New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Hi all,

And so the Ns04 modding saga continues We move from the relms of power upgrades to the thorny subject of handling!

I should start by saying that I composed a really long post detailing my suspension upgrade, only for IE to vape it upon posting! So, this one will be a bit more concise; apologies to any out there who like my war and peace length posts!

The situation before the upgrade.

340bhp Classic impreza. Goes like stink, handled like s..... Gotcha! It handled well actually. Contrary to SN folklore a stand classic set up is more than capable of harnessing the mid 300s. BUT, and this is the key thing, there is a difference between a chassis that can accommodate power and one that can exploit it! The car's standard set up was 9 years old, so past its best. Whilst grip and traction were still very good, I wanted to significantly reduce body roll, pitch and dive, understeer and inject a bit more steering feel into the equation! Most importantly, I didn't want to destroy the ride! The rationale behind modding my car has always been enhance/improve for fast road use!

So coilovers it is then.......

WHAT??? I hear you cry, they'll destroy your car's ride and handling on the road, unless you pay mega bucks!!

Well, I used to think that too! Indeed I was thinking more along the lines of a conventional spring and damper upgrade. Untill, that is, Knowlsey at Xtreme took me for a ride in their demo car equipped with Tein's Superstreet Kit with electronic damping force control (EDFC). I was immmediately impressed at how composed the car was; flat and neutral through the bends and compliant too! The best thing was that the EDFC meant that the driver could adjust the dampers on the car without leaving their seat *16 levels between hard and soft) and pre-assign three settings to suit different driving conditions/styles. SOLD!!

Turns out, the key to the right coilovers is getting the right spring rate and then having dampers to suit! Tein use 4 and 3 kgf/mm for the superstreet kit in a classic (same as AST suggest for their coilovers I believe). If you are thinking about getting coilovers for a classic that is intended for predominantly road use think VERY carefully before specifying harder springs than this!! I would suggest you most likely won't like them!

So I had the kit fitted with pillowball top mounts and EDFC then alligned. What follows are my preliminary impressions.

Build quality

Spot on, they look sooo much more sophisticated than the std set up - almost a pity to hide them away!

Ride height

Tein suggest a 25mm drop front and rear (about the max Prodrive reccommend I believe). All I will say is that this is a genuine 25mm drop. The car looks very much more purposeful in its stance now! Not slammed (I don't like that look) but noticably lower! You can, of course, tailor the ride height to your liking with this set up though!

Refinement

As with the OEM suspension. No clonks, knocks, rattles, squeeks etc..

Ride and handling

Depends on what you set the dampers to Even at the softest setting, it's a very significant improvement over the OEM set up in terms of body control, which is now excellent, grip/traction and steering feel! The ride on the soft setting is actually better than OEM IMHO, more composed and with an underlying firmness that doesn't give way to harshness. Nice for when you're not in the mood to press on or are carrying pasengers of a more sensitive disposition!

With the dampers on the mid settings, the car feel much more STi like. Even firmer control of body movement, harder ride, but still not unconfortable or hard to the point where loss of traction over bumpy surfaces becomes a big issue. Nice for when you want to play!

With the dampers set to hard, the car still remains surprisingly useable on the road, provinding the surfaces are half decent, but it is a little on the fidgety side and doesn't like pot holes etc... I think this end of the spectrum is more suited to track work.

I live in London where the roads are, well, ****e! and I've found that having the dampers set to about 12 of 16 (0 being hardest, 16 being softest) front and rear is a very good "all rounder". I have two other settings at the mo, 14, when the roads are particularly bad (or I'm carrying relatives) and 8 for when I want a play! I'm constantly fiddling with them though, that's the beauty of adjustable dampers, you can tailor the ride/handling balance to your personal preferences for driving conditions etc..It's all things to all men, which leads me nicely onto..

Ease of use

EDFC couldn't be easier! 16 settings between hard and soft for both front and rear dampers, user assignable 3 presets for desired damper configurations and an off button! Select desired front a rear settings, hold a p button to assign them to a preset and off you go. Repeat for 3 different configurations and just tap the desired button to activate the particular suspension configuration! You must be stationary when adjusting the dampers, but it can switch between presets so quickly, you can do it when pulled up at a junction! This really is the best system for damper adjustment, no getting out the car, fiddling around in the engine bay or with the back seats, no fiddling with spanners etc... just experiment on the fly from inside the car. Especially useful when the route you're taking is unfamiliar and the roads take an unexpected change for the better/worse, or it starts to rain and the ultra firm playtime setting you had adjusted the dampers to sudenly becomes ill advised!

Conclusion:

The mutts nutts for a coilover kit that works on the road and doesn't break the bank!

Disclaimer: I had to type this rather quickly and can't proof read it straight away, so apologies for any typos, poor articulation, missing words etc... in advance. Will revise when I get time!

Ns04

lunar tick

iTrader: (2)

Excellent review - thanks matey. If I didn't already have the AST coilovers, I'd seriously consider putting these Teins on my shopping list as I like the idea of 'on the fly' adjustability Having said that, I'd probably constantly be fiddling with the settings over every road surface!

Midnight Runner

Agreed. When my shocks go (again) these will be in the melting pot for consideration, I would have thought they would be to stiff. Cheers! Glad you like them, money well spent

scoobynewbie72

iTrader: (1)

Nice write up, what kind of £££ does this lot come in at please?

Luther

iTrader: (13)

i was just wondering the same thing. My standard sti suspension is knocking and clunking all over the place. I was considering the bc groupbuy kit but i love the idea of being able to set the ride without leaving my seat.

What sort of budget am i gonna have to work to?

Excellent write up too mate...

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

You're looking at about £750 for the coilovers and top mounts, about 250 for the EDFC and then whatever fitting costs you incur from the garage of your choice. I'd say budget around £1400 in total for that set up. Not cheap, but good value when you consider the alternatives. I didnt originally intend to spend that much TBH, but even just a strut and spring replacement with something like Eibachs and KYBs was looking at around the £800+ quid mark and something like that isn't as effective solution as the set up I've now got.

Think hard before getting an adjustable set that you have to fiddle with by hand under the bonnet etc. My bet is most people with these kind of set ups never exploit the adjustability (save for if when they do trackdays) as it's simply too much faffing around.

Also, please do heed my warning about spring rates for the classic: cheaper coilovers can be found, but many offer spring rates that you'll really struggle to get on with on the road and will compromise the comfort and cross country pace of the car.

Ns04

GC8

Thats a good time to replace your bushes with delrin parts too...

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

There were a number of other parts I considered having fitted at the same time, but I decided to stick with just the coilovers and top mounts at first, simply because I wanted to see the effect that the addition of each component had. The problem with having additional stuff done at the same time is that you might not like the net result, but not know which component was causing the problem! This way, you get to see the effect of each upgrade in turn.

Also, it's easier on the wallet and I've really got to stop spending money on the car!!!
Ns04

AshMurc

wow that's great, thanks very much for the write up, really enjoyed it!

the spring rate stuff is very usefull-- so were you saying 4kgs front, 3kgs rear? or between 3 and 4kgs all round?

Ash

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

You're welcome.

4 front 3 rear, for a classic destined for the road mate!

The newage WRX is fine on 5 front 4 rear (that's actually the set up I went for a ride in) as it's significantly heavier and has a much stiffer chassis for the suspension to do its work.

Ns04

martwrxsl

Hello mate. Thanks for the write up. I get all my work done at xtreme, fortunately I'm only 5 minutes drive from there. I spoke to Knowlsey a couple of weeks ago about the very same suspension you had fitted.

Just saving some extra penny's because as you said the car is costing me a fortune.

I'm I right in saying that you have not altered anything else from the standard car setup. i.e thickened roll bars, steering etc...

The reason I ask is I have a blob wrx 03 and I know that classics were supposed to have slightly better handling std.

The play in the steering on my car is dreadful. Would coilovers sort this out. Or is a quicker steering rack needed?

Cheers mate. Glad you're pleased with your new setup.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

If you have play in the steering, by which I'm assuming you mean, you can wiggle the wheel slightly and it has no impact on where the car is pointing (?) it's probably not going to be solved by the coilovers mate, sounds more like a problem with the steering per se. The coilovers do give you more feel through the wheel though. The car feels much more connected with the road.

My car is otherwise standard in the chassis dept.

I don't know that classics handle any better than new ages as std. The advantage they have is that they are lighter, so more chuckable for want of a better term. However, the new ages have a stiffer chassis for the suspension to do its work from.

Go for a drive in the xtreme demonstrator and ask Knowlsey to demonstrate the EDFC. You need to make sure the system is right for you. Suspension is a very subjective thing.

Ns04

Slick81

iTrader: (1)

Excellent write up mate, good stuff!!

AshMurc

thanks again i think spring rate would probably be the single most important factor to concider when getting aftermarket suspension, so that info is... worth its weight in coilovers!! shame i have no money

Ash

jayb1970

Great write up mate, I have got a set of these on order from my local Subaru specialist. Tein UK have not got any in stock at the moment for my 05 Sti so I have to wait until the middle of this month . Got to put up with the knocking for a little while longer !
Unfortunately I can't stretch to the EDFC unit, it was all I could do to get the £1000 past the accountant(wife)
Some more overtime me thinks, then I will get the EDFC.

Can't wait

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Mate, you might want to wait till you can afford to get EDFC before you get the kit fitted, as, if I recall correctly, to install EDFC after you've had the coilovers fitted, they have to take the lot back off again!! Consequently, you'll end up paying even more in labour to get it done seperately!

Just a heads up!

Ns04

jayb1970

Yeah I gess it is the wrong way to do it really but after speaking to the garage it will just involve about 1.5 hours labour instead of about .75 hour if I have it fitted at the same time.

Still, I have a couple of weeks to work on the wife (so to speak !) to persuade her it would be a good idea to get it fitted:norty


Edited to say that I am paying £1035 to have it fitted with the pillow ball top mounts. Not too bad I thought.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Does that include allignment? If so, sounds like a good deal.

ns04

martwrxsl

I'm going to phone him and ask for a demo. I did a search on the light steering and it's a common problem on all scooby's Thinking whiteline bushes may give me more weight! Forgot to ask you where they fitted the EDFC controll unit?

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

You can have the control unit where you like, within reason, mate. I had mine put mine in the glove box - one less thing for any would be thieves to see.

The steering is heavier and more feelsome with the coilovers fitted, but if you have slack in the wheel, as opposed to just light steering, I don't think they'll fix it.

Ns04

lunar tick

iTrader: (2)

I asked Curtis at Powerstation about this and he recommended AST top mounts which allow more castor angle to be added. I went this route and it did indeed nicely weight up the steering even though I'm running very light rims

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Yep, the Superstreet kit that Xtreme recommend will come with the Tein top mounts for that reason too.

Ns04

jayb1970

Yes it does mate, all set up after fitting. The original price with the top mounts, fitted was £1147 inc. I haggled and got him down to £1035 not much off but anything is better than nothing. It's [URL="http://dhcars.co.uk"] of Malmesbury if anyone else is interested. They are big on all the Zero sports stuff and have a demo car with the same set up that I am buying so I will have a blast in that to find out which setting I will put in my car until I get the EDFC fitted.

ma_99

quick question... how much abuse can these coilovers take? i drive fast and hard, chuck it over speed humps like im in a rally.