owned to Escort Cossies now (and before you ask, YES I have owned a WRX as well). My present one is whacking out 1.9 bar of boost, and I have never had any reliability problems.
What's this about the gearbox then......in standard form they are good enough for 375bhp.......something your Scooby box will never quite get to!!! And as for reliability problems, where have you been regarding the renowned bearing failures of Scoobies????
Regards,
Shaun.
I have never heard so much rubbish!!!!!! I have owned to Escort Cossies now (and before you ask, YES I have owned a WRX as well). My present one is whacking out 1.9 bar of boost, and I have never had any reliability problems.
What's this about the gearbox then......in standard form they are good enough for 375bhp.......something your Scooby box will never quite get to!!!
And as for reliability problems, where have you been regarding the renowned bearing failures of Scoobies????Regards,
Shaun.
19 April 2002, 09:38 PM
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The subaru does not have anywhere near the potential a cossie does. A sorted coswort will anhillate any scooby you care too compare it with.
A freind of mine has a 450bhp escort and it just blows a scooby away in every dept handling, performance, looks sorry but in comparison the scooby is a pretend performance car with no soul. And just look at the residual values. The Cossie is a legend the scooby a pretender and not a very quick one at that with very limited tuning potential 300 bhp and your done.
Have a lok at the torque cuurve a 500 bhp cosworth produces it bangs out more than a McClaren F1 road car.
A freind of mine has a 450bhp escort and it just blows a scooby away in every dept handling, performance, looks sorry but in comparison the scooby is a pretend performance car with no soul. And just look at the residual values. The Cossie is a legend the scooby a pretender and not a very quick one at that with very limited tuning potential 300 bhp and your done.
Have a lok at the torque cuurve a 500 bhp cosworth produces it bangs out more than a McClaren F1 road car.
19 April 2002, 09:42 PM
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Ford has build quality that Subaru can only dream of, even a basis Escort is better built than my bug-eye.
Same goes for the gearbox, Subaru could learn thing or too about decent syncro and shift quality from Ford too.
They're both great cars in there own way.
Same goes for the gearbox, Subaru could learn thing or too about decent syncro and shift quality from Ford too.
They're both great cars in there own way.
19 April 2002, 09:46 PM
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Shows how much you know ford didnt build the car. Just accept that scoobys are not the best cars on the road they are a budget performance with very little tuning potential. The engine is far inferior to a cosworth in every aspect. Ask any tuner including PE graham Goode etc and the answer will allwats be the same.
19 April 2002, 09:53 PM
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My mates vectra has a 0 to 100 time of 11 secs and bangs out over 300 bhp with a naturally aspirated 3.0 lump and will blow a P1, 22B in a straight line. Like it or lump it. Even my Vectra ST200 is faster than the new shape Scooby in standard trim. I couldnt believe how slow they are even a BMW 328i is quicker how sad is that.
19 April 2002, 10:03 PM
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I should say that the scooby still has potential, just costs a small fortune to liberate... But the JUN scoobies with 420+Bhp are awesome and I'd certainly love one, (not as much as a JUN skyine though )
)
19 April 2002, 10:10 PM
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Unfortunayely it is you who have no class graham running around in your massed produced hairdryer. You obviously do not know what car I have. It is better than yours. I think my standard front brake set up is probably worth more than your entire car. Would you like to drag for cars in your pathetic piece of JAP CRAP. Do you think yours will out handle mine unless of course your road going heap running on budget shocks with bicycle brakes and a gutless little engine will beat a fully race prepared road going car. I think not get a life get a better job and then you too could afford some performance. Whars the 0 to 100 on your scooby half an hour. You really are a very sad pratt mate. The offer is there lets play for cars
19 April 2002, 10:37 PM
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Vectra? Looks? Pedigree? Class? Hmmm.......... NO! What did Clarkson say about the Vectra?
I'm a saff cossie owner, so a little biased. Even though this debate will rage on, I think you'll find REAL cossie owners will appreciate the Scoob as a great car.
Personally, I love em! I think the Escort is slightly better looking, but I've seen a 22B on the road, and that blew me away!
Will have one as a second car if prices keep falling.
I'm a saff cossie owner, so a little biased. Even though this debate will rage on, I think you'll find REAL cossie owners will appreciate the Scoob as a great car.
Personally, I love em! I think the Escort is slightly better looking, but I've seen a 22B on the road, and that blew me away!
Will have one as a second car if prices keep falling.
19 April 2002, 10:51 PM
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I think some people need to get out more!! I enjoy my car and spend a lot of money (for me) running it but it's car FFS. You're like a bunch of kids in the playground. I wish the bloke from Driven last night with the 700+ bhp Merc would come on here and put you all to shame then the petty imature arguements may stop.
Having said all that there are a few sensible comments. Mods can you delete the crap (that includes this post) and leave the informative posts.
Having said all that there are a few sensible comments. Mods can you delete the crap (that includes this post) and leave the informative posts.
19 April 2002, 10:57 PM
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Graham My cars Spec includes the following
Engine
3.0 V6 with revised cams, flowed cylinder head,enlarged throttle body and flowed inlets, BTB balanced exhaust system (this cost more than your car) Unichip, balanced bottom end, reworked air intake uprated fuel pump and swirl pot. putting out just over 300 bhp.
Brakes
AP racing 352mm six pot fronts and AP racing 300 mm rears
with brake fluid recirculation valve.
Transmission
6 speed reworked calibra turbo box with lightened and balanced flywheel, AP surtrac, LSD, and a revised final drive with quick shift linkage and AP clutch.
Suspension
Reworked fully adjustable Koni Dampers with MSD springs fully rose jointed and lowered 60mm
Wheels
18" magnesium speedlines
I really do want to play with your hairdryer graham whats the 0 to 60 5 seconds my model cars faster than that.
Maybe we should level the playing field out and have mine supercharged with around 450bhp on tap with reliabilty.
It must be sad living in your deluded world.
Engine
3.0 V6 with revised cams, flowed cylinder head,enlarged throttle body and flowed inlets, BTB balanced exhaust system (this cost more than your car) Unichip, balanced bottom end, reworked air intake uprated fuel pump and swirl pot. putting out just over 300 bhp.
Brakes
AP racing 352mm six pot fronts and AP racing 300 mm rears
with brake fluid recirculation valve.
Transmission
6 speed reworked calibra turbo box with lightened and balanced flywheel, AP surtrac, LSD, and a revised final drive with quick shift linkage and AP clutch.
Suspension
Reworked fully adjustable Koni Dampers with MSD springs fully rose jointed and lowered 60mm
Wheels
18" magnesium speedlines
I really do want to play with your hairdryer graham whats the 0 to 60 5 seconds my model cars faster than that.
Maybe we should level the playing field out and have mine supercharged with around 450bhp on tap with reliabilty.
It must be sad living in your deluded world.
19 April 2002, 10:59 PM
#30
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Vectra
Did you really pay £26K for a Vectra that does 0-60 in 7.5 secs and 0-100 in 20secs? (http://www.astra-gsi.co.uk/vectra_supertouring_200.htm)
Even a standard bug-eye WRX costing only 21.5K will muster 0-60 in 5.9 and 0.100 in 16.9secs.
The classic shape UK Turbo Scooby, which was available at the same time as yours, could do 0-60 in 5.3 and 0-100 in 14.9.
Couldn't find the standard Cossie figures but I don't think they were far behind/better than these.
Nigel
Did you really pay £26K for a Vectra that does 0-60 in 7.5 secs and 0-100 in 20secs? (http://www.astra-gsi.co.uk/vectra_supertouring_200.htm)
Even a standard bug-eye WRX costing only 21.5K will muster 0-60 in 5.9 and 0.100 in 16.9secs.
The classic shape UK Turbo Scooby, which was available at the same time as yours, could do 0-60 in 5.3 and 0-100 in 14.9.
Couldn't find the standard Cossie figures but I don't think they were far behind/better than these.
Nigel