Dill_typeR

Plans are afoot to allow certain M-ways to have this as an extra lane during peak periods.

Sounds good in theory but a few problems jump out at me.

Where do you stop when you break down?

Hampering emergency services if theres a full width accident?

Increased punctures due to the amount of debris that amounts there the rest of the day?

pslewis

YEP!!

Use it .... mind you, we will have ***** in the 2nd fast lane then won't we?? Just sat there!!

The middle lane hogs are responsible for cutting every 3 lane motorway to a 2 lane one!!

mrsteve

I drive down the m42 most days and it works quite well.

They have small laybys if you break down with free recovery, just make sure you have some momentum when you stop to make sure you get to the layby, also it is a monitored speed, so there is no fast lane as such, all 4 lanes are set at whatever speed as long as its the same.(30/40/50/60/70). This means you dont get stuck in traffic jams, or at least constantly crawling at 5 mph

Be wary that they also want to plaster the m'ways with speed camera's and the bizarre average speed cameras (not that i ever break spd limit)

speedking

Sounds good to me as the govt. actually tries to reduce congestion rather than charging more for enduring the same congestion

The 2 problems that I find are:

1. when you are on a normal motorway and the traffic backs up, it is difficult to remember not to go on the hard shoulder.

2. when travelling legitimately on the hard shoulder you cross an exit slip; fear that a lane 1 numpty will sideswipe you as they make for the exit

I suppose that scenario 2 doesn't happen or the trial would not be hailed as a success.

mrsteve

on the m42 i use lane 1 until i need to get into exit lane, unfortunately most of the exits have 2 exits so if im travelling north i end up going west instead of east on my exit, theres a good chance no one other than my own warped mind will understand that, ill put it another way

lots of people end up in birmingham by accident (this is never a good thing).

Luminous

iTrader: (3)

Its the old carrot and stick approach. In this case the carrot is practically free. They give you an extra lane by letting you use the hard shoulder. The costs to do this are minimal.

The stick is that there will be variable speed limits. Behind the signs that show the limits are averaging and also static speed cameras.

What this is really about is the governments goal to help reduce carbon emissions by reducing the national speed limit from 70 to 50 for motorways. They won't actually do this officially, rather the limits applied to the road will always be 50 regardless of the level of traffic. Pretty much how it has been each time I have gone through.

There are loads of times where I have been sitting at 70mph before this section of road, and 70 afterwards. No issues, no jams, but get into the trial area and low and behold you are down to 50 before you know it.

BTW Debris is not likely an issue. Only reason you have debris issues atm is because people do not drive on the hard shoulder to keep it clean. So just like in roadworks areas, the shoulders will be swept before they are opened. Job done.

Luminous

iTrader: (3)

"Pit them", bill them, sue them. They won't do it again

mrsteve

id agree with luminous on that, you think its helping congestion but it does just sit at 50mph, it feels as the the guy monitoring it has gone for a *** break and thought 50 would be good, then got back realised there is no traffic at all and put it back on national.

Friend of mine got done doing 78 in a micra on m42 from a camera, speed limit was 50 at the time though they did him for 78 in a 70... (no traffic of course)

In addition i didnt know micra's went that quick maybe nissan reported him...

Steve_PPP

iTrader: (3)

good idea in my view - i've used the M42 loads and it works really well. Its easy to close a small part of the shoulder if someone breaks down and blocks it too - just needs an investment in the overhead gantrys.

Chelspeed

Two things not mentioned yet.

Firstly it'll take at least 2 years to build all the little laybys and install the gantries for the variable speed signs. So thats 2 years of closed lanes, increased rather than reduced congestion, temporary speed limits (with gatsos) before you even start. How much extra congestion today is worth reducing congestion in 2 years?

Secondly the variable speed limit cameras allegedly can't do you for over 70mph when there's no temporary limit (anyone know for sure if this is the case?). So what does this mean? As someone comments above this means the temporary speed limits are on for 90% of the time at 50 or 60mph when there's no congestion. Could be for carbon reasons but I suspent more likely it's so that they can continue to rake in the revenue to pay for all the work they've done.

So pros and cons as usual.

Borat_Drives_A_Scooby

What about all the sh1te that you get lying on the hard shoulder like fragments of glass and large stones that have been flicked there from cars on the main motorway, i wouldn`t like to drive my scooby down a hard shoulder at any sort of great speed as it will be chipped to buggery by the time you get to the end.

Also where do the big artics pull over if they break down and where will you be able to stop for an emergency p1ss as the hard shoulder was one of my fav spots.

noobyscooby

I used the M42 during the revamp to use the hard shoulder. They have to reinforce the hard shoulder to take the traffic as it wasn't designed for that. Then there are all the gantries which are on humoungous concrete blocks, plus all the electronics, the sensors and so on so it is not cheap and it does take a very long time.

While the contractors were doing this work, at first the road was appalling with huge, huge traffic jams.

Then they hit on the idea of installing 4 speed cameras in the road works 50 mph zone northbound and 4 southbound. Within weeks they had clocked up over 10,000 offences! It was fantastic to watch. Some evenings when the traffic was light the number of flashes was so great it was as if Madonna had turned up topless for film premiere!

One guy in a Focus overtook me doing about 70 going through the camera - FLASH-FLASH!!! Onto the brakes and he dropped in front doing 48 mph. After a bit he took off just as we got to another camera - FLASH-FLASH!!! Onto the brakes AGAIN and he dropped in front doing 48 mph until just before the last of the cameras when, yep, you've guessed it, he took off again and FLASH-FLASH!!! After that he was doing 30 mph!!!!

So the point of all of this as that as soon as the cameras went in, the traffic jams stopped almost overnight as everyone cruised at 48 mph - BRILLIANT. And it gave a very clear demonstration of what was to come - slower but moving traffic.

The only problem is that you need to slow the traffic well in advance of these variable speed areas so you actually need to start pulling the speeds down from 80 [yes, I know what the LEGAL limit is!] to 70, then to 60 then to 50 otherwise the jam occurs at the start of the system and I don't think they have solved this yet on the M42 or the M25 at Heathrow.

But I am for using the hard shoulder and strictly controlling the spped with the cameras as I would rather keep moving even if it is only at 30 mph that sit in stationery traffic with no idea how long we might wait.

Borat - stopping for a pee on the hard shoulder is illegal [so what] and, more importantly, bluddy stupid frankly as that is the most dangerous place to be on a normal motorway. If you leave women and kids in the car, or even your mates, whilst you relieve yourself you really are being a muppet. I saw an accident where several kids were killed after their minibus ran into a truck on the hardshoulder and caught fire. Just don't do it please and use the services like everyone else!

Borat_Drives_A_Scooby

I am on about when i am in the car on my own and if i`m on a motorway and its about 25 mile to the next services i will crack on i have broke down with the hazards on and have a p1ss on the grass on the hard shoulder, i`m sure a few on here have done the same.

Its exciting to be honest as its like having your 1st kiss behind the bike sheds and hoping the teachers don`t catch you, only have a slash tho as i don`t recommend having a good dump as you may get your @ss bitten by something lurking in the grass.