octane Boosters - an alternative
17 February 2004, 11:55 AM
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octane Boosters - an alternative
I see that octane boosters are quite popular with Scooby owners - particually on the import models that are designed to run 100 ron fuel
does anybody on here use water injection ?
Water injection is used to cool the temperature of the air entering the engine, but is also used as an antidetonant by slowing the burn process of the fuel.
.................................................. ...........
Another type of additive is methanol
Methanol can be bought for about £1 per litre and can either be added to your fuel - or added in a 25% methanol / 75% water mix in the water injection system
.................................................. ..........
does anybody use it ?
does anybody on here use water injection ?
Water injection is used to cool the temperature of the air entering the engine, but is also used as an antidetonant by slowing the burn process of the fuel.
.................................................. ...........
Another type of additive is methanol
Methanol can be bought for about £1 per litre and can either be added to your fuel - or added in a 25% methanol / 75% water mix in the water injection system
.................................................. ..........
does anybody use it ?
17 February 2004, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by jlanng
methanol's nasty stuff - very corrosive
however aluminium oxide actually protects the aluminium underneath it (a bit like anodising does) - so its not really a problem
17 February 2004, 01:22 PM
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http://www.inchem.org/documents/hsg/hsg/v105hsg.htm
2.5 Effects on humans
Methanol is irritating to the eyes, skin and respiratory tract.
A broad range of ocular effects have been associated with longer-term
occupational exposure to lower levels of methanol. Acute oral and
inhalation exposures and, to a lesser extent, percutaneous absorption
of high concentrations of methanol have resulted in central nervous
system depression, blindness, coma and death.
Repeated or prolonged contact of methanol with skin may result in
dermatitis. Liquid methanol defats the skin. It is also an effective
extracting solvent and may damage the skin permeability barrier.
Nearly all the information on methanol toxicity in humans relates
to the consequences of acute rather than chronic exposure and the vast
majority of poisonings result from the consumption of adulterated
beverages or methanol-containing products. Although oral ingestion is
the most frequent route of poisoning, in severe and exceptional
conditions inhalation of methanol vapour and percutaneous absorption
of methanolic liquids are also effective in producing acute toxic
syndrome characterized by metabolic acidosis, central nervous system
depression, blindness, coma and death.
The severity of the metabolic acidosis is variable and may not
correlate well with the amount of methanol ingested. The variability
of the toxic dose is a prominent feature in methanol toxicity.
The symptoms of methanol poisoning, which may not appear for 12
to 24 h, include visual disturbances, nausea, abdominal and muscle
pain, dizziness, weakness and disturbances of consciousness ranging
from coma to clonic seizures.
The lethal dose of methanol for humans is not known for certain,
but is reported to range from 0.3 to 1 g/kg. Autopsies from victims
of lethal methanol poisoning reveal retinal and optic nerve
degeneration and gross pathology in the visceral organs, lungs and
central nervous system, involving a variety of oedematous,
haemorrhagic and degenerative changes.
Visual disturbances of several types (blurring, constriction of
the visual field, changes in colour perception and temporary or
permanent blindness) have been reported in workers exposed to methanol
air levels in excess of occupational exposure limits.
No epidemiological data are available to evaluate the
carcinogenicity of methanol for humans. Folate-deficient individuals
might be at greater risk of methanol toxicity compared to normal
individuals. Human populations that are potentially at risk of folate
deficiency include pregnant women, the elderly, alcoholics,
individuals with poor quality diets and individuals on certain
medication.
Methanol is irritating to the eyes, skin and respiratory tract.
A broad range of ocular effects have been associated with longer-term
occupational exposure to lower levels of methanol. Acute oral and
inhalation exposures and, to a lesser extent, percutaneous absorption
of high concentrations of methanol have resulted in central nervous
system depression, blindness, coma and death.
Repeated or prolonged contact of methanol with skin may result in
dermatitis. Liquid methanol defats the skin. It is also an effective
extracting solvent and may damage the skin permeability barrier.
Nearly all the information on methanol toxicity in humans relates
to the consequences of acute rather than chronic exposure and the vast
majority of poisonings result from the consumption of adulterated
beverages or methanol-containing products. Although oral ingestion is
the most frequent route of poisoning, in severe and exceptional
conditions inhalation of methanol vapour and percutaneous absorption
of methanolic liquids are also effective in producing acute toxic
syndrome characterized by metabolic acidosis, central nervous system
depression, blindness, coma and death.
The severity of the metabolic acidosis is variable and may not
correlate well with the amount of methanol ingested. The variability
of the toxic dose is a prominent feature in methanol toxicity.
The symptoms of methanol poisoning, which may not appear for 12
to 24 h, include visual disturbances, nausea, abdominal and muscle
pain, dizziness, weakness and disturbances of consciousness ranging
from coma to clonic seizures.
The lethal dose of methanol for humans is not known for certain,
but is reported to range from 0.3 to 1 g/kg. Autopsies from victims
of lethal methanol poisoning reveal retinal and optic nerve
degeneration and gross pathology in the visceral organs, lungs and
central nervous system, involving a variety of oedematous,
haemorrhagic and degenerative changes.
Visual disturbances of several types (blurring, constriction of
the visual field, changes in colour perception and temporary or
permanent blindness) have been reported in workers exposed to methanol
air levels in excess of occupational exposure limits.
No epidemiological data are available to evaluate the
carcinogenicity of methanol for humans. Folate-deficient individuals
might be at greater risk of methanol toxicity compared to normal
individuals. Human populations that are potentially at risk of folate
deficiency include pregnant women, the elderly, alcoholics,
individuals with poor quality diets and individuals on certain
medication.
17 February 2004, 02:30 PM
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does anybody on here use water injection ?
Adding a water injection system involves the cost of the tank, pump and injection pipework, and, to get the most out of it, a remap.
So yes, while WI has its place, it isn't really an alternative to the widespread use many people make of commercial boosters.
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17 February 2004, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by greasemonkey
Yes, but if you're really asking "Why don't you lot use WI instead of octane booster?", the answer, in addition to the points made above, is that octane booster is simply the easiest way to get the fuel on a Japanese market import Impreza up to the specifications the car is designed to run on.
.
.
If you offset the cost of adding octane booster against the one off cost of using water injection - it may become a very attractive alternative
i wonder how much it costs to use octane booster for a 1 year / 12,000 mile period ?
17 February 2004, 05:39 PM
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You're still missing the point a bit. To use water injection properly, not only do you need to factor in the cost of the WI kit, you need to factor in the cost of a remap.
As a remap alone is enough to prevent you being tied to a supply of octane booster on a Japanese market car, the water injection still counts as an unnecessary and avoidable cost.
As a remap alone is enough to prevent you being tied to a supply of octane booster on a Japanese market car, the water injection still counts as an unnecessary and avoidable cost.
17 February 2004, 06:23 PM
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Water injection is an excellent knock suppressent (sp?), and is also supposed to be very good with a 50/50 methanol mix.
Another product coming onto the market in the states is propane injection as an alternative to water/methanol injection.
Both these products allow you to turn the boost up higher on standard intercoolers before encountering knock.
Steve
Another product coming onto the market in the states is propane injection as an alternative to water/methanol injection.
Both these products allow you to turn the boost up higher on standard intercoolers before encountering knock.
Steve
17 February 2004, 09:11 PM
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GreaseMonkey
I don't quite know why anybody would want to remap a car to use water injection PMSL
if you were going to the bother to remap the car you would map it for uk fuel and be done with it
a years driving with octane boost would easily offset the cost of the water injection kit
and the great thing is water is free !! so its a once only cost
it also allows you to safely run more boost if you want to
I don't quite know why anybody would want to remap a car to use water injection PMSL
if you were going to the bother to remap the car you would map it for uk fuel and be done with it
a years driving with octane boost would easily offset the cost of the water injection kit
and the great thing is water is free !! so its a once only cost
it also allows you to safely run more boost if you want to
Last edited by 10oftheBest; 17 February 2004 at 09:12 PM. Reason: grammer
17 February 2004, 10:24 PM
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I don't quite know why anybody would want to remap a car to use water injection PMSL
Okay, let's start this again seeing as you've not quite got it yet.If you installed a WI system on an otherwise standard car, using it will cost you a bit of power. However, if you use it, you'll be able (with a remap) to run more advance, thus getting your "lost" power back, and a bit more besides. Hence my comment that if you're going to run WI, you need a remap to make the most of it.
if you were going to the bother to remap the car you would map it for uk fuel and be done with it
a years driving with octane boost would easily offset the cost of the water injection kit
Last edited by greasemonkey; 17 February 2004 at 10:25 PM.
17 February 2004, 10:31 PM
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I believe people remap the car with water injection so as to release the benefits of water injection - running more advance.
If you didn't remap, I think I am right in saying that adding water injection reduces the power of the car. I'd rather increase octane than reduce power.
If you didn't remap, I think I am right in saying that adding water injection reduces the power of the car. I'd rather increase octane than reduce power.
yeah, what he said
18 February 2004, 09:38 AM
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"Doh, Okay, let's start this again seeing as you've not quite got it yet."
Have you mapped many cars in your time then ?
Perhaps its you who hasn't got it yet
Water injection is triggered to come on when your car is above a certain boost and when the ACT's are high (exactly the sort of conditions that will encourage det) you wouldn't want to use it in any other situation
When you add octane boost - its used all the time even when the car is idling at the traffic lights - bit of a waste really
Have you mapped many cars in your time then ?
Perhaps its you who hasn't got it yet
Water injection is triggered to come on when your car is above a certain boost and when the ACT's are high (exactly the sort of conditions that will encourage det) you wouldn't want to use it in any other situation
When you add octane boost - its used all the time even when the car is idling at the traffic lights - bit of a waste really
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