P1 vs EVO7
07 August 2001, 10:44 PM
#1
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After having the evo7 since saturday over only 500 miles i can give you all a few views in comparison. ( fair views of course )
Firstly the evo even just to 3500 rpm is much more responsive on the throttle and seems quicker although that might be down to power delivery.
From the minute you close the door on the evo as everybody has commented the build quality is streets ahead, driving position in the evo is slightly higher with a smaller momo wheel and a 2.1 lock which is also so much more precise than the p1.
The ride in the evo is quite hard in comparison but feels sturdy with no body roll at all,to give you an idea the p1 feels as though it what to fly under cornering with power where as the evo just whats to dig into terra-firma.
Brakes are god damn wicked and the sports abs are also a great feature as i cannot get it to understeer under braking no matter what.
Over poor road surfaces the evo is proberbly a litte MORE skippy than the p1 however on a good surface sorry folks but again it is a step up and quite a big one and as for wet weather well it now puts a big smile on my face.
The evo takes a little more work to drive than the p1 but you feel more rewarded, engine noise no-contest p1 wins hands down.
I think once run-in i will take quite a bit off my time on most of my time trials that i use in my area but the ones with poor surfaces i think it will be very close.
I will keep you all updated but in the meantime dont just take my opinion go and have a dive in one and see for yourselves as they are the ULTIMATE DRIVERS CAR.( sorry for the cheese )
P.S. Arron i think you should put a stop on the m3 as its already 1-0 ( car june ).
J
Firstly the evo even just to 3500 rpm is much more responsive on the throttle and seems quicker although that might be down to power delivery.
From the minute you close the door on the evo as everybody has commented the build quality is streets ahead, driving position in the evo is slightly higher with a smaller momo wheel and a 2.1 lock which is also so much more precise than the p1.
The ride in the evo is quite hard in comparison but feels sturdy with no body roll at all,to give you an idea the p1 feels as though it what to fly under cornering with power where as the evo just whats to dig into terra-firma.
Brakes are god damn wicked and the sports abs are also a great feature as i cannot get it to understeer under braking no matter what.
Over poor road surfaces the evo is proberbly a litte MORE skippy than the p1 however on a good surface sorry folks but again it is a step up and quite a big one and as for wet weather well it now puts a big smile on my face.
The evo takes a little more work to drive than the p1 but you feel more rewarded, engine noise no-contest p1 wins hands down.
I think once run-in i will take quite a bit off my time on most of my time trials that i use in my area but the ones with poor surfaces i think it will be very close.
I will keep you all updated but in the meantime dont just take my opinion go and have a dive in one and see for yourselves as they are the ULTIMATE DRIVERS CAR.( sorry for the cheese )
P.S. Arron i think you should put a stop on the m3 as its already 1-0 ( car june ).
J
07 August 2001, 11:00 PM
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Jason,
1-0 in Car June? What are you talking about?
I must have read a different article. Its final conclusion was that, if you could afford the extra 7k, you should go for the M3, otherwise you couldn't go far wrong with the Evo.
Other highlights were the M3 keeping up with the Evo in the wet.
Confused ... Are you relying on no-one else here having read the article or do you just have a short memory?
Ian.
1-0 in Car June? What are you talking about?
I must have read a different article. Its final conclusion was that, if you could afford the extra 7k, you should go for the M3, otherwise you couldn't go far wrong with the Evo.
Other highlights were the M3 keeping up with the Evo in the wet.
Confused ... Are you relying on no-one else here having read the article or do you just have a short memory?
Ian.
07 August 2001, 11:13 PM
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What that article actually says is ...
"So if you're looking for a car that will silence your friends with terrifying grip and acceleration, give you the secure knowledge that you're driving one of the fastest real-world cars you can buy, and offer you credibility, practicality and mean looks, then the Evo VII real is an alternative to the M3. Congratulations, you've just saved yourself eight grand. But if you can afford the M3, BMW spent that extra money very well indeed"
How can anyone claim that's a victory for the Evo? I'd call it a straight draw, especially when you read the whole article ...
Ian.
"So if you're looking for a car that will silence your friends with terrifying grip and acceleration, give you the secure knowledge that you're driving one of the fastest real-world cars you can buy, and offer you credibility, practicality and mean looks, then the Evo VII real is an alternative to the M3. Congratulations, you've just saved yourself eight grand. But if you can afford the M3, BMW spent that extra money very well indeed"
How can anyone claim that's a victory for the Evo? I'd call it a straight draw, especially when you read the whole article ...
Ian.
07 August 2001, 11:21 PM
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Just to add an aside. An M3 is 32K as an import, brings it right in the same price bracket as an Evo7. If the STI is 30-32K then an import M3 will be the way to go.
To do well the UK STI needs to be 25K
To do well the UK STI needs to be 25K
07 August 2001, 11:23 PM
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yes russ i got the gsr= titainium turbo etc.
droid ( says much ) yes the conculsion did say that but the evo is 7k less and more a drivers car focusing on a and b roads as appose to a/duel/motorways, driven both and in my humble opinion no-contest although the new m3 is by far the best yet and a fantastic car.
J
droid ( says much ) yes the conculsion did say that but the evo is 7k less and more a drivers car focusing on a and b roads as appose to a/duel/motorways, driven both and in my humble opinion no-contest although the new m3 is by far the best yet and a fantastic car.
J
07 August 2001, 11:28 PM
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Like many powerful RWD cars, the M3 is definitely a car that is impossible to judge on first impressions. I can see exactly why you initially thought the Evo 7 to be superior (as many people probably will).
Personal opinions aside, my original point still stands ... the article in Car was a definite draw at worst. Anyone who claims it to be a victory for the Evo (e.g. "1-0") is plain misleading people.
Ian.
P.S. Name's not droid for the reason you might think :-)
Personal opinions aside, my original point still stands ... the article in Car was a definite draw at worst. Anyone who claims it to be a victory for the Evo (e.g. "1-0") is plain misleading people.
Ian.
P.S. Name's not droid for the reason you might think :-)
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08 August 2001, 12:00 AM
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Oh good.....another "cheaper EVO/Sti is better than the M3" thread...
They are all great cars in their own right but they don't always have to be compared as a 'A' v 'B' type choice. For me, I tried them all and ordered an M3 as I thought it had the best engine, build integrity, resdiual potential and is a pure driving machine, especially with the DSC switched off!.
Gareth-preparing flame proof clothing as we speak...
They are all great cars in their own right but they don't always have to be compared as a 'A' v 'B' type choice. For me, I tried them all and ordered an M3 as I thought it had the best engine, build integrity, resdiual potential and is a pure driving machine, especially with the DSC switched off!.
Gareth-preparing flame proof clothing as we speak...
08 August 2001, 12:13 AM
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Here we go again...
There is no "better". Only what you prefer. One person will prefer this and another will prefer that etc etc.
Just drive the damn car, be it an M3/Evo/P1/STi/2CV and decide for yourself.
There is no "better". Only what you prefer. One person will prefer this and another will prefer that etc etc.
Just drive the damn car, be it an M3/Evo/P1/STi/2CV and decide for yourself.
08 August 2001, 12:32 AM
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I've got an M3 (E36 EVO) and I'd never go back now.
Saying that, I totally understand why people prefer their P1 or Lancer - both are real hands on driver's cars.
For me though, as Gareth says, the overall package of the M3 makes it an easy choice.
(but then again I'm 31 and an old fart now)
Saying that, I totally understand why people prefer their P1 or Lancer - both are real hands on driver's cars.
For me though, as Gareth says, the overall package of the M3 makes it an easy choice.
(but then again I'm 31 and an old fart now)
08 August 2001, 01:13 PM
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Has everyone forgot that the Evo looks pants - better than the new Scoob (not hard) but still crap compared to the quality of the BMW. When you cconsider that the BMW will hold its value better and require less regular servicing, the price difference will be minmal.
I'd still wouldn't mind either one - even if one looks soft and the other is widely acknoledged as a to55ers car.
I'd still wouldn't mind either one - even if one looks soft and the other is widely acknoledged as a to55ers car.
08 August 2001, 06:32 PM
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Although I drive a P1 (and chose it over more expensive cars including BMW M5, E36 M3, Evo VI, Skyline GTR34, 911 C2 - partly for value for money reasons before you all moan), I would be surprised if motoring technology had not moved on in the year and a half since it was introduced. The hot scoob vs Evo has always been a close batte - one year's development can change a lot. The Evo VII is a touch quicker, and may well handle better, although I don't know not having driven one.
But let's face it, the difference is between 90 and 95% of a great driver's car in either case. They both blow away anything priced 30k or thereabouts. Personally I still like the P1 for smoother ride, better fuel range, better looks (IMO), but it is very close. If I had £30k and no car, I might as well flip a coin to decide which one I'd have. I find it strange that people who are essentially liking very similar cars decide to slag each other off.
But let's face it, the difference is between 90 and 95% of a great driver's car in either case. They both blow away anything priced 30k or thereabouts. Personally I still like the P1 for smoother ride, better fuel range, better looks (IMO), but it is very close. If I had £30k and no car, I might as well flip a coin to decide which one I'd have. I find it strange that people who are essentially liking very similar cars decide to slag each other off.
08 August 2001, 09:37 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by DazV:
Saying that, I totally understand why people prefer their P1 or Lancer - both are real hands on driver's cars.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I wouldn't really say that. Both the Evo and the P1 are lovely cars in their own class & price range, but they're still very much point and squirt. It's difficult to go wrong in a road situation (although not impossible, of course).
I had a look at both, along with Supras, Celicas, 300ZXs, M3s, M5s and an Elise. I bought a Teg Type R in the end and the only car that came close as a "driver's car" was the Elise IMHO.
I guess it's about choice and needs though. The Teg's about fun, but it wouldn't be the best car for taking the family out or for doing hundreds of miles on a motorway every day.
Each to their own eh?
H-d-P
Saying that, I totally understand why people prefer their P1 or Lancer - both are real hands on driver's cars.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I wouldn't really say that. Both the Evo and the P1 are lovely cars in their own class & price range, but they're still very much point and squirt. It's difficult to go wrong in a road situation (although not impossible, of course).
I had a look at both, along with Supras, Celicas, 300ZXs, M3s, M5s and an Elise. I bought a Teg Type R in the end and the only car that came close as a "driver's car" was the Elise IMHO.
I guess it's about choice and needs though. The Teg's about fun, but it wouldn't be the best car for taking the family out or for doing hundreds of miles on a motorway every day.
Each to their own eh?
H-d-P
08 August 2001, 09:50 PM
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I have a P1 and its "COOL" but I was speaking to a guy down at powerstation (the electrics guy) and he was saying that in terms of performance and handling the evo VII is much better than the P1 he said he took it round a roundabout where the p1 limit was around 80mph he was still within the limit of the evo at 100, funny thing is though I would still rather have my scoob even if the evo as it sounds it is is a better car! At the end of the day though its really down to the driver!
08 August 2001, 10:02 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Web Guru:
<B>...he was saying that in terms of performance and handling the evo VII is much better than the P1 he said he took it round a roundabout where the p1 limit was around 80mph he was still within the limit of the evo at 100...driver![/quote]
I personally very much doubt that!
(Sadly) I'm neither a P1 or Evo owner (I own a 172), but I can't see that there would be such a huge difference between such similair cars!
I'd go so far to say that the Evo 7 PROBABLY can't take a corner 20mph faster than a 172/Williams/306 GTi
Andy.
<B>...he was saying that in terms of performance and handling the evo VII is much better than the P1 he said he took it round a roundabout where the p1 limit was around 80mph he was still within the limit of the evo at 100...driver![/quote]
I personally very much doubt that!
(Sadly) I'm neither a P1 or Evo owner (I own a 172), but I can't see that there would be such a huge difference between such similair cars!
I'd go so far to say that the Evo 7 PROBABLY can't take a corner 20mph faster than a 172/Williams/306 GTi
Andy.
08 August 2001, 10:09 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by andym172:
<B> I personally very much doubt that!
(Sadly) I'm neither a P1 or Evo owner (I own a 172), but I can't see that there would be such a huge difference between such similair cars!
I'd go so far to say that the Evo 7 PROBABLY can't take a corner 20mph faster than a 172/Williams/306 GTi
Andy.
[/quote]
Well that was the guys words I can't say personally as I haven't driven any EVO for that matter. I go up to Wolverhampton a fair bit and have stopped by Ralliart a few times but they never seem to have a demonstrator in, one day hopefully and then I will be able to give my own personal view!
<B> I personally very much doubt that!
(Sadly) I'm neither a P1 or Evo owner (I own a 172), but I can't see that there would be such a huge difference between such similair cars!
I'd go so far to say that the Evo 7 PROBABLY can't take a corner 20mph faster than a 172/Williams/306 GTi
Andy.
[/quote]
Well that was the guys words I can't say personally as I haven't driven any EVO for that matter. I go up to Wolverhampton a fair bit and have stopped by Ralliart a few times but they never seem to have a demonstrator in, one day hopefully and then I will be able to give my own personal view!
08 August 2001, 11:00 PM
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Andy from experience i would say that the guy at powerstation is not far wide of the mark as they are in KNOW WAY! similar when it comes to handling on a good surface and as for the 172 etc not even the same planet never mind sport although being very good in their own right.
J
when you know you know but until you know you will never know.
J
when you know you know but until you know you will never know.
08 August 2001, 11:19 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by jason b:
<B>Andy from experience i would say that the guy at powerstation is not far wide of the mark as they are in KNOW WAY! similar when it comes to handling on a good surface and as for the 172 etc not even the same planet never mind sport although being very good in their own right.
J
when you know you know but until you know you will never know.[/quote]
20mph more is a lot through a corner!
Coming out of the Liverpool side of the new Mersey tunnel is a long sweeping left hand bend that I can take at about 60mph in my Clio.
I've been passenger in an Evo 6 (which can't be vastly different to an Evo 7 can it?!) through the same bend with the same level of commitment from the driver, and he 'only' managed 65-70mph.
Obviously an example such as this has massive flaws, but it is just an indication.
I'm not in any way trying to say that the Clio is anywhere near as good as the Evo/P1 (or any Impreza Turbo for that matter), but am trying to indicate that perhaps 20mph between two very similair cars seems a lot.
Andy.
<B>Andy from experience i would say that the guy at powerstation is not far wide of the mark as they are in KNOW WAY! similar when it comes to handling on a good surface and as for the 172 etc not even the same planet never mind sport although being very good in their own right.
J
when you know you know but until you know you will never know.[/quote]
20mph more is a lot through a corner!
Coming out of the Liverpool side of the new Mersey tunnel is a long sweeping left hand bend that I can take at about 60mph in my Clio.
I've been passenger in an Evo 6 (which can't be vastly different to an Evo 7 can it?!) through the same bend with the same level of commitment from the driver, and he 'only' managed 65-70mph.
Obviously an example such as this has massive flaws, but it is just an indication.
I'm not in any way trying to say that the Clio is anywhere near as good as the Evo/P1 (or any Impreza Turbo for that matter), but am trying to indicate that perhaps 20mph between two very similair cars seems a lot.
Andy.
08 August 2001, 11:37 PM
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Andy you say that they are similar ( 6/7/p1 )
?????????????
The new impreza has a 50% stiffer chassis than the old model the same goes for the evo 6 & 7 so how can they be similar??????????
6 & 7 are based on 2 different cars for a start.
J
?????????????
The new impreza has a 50% stiffer chassis than the old model the same goes for the evo 6 & 7 so how can they be similar??????????
6 & 7 are based on 2 different cars for a start.
J
.
09 August 2001, 12:12 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by jason b:
<B>Andy you say that they are similar ( 6/7/p1 )
?????????????
The new impreza has a 50% stiffer chassis than the old model the same goes for the evo 6 & 7 so how can they be similar??????????
6 & 7 are based on 2 different cars for a start.
J[/quote]
I know they're based on 2 totally different cars, but they're similair in the same way that the 172 is to the 306.
IMO the Evo and the Impreza (P1 etc) are aimed at the same market.
Performance is similair in many ways and that's why magazines compare them. The chassis' may be much stiffer, but I honestly can't see them being so far apart!
Andy.
<B>Andy you say that they are similar ( 6/7/p1 )
?????????????
The new impreza has a 50% stiffer chassis than the old model the same goes for the evo 6 & 7 so how can they be similar??????????
6 & 7 are based on 2 different cars for a start.
J[/quote]
I know they're based on 2 totally different cars, but they're similair in the same way that the 172 is to the 306.
IMO the Evo and the Impreza (P1 etc) are aimed at the same market.
Performance is similair in many ways and that's why magazines compare them. The chassis' may be much stiffer, but I honestly can't see them being so far apart!
Andy.
09 August 2001, 12:37 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>
he said he took it round a roundabout where the p1 limit was around 80mph he was still within the limit of the evo at 100, <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is complete garbage IMO - the difference in cornering speed between a Ford Focus and a 911 turbo is not anywhere near 20mph, let alone between scooby and Evo VII. Pray tell what is the magical component that adds on about 0.3 lateral g to the Evo VII's cornering speed? Maybe he was running on slicks and the P1 was on snow tyres?
he said he took it round a roundabout where the p1 limit was around 80mph he was still within the limit of the evo at 100, <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is complete garbage IMO - the difference in cornering speed between a Ford Focus and a 911 turbo is not anywhere near 20mph, let alone between scooby and Evo VII. Pray tell what is the magical component that adds on about 0.3 lateral g to the Evo VII's cornering speed? Maybe he was running on slicks and the P1 was on snow tyres?
09 August 2001, 12:48 PM
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I'm with Matt on this one - see the g-force challenge in Autocar last week to see how small the differences are between something like a Focus and Impreza's and the like for constant radius bends (eg roundabouts)
Steve
Steve
09 August 2001, 08:23 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by matt d:
<B> Maybe he was running on slicks and the P1 was on snow tyres?
[/quote]
LOL and I would expect the P1 had snow chains on as well. Was this feat of driver excellence done on Gran Tourismo???
<B> Maybe he was running on slicks and the P1 was on snow tyres?
[/quote]
LOL and I would expect the P1 had snow chains on as well. Was this feat of driver excellence done on Gran Tourismo???
10 August 2001, 07:38 PM
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j which roundabout? posthouse(kingstown) or carrow house(London road). if its eather of these roundabouts 80mph to 100mph is possable, as they are not exactly round if you now what i mean, ie long straights in the middle. must give it a go in mine.
nice looking car by the way.
nice looking car by the way.
11 August 2001, 06:44 AM
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Its alright having a thread comparing the EVO VII to P1, but its like having a Mondeo vs Sierra thread.
You are comparing cars designed in different era's. The EVO VII should damn well have a better chassis than the P1, if it didnt there would be no hope for Mitsubishi.
The real comparision would be the new STI vs EVO VII. The new STI has a superior chassis to the P1, and might do better in the roundabout test !!. Like a couple of others on here I have owned a P1 and have now upgraded to the new shape with PPP. The UK STI should have the beating of the EVO VII.
Jonathan
You are comparing cars designed in different era's. The EVO VII should damn well have a better chassis than the P1, if it didnt there would be no hope for Mitsubishi.
The real comparision would be the new STI vs EVO VII. The new STI has a superior chassis to the P1, and might do better in the roundabout test !!. Like a couple of others on here I have owned a P1 and have now upgraded to the new shape with PPP. The UK STI should have the beating of the EVO VII.
Jonathan
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