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Import / Motorpoint Warranty Poll
16 November 2005, 05:10 PM
#1
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Import / Motorpoint Warranty Poll
Just a quick poll to gauge opinions & the numbers of SN members affected by the whole Block Exemption Warranty removal farce.
err anyone know how i change some text on me poll? i'm not sure i meant the "I sucks, and i'm sorry for you" bit LOL!
err anyone know how i change some text on me poll? i'm not sure i meant the "I sucks, and i'm sorry for you" bit LOL!
Last edited by DonnieDarko; 16 November 2005 at 05:24 PM.
16 November 2005, 05:21 PM
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I think you need a couple more options:
I have an EU import and have registered the warranty and had work carried out ok
and
I have an EU import, have registered the warranty and but now IM wont allow any work to be carried out.
I have an EU import and have registered the warranty and had work carried out ok
and
I have an EU import, have registered the warranty and but now IM wont allow any work to be carried out.
16 November 2005, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by DonnieDarko
don't think i can change it m8. maybe a friendly mod can do it though??
Have done a bit more research on the warranty issue since my last posts and now offer my opinion for what it‘s worth !
In summary, there is no legislation which prevents Motorpoint buying cars from Liaco in Malta, bringing them into the UK and selling them on to end users.
The fact that Liaco and Motorpoint have decided to go further than the letter of the law requires to promote competition in the common market is fine.
The manufacturer and/or Subaru UK would maybe be happier if officially appointed distribution networks in other EU countries just did the bare minimum to comply with EU competition laws. But it would be very dangerous for the manufacturer to try and prevent Liaco from trading in this way - I believe that it would be seen as anti-competitive with potential for huge fines. What Liaco is doing fits so well with the whole philosophy of the EC competition regulations that I think that the manufacturer and/or obstructive dealerships wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if challenged.
Had the activity of Liaco and Motorpoint been illegal, then Revenues and Customs and DVLA surely would have been the first to spot this - but currently Motorpoint continue to advertise new MY06 Imprezas on their site.
As long as these cars continue to come into the UK market, then I am convinced that the 3yr / 60,000 mile warranty granted by Liaco is valid and enforceable on two counts:-
1. It’s a contract between Liaco and the end user, and
2. EC Regs insist on it.
Clause 17 of the Commission Reg (EC) No 1400/2002 of 31 July 2002 basically says that any manufacturer distribution networks which don’t oblige authorised dealers to honour warranties, perform free servicing and carry out recall work in respect of any motor vehicle sold in the common market is an indirect restriction of sales and is illegal. Clause 17 continues to say that if an authorised dealer located anywhere within the common market refused to carry out warranty work etc, then they would be in breach of EC law.
Fortunately I havn’t had any need for warranty work but as someone said before, the best way to bring this whole issue to a head would be to go legal. So if a dealer refused to carry out warranty work free of charge, then the customer should get this in writing from the dealer, pay the bill him/her self and then take the dealer to court.
I am sure that the Consumer Association / Which? magazine would be interested in supporting a challenge. Not so sure about UK motoring magazines as they have a vested interest in keeping in with manufacturers and dealerships so that they get invited to free junkets, new car launches and get supplied with test cars etc.
As Vipa mentioned in a recent post, the minimum EC competition requirements do allow for agents / intermediaries acting on behalf of end users so there would be nothing to stop Motorpoint acting in this capacity for future transactions.
However, my own view as already stated, is that there is no need to go down this route as the current method adopted by Motorpoint and Liaco should deliver a valid 3 year / 60,000 mile European warranty with cross border acceptance - exactly as it says on the packet !
17 November 2005, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by tim's wrx
Have done a bit more research on the warranty issue since my last posts and now offer my opinion for what it‘s worth !
In summary, there is no legislation which prevents Motorpoint buying cars from Liaco in Malta, bringing them into the UK and selling them on to end users.
The fact that Liaco and Motorpoint have decided to go further than the letter of the law requires to promote competition in the common market is fine.
The manufacturer and/or Subaru UK would maybe be happier if officially appointed distribution networks in other EU countries just did the bare minimum to comply with EU competition laws. But it would be very dangerous for the manufacturer to try and prevent Liaco from trading in this way - I believe that it would be seen as anti-competitive with potential for huge fines. What Liaco is doing fits so well with the whole philosophy of the EC competition regulations that I think that the manufacturer and/or obstructive dealerships wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if challenged.
Had the activity of Liaco and Motorpoint been illegal, then Revenues and Customs and DVLA surely would have been the first to spot this - but currently Motorpoint continue to advertise new MY06 Imprezas on their site.
As long as these cars continue to come into the UK market, then I am convinced that the 3yr / 60,000 mile warranty granted by Liaco is valid and enforceable on two counts:-
1. It’s a contract between Liaco and the end user, and
2. EC Regs insist on it.
Clause 17 of the Commission Reg (EC) No 1400/2002 of 31 July 2002 basically says that any manufacturer distribution networks which don’t oblige authorised dealers to honour warranties, perform free servicing and carry out recall work in respect of any motor vehicle sold in the common market is an indirect restriction of sales and is illegal. Clause 17 continues to say that if an authorised dealer located anywhere within the common market refused to carry out warranty work etc, then they would be in breach of EC law.
Fortunately I havn’t had any need for warranty work but as someone said before, the best way to bring this whole issue to a head would be to go legal. So if a dealer refused to carry out warranty work free of charge, then the customer should get this in writing from the dealer, pay the bill him/her self and then take the dealer to court.
I am sure that the Consumer Association / Which? magazine would be interested in supporting a challenge. Not so sure about UK motoring magazines as they have a vested interest in keeping in with manufacturers and dealerships so that they get invited to free junkets, new car launches and get supplied with test cars etc.
As Vipa mentioned in a recent post, the minimum EC competition requirements do allow for agents / intermediaries acting on behalf of end users so there would be nothing to stop Motorpoint acting in this capacity for future transactions.
However, my own view as already stated, is that there is no need to go down this route as the current method adopted by Motorpoint and Liaco should deliver a valid 3 year / 60,000 mile European warranty with cross border acceptance - exactly as it says on the packet !
Under EU law in a selective distribution model (which FHI and IM operate under) a manufacturer only has to honour cross border warranty work where a signed mandate from the consumer can be produced requesting that the dealer source them a vehicle from another EU member state, this mandate must be dated on or before the date of the invoice from the originating dealer to the intermediary/broker.
V
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18 November 2005, 08:09 AM
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Import issue
Hello ,
Re; Warranty Problem.
I have an imported WRX which i bought from Virgin cars . My supplier is fully aware of the situation and has said that they can get round this problem by supplying a copy of my driving licence, V5 logbook (Copy) and a form from Virgin cars saying that i have authorised them in purchasing my car from Cyprus. Admitadly that I have had no warranty work done yet so I cannot say whether i would have any problems with Virgin cars but they assure me they ll do what ever they can to sort this problem.
Also I have contacted the Office of fair trading and they are very interested in this situation. If I have problems with my supplier / International Motors then I will have no hesitation in contacting them with a view to start legal proceedings.
Have done a bit more research on the warranty issue since my last posts and now offer my opinion for what it‘s worth !
In summary, there is no legislation which prevents Motorpoint buying cars from Liaco in Malta, bringing them into the UK and selling them on to end users.
The fact that Liaco and Motorpoint have decided to go further than the letter of the law requires to promote competition in the common market is fine.
The manufacturer and/or Subaru UK would maybe be happier if officially appointed distribution networks in other EU countries just did the bare minimum to comply with EU competition laws. But it would be very dangerous for the manufacturer to try and prevent Liaco from trading in this way - I believe that it would be seen as anti-competitive with potential for huge fines. What Liaco is doing fits so well with the whole philosophy of the EC competition regulations that I think that the manufacturer and/or obstructive dealerships wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if challenged.
Had the activity of Liaco and Motorpoint been illegal, then Revenues and Customs and DVLA surely would have been the first to spot this - but currently Motorpoint continue to advertise new MY06 Imprezas on their site.
As long as these cars continue to come into the UK market, then I am convinced that the 3yr / 60,000 mile warranty granted by Liaco is valid and enforceable on two counts:-
1. It’s a contract between Liaco and the end user, and
2. EC Regs insist on it.
Clause 17 of the Commission Reg (EC) No 1400/2002 of 31 July 2002 basically says that any manufacturer distribution networks which don’t oblige authorised dealers to honour warranties, perform free servicing and carry out recall work in respect of any motor vehicle sold in the common market is an indirect restriction of sales and is illegal. Clause 17 continues to say that if an authorised dealer located anywhere within the common market refused to carry out warranty work etc, then they would be in breach of EC law.
Fortunately I havn’t had any need for warranty work but as someone said before, the best way to bring this whole issue to a head would be to go legal. So if a dealer refused to carry out warranty work free of charge, then the customer should get this in writing from the dealer, pay the bill him/her self and then take the dealer to court.
I am sure that the Consumer Association / Which? magazine would be interested in supporting a challenge. Not so sure about UK motoring magazines as they have a vested interest in keeping in with manufacturers and dealerships so that they get invited to free junkets, new car launches and get supplied with test cars etc.
As Vipa mentioned in a recent post, the minimum EC competition requirements do allow for agents / intermediaries acting on behalf of end users so there would be nothing to stop Motorpoint acting in this capacity for future transactions.
However, my own view as already stated, is that there is no need to go down this route as the current method adopted by Motorpoint and Liaco should deliver a valid 3 year / 60,000 mile European warranty with cross border acceptance - exactly as it says on the packet !
Re; Warranty Problem.
I have an imported WRX which i bought from Virgin cars . My supplier is fully aware of the situation and has said that they can get round this problem by supplying a copy of my driving licence, V5 logbook (Copy) and a form from Virgin cars saying that i have authorised them in purchasing my car from Cyprus. Admitadly that I have had no warranty work done yet so I cannot say whether i would have any problems with Virgin cars but they assure me they ll do what ever they can to sort this problem.
Also I have contacted the Office of fair trading and they are very interested in this situation. If I have problems with my supplier / International Motors then I will have no hesitation in contacting them with a view to start legal proceedings.
Originally Posted by tim's wrx
Have done a bit more research on the warranty issue since my last posts and now offer my opinion for what it‘s worth !
In summary, there is no legislation which prevents Motorpoint buying cars from Liaco in Malta, bringing them into the UK and selling them on to end users.
The fact that Liaco and Motorpoint have decided to go further than the letter of the law requires to promote competition in the common market is fine.
The manufacturer and/or Subaru UK would maybe be happier if officially appointed distribution networks in other EU countries just did the bare minimum to comply with EU competition laws. But it would be very dangerous for the manufacturer to try and prevent Liaco from trading in this way - I believe that it would be seen as anti-competitive with potential for huge fines. What Liaco is doing fits so well with the whole philosophy of the EC competition regulations that I think that the manufacturer and/or obstructive dealerships wouldn’t have a leg to stand on if challenged.
Had the activity of Liaco and Motorpoint been illegal, then Revenues and Customs and DVLA surely would have been the first to spot this - but currently Motorpoint continue to advertise new MY06 Imprezas on their site.
As long as these cars continue to come into the UK market, then I am convinced that the 3yr / 60,000 mile warranty granted by Liaco is valid and enforceable on two counts:-
1. It’s a contract between Liaco and the end user, and
2. EC Regs insist on it.
Clause 17 of the Commission Reg (EC) No 1400/2002 of 31 July 2002 basically says that any manufacturer distribution networks which don’t oblige authorised dealers to honour warranties, perform free servicing and carry out recall work in respect of any motor vehicle sold in the common market is an indirect restriction of sales and is illegal. Clause 17 continues to say that if an authorised dealer located anywhere within the common market refused to carry out warranty work etc, then they would be in breach of EC law.
Fortunately I havn’t had any need for warranty work but as someone said before, the best way to bring this whole issue to a head would be to go legal. So if a dealer refused to carry out warranty work free of charge, then the customer should get this in writing from the dealer, pay the bill him/her self and then take the dealer to court.
I am sure that the Consumer Association / Which? magazine would be interested in supporting a challenge. Not so sure about UK motoring magazines as they have a vested interest in keeping in with manufacturers and dealerships so that they get invited to free junkets, new car launches and get supplied with test cars etc.
As Vipa mentioned in a recent post, the minimum EC competition requirements do allow for agents / intermediaries acting on behalf of end users so there would be nothing to stop Motorpoint acting in this capacity for future transactions.
However, my own view as already stated, is that there is no need to go down this route as the current method adopted by Motorpoint and Liaco should deliver a valid 3 year / 60,000 mile European warranty with cross border acceptance - exactly as it says on the packet !
Last edited by Mjb1957; 18 November 2005 at 08:14 AM. Reason: added more info
18 November 2005, 10:27 AM
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[QUOTE=tim's wrx]
Clause 17 of the Commission Reg (EC) No 1400/2002 of 31 July 2002 basically says that any manufacturer distribution networks which don’t oblige authorised dealers to honour warranties, perform free servicing and carry out recall work in respect of any motor vehicle sold in the common market is an indirect restriction of sales and is illegal. Clause 17 continues to say that if an authorised dealer located anywhere within the common market refused to carry out warranty work etc, then they would be in breach of EC law.
THis bit sounds very promising but as I understand it IM's defence is that the cars are being sold through none authorised dealers in the UK so they are not obliged to honour the warranties. You are right it is probably going to take a court case to resolve this at some point
Clause 17 of the Commission Reg (EC) No 1400/2002 of 31 July 2002 basically says that any manufacturer distribution networks which don’t oblige authorised dealers to honour warranties, perform free servicing and carry out recall work in respect of any motor vehicle sold in the common market is an indirect restriction of sales and is illegal. Clause 17 continues to say that if an authorised dealer located anywhere within the common market refused to carry out warranty work etc, then they would be in breach of EC law.
THis bit sounds very promising but as I understand it IM's defence is that the cars are being sold through none authorised dealers in the UK so they are not obliged to honour the warranties. You are right it is probably going to take a court case to resolve this at some point
21 November 2005, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Vipa
I agree with everything you say.... however, there is one thing you haven't mentioned which IS the be all and end all of the whole situation.
Under EU law in a selective distribution model (which FHI and IM operate under) a manufacturer only has to honour cross border warranty work where a signed mandate from the consumer can be produced requesting that the dealer source them a vehicle from another EU member state, this mandate must be dated on or before the date of the invoice from the originating dealer to the intermediary/broker.
V
Under EU law in a selective distribution model (which FHI and IM operate under) a manufacturer only has to honour cross border warranty work where a signed mandate from the consumer can be produced requesting that the dealer source them a vehicle from another EU member state, this mandate must be dated on or before the date of the invoice from the originating dealer to the intermediary/broker.
V
22 November 2005, 10:24 AM
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no m8. I have no Mandate from IM.
I was advised by Liaco not to send IM anything as I did not need to.
See e-mail:
Should you require a warranty intervention, you may be requested by IM to register your warranty with them however since you have a valid Warranty book in hand, all that should be required is to present the Warranty booklet to the Authorised Repairer and he will then take it from there.
There is absolutely no need to present a copy of any correspondence supplied by Liaco Ltd except of course a copy of the Warranty and Service Booklet if required. As advised, your vehicle has been registered with Subaru Head Office by Subaru Malta and your 3 year Pan European Warranty initiated on the first date of registration.
Sincere thanks
Subaru MT (After Sales Department)
Liaco Limited
Lia Buildings, Mosta Road, Lija BZN09 MALTA
TEL: (+356) 2141 8111 * FAX: (+356) 2141 8589
We shall see!!!!
I was advised by Liaco not to send IM anything as I did not need to.
See e-mail:
Should you require a warranty intervention, you may be requested by IM to register your warranty with them however since you have a valid Warranty book in hand, all that should be required is to present the Warranty booklet to the Authorised Repairer and he will then take it from there.
There is absolutely no need to present a copy of any correspondence supplied by Liaco Ltd except of course a copy of the Warranty and Service Booklet if required. As advised, your vehicle has been registered with Subaru Head Office by Subaru Malta and your 3 year Pan European Warranty initiated on the first date of registration.
Sincere thanks
Subaru MT (After Sales Department)
Liaco Limited
Lia Buildings, Mosta Road, Lija BZN09 MALTA
TEL: (+356) 2141 8111 * FAX: (+356) 2141 8589
We shall see!!!!
22 November 2005, 10:37 AM
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Still a total blanket of silence from all corners!!!!
I have an appointment with My Solicitors next Tuesday, We'll take things from there!
V
I have an appointment with My Solicitors next Tuesday, We'll take things from there!
V
Last edited by Vipa; 22 November 2005 at 10:42 AM.
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