Difference between 22B and STI Type R
25 January 2002, 11:21 AM
#1
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Apart from the obvious huge price difference what are the differences between these 2 cars??? They both seem to me to be as quick as each other, both 2 door but 22B is special edition and very rare. Surely this can't be the only reason for such a huge price difference???
Sorry if it is a question already covered and if I have got any of the above wrong!
Sorry if it is a question already covered and if I have got any of the above wrong!
25 January 2002, 12:04 PM
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OK componenet wise they are different but don't they pretty much have the same performance etc? Am I being naive because I am only looking at performace stats? ie both do 0-60 in 4.5 secs etc I know this is the be all and end all of getting a car but they are both Imprezas that seem as fast as each other but one costs around 12k 2nd hand while the other is 30k plus! Thats a hell of a difference somewhere? I am only asking because I don't understand the differences for such a price gap and know very little about 22B's which a lot of people are very keen on?
25 January 2002, 12:50 PM
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They are similar performace wise as they have similar power and weight. BUT there are other VERY big differences, some of which are below. We need to wait until Adam M get a hold of this before you will hear every difference in detail I am sure 
22B 2.2 engine, sti 2.0
22B - wide track suspension, bigger wheels and brakes (?)
22B - twin plate clutch (?)
22B - fat **** hand built bodywork to accomodate wide track
22B - even harder suspension
Basically the 22B is an even more hardcore Type R, with a lot more tuning potential, better looks and extreme rarity in the UK, hence ther value.
I don't know much about them really, but they are quite different
22B 2.2 engine, sti 2.0
22B - wide track suspension, bigger wheels and brakes (?)
22B - twin plate clutch (?)
22B - fat **** hand built bodywork to accomodate wide track
22B - even harder suspension
Basically the 22B is an even more hardcore Type R, with a lot more tuning potential, better looks and extreme rarity in the UK, hence ther value.
I don't know much about them really, but they are quite different
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25 January 2002, 01:26 PM
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Tractor is pretty much right.
The car starts off life as an sti 4 type r. The chassis is seem welded and the engine ditched in favour of a different one. Engine wise the only difference is the closed deck 2.2 block, but its source is a little unknown and spares are a nightmare.
Peak performance of the type r on which it is based is around 4.3 0-60, the 22B is supposed to be quicker due to greater torque and also a flatter larger torque curve, but I doubt there is much in it. The low down torque advantage genertaed by the 2.2 is very noticable and makes the car pull so much harder out of bends. It also has a strong advantage on track as being 6cm wider at the front and 10cm (8 and 12 on mine
) at the back, combined with stif suspension, it totals in an awesome smooth road package. A bit hariy on B roads though. The twin plate clutch does require that it has a different flywheel, but apart from that drivetrain is much the same. Not sure how they achieve the wider track, some to do with offset and spacers but I believe they do have longer wishbones. The quick rack steering is nice, but I think all type rs have that.
Surprisingly weight of the 22B is supposed to be among the lowest other than the ra, how I dont know.
The wheels are a special offset 35 I think and very light as well as being the only 17inchers that came standard on old shape imprezas. At 850 plus vat per rim, it does explain where some of the money goes.
To be frank, the car is not worth the extra money. Simon de banke says it is unlike any other impreza to drive and easily his favourite, I am nto good enough to appreciate such things, all I know is that it bites like no other in the wet and that I would like abs.
Most of the money goes on the fact that the wings and body panels are rarer and so they add loads onto the price. The production process is also much mroe labour intensive and required movement between factories.
The main reason why they hold their price is the rarity factor, and that they are the only special dition that looks unlike any other impreza road car, and is the most faithful reproduction of the wrc car.
I am sure there i more to it, but cant think of it right now.
The car starts off life as an sti 4 type r. The chassis is seem welded and the engine ditched in favour of a different one. Engine wise the only difference is the closed deck 2.2 block, but its source is a little unknown and spares are a nightmare.
Peak performance of the type r on which it is based is around 4.3 0-60, the 22B is supposed to be quicker due to greater torque and also a flatter larger torque curve, but I doubt there is much in it. The low down torque advantage genertaed by the 2.2 is very noticable and makes the car pull so much harder out of bends. It also has a strong advantage on track as being 6cm wider at the front and 10cm (8 and 12 on mine
) at the back, combined with stif suspension, it totals in an awesome smooth road package. A bit hariy on B roads though. The twin plate clutch does require that it has a different flywheel, but apart from that drivetrain is much the same. Not sure how they achieve the wider track, some to do with offset and spacers but I believe they do have longer wishbones. The quick rack steering is nice, but I think all type rs have that.Surprisingly weight of the 22B is supposed to be among the lowest other than the ra, how I dont know.
The wheels are a special offset 35 I think and very light as well as being the only 17inchers that came standard on old shape imprezas. At 850 plus vat per rim, it does explain where some of the money goes.
To be frank, the car is not worth the extra money. Simon de banke says it is unlike any other impreza to drive and easily his favourite, I am nto good enough to appreciate such things, all I know is that it bites like no other in the wet and that I would like abs.
Most of the money goes on the fact that the wings and body panels are rarer and so they add loads onto the price. The production process is also much mroe labour intensive and required movement between factories.
The main reason why they hold their price is the rarity factor, and that they are the only special dition that looks unlike any other impreza road car, and is the most faithful reproduction of the wrc car.
I am sure there i more to it, but cant think of it right now.
25 January 2002, 01:35 PM
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Adam's right.
It has the same wishbones front and rear (as other type R's Etc), the wider track is down to the wheels alone. Only type RA's have the 'quick rack' as standard.
They are expensive to fix if crashed. We fixed Naseem Hameds car when his cousin crashed it, repair bill was circa £23K IIRC?
The photo's are frightening and WOULD make Adam cry.
May do a crashed car gallery in the shop?
Mike.
It has the same wishbones front and rear (as other type R's Etc), the wider track is down to the wheels alone. Only type RA's have the 'quick rack' as standard.
They are expensive to fix if crashed. We fixed Naseem Hameds car when his cousin crashed it, repair bill was circa £23K IIRC?
The photo's are frightening and WOULD make Adam cry.
May do a crashed car gallery in the shop?
Mike.
25 January 2002, 01:58 PM
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Not wishing to utter a profanity but having seen one close up I was a little disappointed as I didnt really find the flared arches that dramatic and personally preferred the front spoiler and lights from the P1.
I agree it is also seems v expensive for what it is. From what I have read people who have driven it seem impressed though.
Has anyone else offered an X pack conversion for stock Type R's yet? Presumably this could be done by taking fibreglass moulds of the wings and bumpers etc like they used to do on old Fords.
[Edited by wilf - 1/25/2002 2:01:06 PM]
I agree it is also seems v expensive for what it is. From what I have read people who have driven it seem impressed though.
Has anyone else offered an X pack conversion for stock Type R's yet? Presumably this could be done by taking fibreglass moulds of the wings and bumpers etc like they used to do on old Fords.
[Edited by wilf - 1/25/2002 2:01:06 PM]
25 January 2002, 02:25 PM
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Mike, err something is not right here.
I know you ahve fixe one, but the offset difference from the wheels equates to a 2cm wider track, not 6cm front and 10 cm rear. There simply must be more to it than that.
All 22bs have quick racks, not just type ras, and as yet I have not seen an sti type r that doesnt.
Yours does I believe, try it when yuo drive homw, 2.5 turns lock to lock, if its more, its not quick.
I know you ahve fixe one, but the offset difference from the wheels equates to a 2cm wider track, not 6cm front and 10 cm rear. There simply must be more to it than that.
All 22bs have quick racks, not just type ras, and as yet I have not seen an sti type r that doesnt.
Yours does I believe, try it when yuo drive homw, 2.5 turns lock to lock, if its more, its not quick.
25 January 2002, 02:47 PM
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Cheers guys, very informative indeed. So officially is the 22B above the P1 in terms of being top of the range? I always considered P1 to be the top of the Impreza range with 22B's below it followed by Type RA's? I take it from what you have said the 22B is the ultimate Impreza?
25 January 2002, 03:27 PM
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Bravo, that depends on what you mean by ultimate.
The 22B is in my mind the best looking and most special, but the P1 is probably the most effective cross country tool. The 22B is certainly the most expensive and possibly the rarist eince there are 400 or so left in the world rather than 1000 in england for the P1.
On track I would take a 22B everytime, in fact I would take the 22B always cos to me it is an event to drive and just feels so different from all other imprezas.
If it didnt exist however the best place to start interms of tuning and outright performance, I would take an sti 5 or 6 type ra v limited, of scott j davies fame.
The 22B is in my mind the best looking and most special, but the P1 is probably the most effective cross country tool. The 22B is certainly the most expensive and possibly the rarist eince there are 400 or so left in the world rather than 1000 in england for the P1.
On track I would take a 22B everytime, in fact I would take the 22B always cos to me it is an event to drive and just feels so different from all other imprezas.
If it didnt exist however the best place to start interms of tuning and outright performance, I would take an sti 5 or 6 type ra v limited, of scott j davies fame.
25 January 2002, 04:43 PM
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Just another difference i noticed that i wasnt aware of.
The 22b has a sort of 'matt' finished softer dash which i've not seen in any other scoobs.
The others being hard shiny plastic.
The 22b has a sort of 'matt' finished softer dash which i've not seen in any other scoobs.
The others being hard shiny plastic.
25 January 2002, 04:54 PM
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Type R's do NOT have quick rack as standard... not even my V Ltd.
Crap at math's Adam but does the differing offset combined with the fact that yours is an 8" wide wheel rim bring it out in the right area?
When I referred to only RA's having the quick rack, that was taking into account the 22B's; I was trying to point out that type R's don't have them.
Mike.
Crap at math's Adam but does the differing offset combined with the fact that yours is an 8" wide wheel rim bring it out in the right area?
When I referred to only RA's having the quick rack, that was taking into account the 22B's; I was trying to point out that type R's don't have them.
Mike.
25 January 2002, 05:06 PM
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I asssume then that the quickrack was an option on the Type Rs, as I've seen plenty advertised with it, although that may be inaccurate advertising 
BTW - Mike > any news on the Det warning lights for us at MJDesigns??
BTW - Mike > any news on the Det warning lights for us at MJDesigns??
25 January 2002, 05:08 PM
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Wheel hubs are different on a 22B than a type R and are alot thicker and so this would probably add to the wider track, I only know this because i had a bearing go and it runined the hub and after being supplied 1 type R hub which brought the wheel into the arch and one from scoobysport which i had to travel a long way to get being told that it was the same as the one on my car, but it wasnt.
25 January 2002, 05:28 PM
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Gotta say that I love the wide arch STi 4
I drool everytime I see chucks 22B.
maybe one day I'll have one.
Still wondering if Subaru will ever create a car to eclipse the 22B
I drool everytime I see chucks 22B.
maybe one day I'll have one.
Still wondering if Subaru will ever create a car to eclipse the 22B
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