Dave T-S

EVO haven't figured the STi PPP yet, they used the numbers that IM supplied with their demo car.

BRR
Why's it so important? I just get in mine and drive it

It's out in the real world that's important, and in any case a really good driver would be quicker (and more importantly, safer) in a 261.5bhp STi UK than in a 300bhp PPP car......

[Edited by Dave T-S - 11/5/2002 8:53:26 PM]

BRR

Does anyone have any solid facts about the output of the various permutations of the STI7?

There has been lots of talk about PPP, decats, UK versus JDM STIs and so on... I have a JDM STI and I know that it is much quicker (esp. down low and at the top of the rev range) than standard, but I'm interested to know the real story on:

- JDM STI - standard
- UK/AUS STI - standard
- JDM STI - decat (with standard boost)
- UK STI with PPP

Does anyone have any dyno runs of the above for real comparison? Some say that the JDM STi only puts out the stated 276 bhp, but in several road tests it seems almost as quick as the previous STI even with the extra weight. Is the 310 bhp a myth?

My guess is that a JDM STI with decat is similar to PPP, but what do YOU think?

johnfelstead

Dyno runs dont prove anything. The stopwatch is the only thing that will prove how they compare in real terms.

I would absolutely love to get all the various specs of STi7 engine upgrades together for a back to back test at the nurburgring. It would make a superb article and show in real terms which is best.

I would want standard cars except for the engine upgrades. Plus a standard car as reference.

The only dificult bit of this is getting a group of owners together willing to let me drive their cars.

Mungo

And getting clear laps on each run?

TaviaRS

Mungo, you could rent it for an hour, exclusive use, for I think its £1500.

Almost enough for 2 laps per car (based on there being 4 cars).

Of course it wouldn't be fair just to have 1 driver doing it, so I'll volunteer to help out

BRR

So the silence continues?

Another thing I noticed that is weird is that in EVO car listings (at the back of the mag), they list the P1 as about 215 hp/tonne, and the STI7 JDM at 195 hp/tonne, but the 0-60 time in the STI is the same as the P1 at 4.8 secs? (the UK STI was listed at 5.1, and apparently the UKSTI PPP is 4.6)

Is this due to more torque low down, better drag coefficient or what?

Razor2001

Bret,

Is that you matey ?

I would like to have this cleared up as well. Would love to know what my JDM ST-7 with full turbo back decat can do 0-60 and 1/4 mile.

I finally got my adjustable flow valve in so should be putting that on in a few weeks (car in shop, mild accident and dented right back 1/4 panel and trunk

You made any additional mods to your car recently ?

Cheers,
Ray

Andy W

Brr, surely 0-60 depends on gearing + torque as well, not to mention the person behind the wheel

Jools

I have had my UK Prodrive Sti with PPP fitted (11.5K miles) on the rollers at Star Performance and it does what is says on the tin; 300 BHP @ 6850 RPM.

Willie F had his standard UK Prodrive Sti on the same rollers and I'm sure he got 262 BHP, but he would need to confirm that with you.

Hope this helps.
Jools

NENO

BRR,

Comparison times in the back of EVO, these are most likely manufacturers claimed so expect a little marketing hype! A more common ploy than you might think...

The P1 has a five speed gearbox, STI7 has six closer ratios which will help make it more rapid.

Josh L

I think I'm right in saying that most of the figures in Evo are their own, and don't always tally with the manufacturers figures. If they haven't properly tested these figures they use the manufacturers figures and mark them as 'claimed'.

When I did a shoot with them, they'd had the test equipment of their UK300 the day before.

Josh

mega_stream

Slightly O/T but
I know JDM means an import, but what's it stand for?

J????(apanese)??
D????
M????(odel)??

Steve Breen

Japanese Domestic Market

Steve

Carolyn T-S

Oi DTS...if you really had the "I just get in my car and drive it attitude", how come your STi has the PPP and mine doesn't.

Just to clarify DTS PPP'd STi is fast as **** and leaves my standard one way behind

Guess what's on my Christmas pressie list

johnfelstead

you two need to follow me in convoy to a german villiage, i'll sort you some beers at the bar then just nip out for 18 minutes just to double check something.

JGRIFF

John, is that 18 minutes per car, or are you claiming 9 mins including the change over?

johnfelstead

9 minutes including the changeover.

BRR

Hey Ray,

Yep, its me - I forgot my password then used this ID on my work machine and never swapped back... No more mods yet... fast enough for now and my partner has cracked down on the budget. I'm thinking about making an extended display for my Knocklink so that I can put the LEDs separate from the box though...

Dave - yep, I just get out and drive, but I'm interested. There's lots of BS about this issue and I'd like to know the real deal (especially since I know some Aussies (who have the same spec as the Type UK). Also, the Aus mags are always winging on about the lack of torque under 4K and I don't understand what they're on about - it just don't seem a problem in my car (JDM/Decat) - it goes like stink from low revs to redline.

Does the Type UK have a bigger torque "hole" than the JDM? - it sounds like it.

BRR

PS - Dave - Evo have a review of the PPP under their "driven" section in the November issue...

... did they quote performance figures without testing it... that's naughty of them then.

Another odd thing springs to mind - does anyone remember the review early last year of one of the early JDM STIs versus the EVO VII in EVO? - I seem to remember that their times for 0-60 were around 4.7 for both cars and 13s to 100 mph - could be that Lichfields had decatted that one prior to the review maybe?

T5NYW

iTrader: (4)

BRR,
The JDM runs on 100ron fuel and doesnt need to comply with the tight EU laws on emmisions. The STi7 TypeUK has a different Exhaust (1 CAT more I think) and the ECU programmed for 95-98 ron fuel and detuned to pass emissions.
Brand new Uk cars have to comply with both cold and Hot run emmisions test, where as Secondhand cars only have to comply with hot engine tests.
PPP can only be fitted to a 'old' cars as the Std Cats are removed and sports Cat refitted and so passing Hot emmissions Tests.

Tony IMHO

BRR

Aha...

Did find out a couple of crucial differences - I didn't realise that the UK STI is apparently 1470 versus 1430 Kg and has higher 5th and 6th gear ratios (same diff ration of 3.90 tho):

UK 5th - 0.97 / JDM 5th - 1.06
UK 6th - 0.76 / JDM 6th - 0.84

This weight will affect the acceleration I suppose and the gearing may well impact the overtaking responsiveness and 0-100 mph times.

BRR

Also Tony, there seems to be some dispute about this "mapped for 100 RON" thing.

Several comments recently that most Japanese drivers don't run 100 RON and some comments in a mapping thread where they were comparing ECU maps and didn't see any significant difference in the fuelling/timing between the P1 and STI6 other than in max. retard...?

This is ANOTHER thing that I would like to get to the bottom of!!!

RT

Does anyone here live in Japan, or has spent significant time in Japan in the last couple of years?

For a start, we could try and find out if all the Japanese gas stations sell 100RON fuel, or if its only a handful. This may help solve our mystery in how many of these cars actually are mapped for 100RON.

AJbaseBloke

I am sure there must be a couple of stations in the boonies that do not sell 100RON (or hi-oku). But since almost all cars with any sporting intent require 100RON (incl. lots of Euros), every station I have ever visited from Hokkaido (the northern island) to Kyushu (the southern island - but not southern most ) has had the good stuff.

As for people hardly ever using hi-oku, the person who said that must either have a wierd set of friends, or not have a clue.

MattOz

John,

You take the PPP'd STI and I'll take the standard car and I'll see you at the bar when you get back! LOL

Matt

BASHER

BRR

I was on the prodrive website the other day, and downloaded a PDF file of the before and after figures of the STi7, PPP and non PPP.

hope this is of some help

johnfelstead

oh how i love an optimist.

Nah, i'll just take my TypeRA and lap both of the heavyweights.

Razor2001

I would be interested to know how many STI-7 owners in Japan don't run 100 RON gas. I know I can only get 98 RON here and that is all I run with NO octane booster (not becuase I am cheap but becuase I feel like the octane booster may do more harm than good). All my delta dash runs show zero knock and plenty advance straight through the rev range. Not sure if there is undetectable knock happening but from what I can tell my car is running very nicely.

Has anyone run a timed 0-60 and 1/4 mile in a JDM STI-7 full decat ?

Is there any truth to the JDM and UK ecu's be very similar with really no differences on the mapping for 100 RON fuel ?

Cheers,
Ray

Razor2001

bttt

BRR

Same here in NZ, Ray - we're running 98 Octane and that's with the blessing of the dealers. The JDM spec is sold locally by the official dealer channel.

My thoughts on the 100 Octane thing are that the JDM model is probably set up for 98-100 and the UK for 95-98? That would necessitate more retart on the UK one, but would explain why things run fine on 98 with the JDM car.