Turntable recommendations
01 July 2012, 04:54 PM
#3
Bang on the top of your budget but a good deck/arm/stylus package for the cash 
You will need an amp if you don`t already have one, But i suppose you know that already
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rega-Plana...item1c2858a9bd
You will need an amp if you don`t already have one, But i suppose you know that already
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rega-Plana...item1c2858a9bd
Last edited by The Pink Ninja; 01 July 2012 at 04:55 PM.
01 July 2012, 05:21 PM
#4
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I'll add a Project debut into the mix as well but again may go about 20-30 over your budget. Works out of the box though so no faffing about.
Nowt wrong with the Rega or the SL1210 mind you
I currently have 3 Technics LOL
Nowt wrong with the Rega or the SL1210 mind you
I currently have 3 Technics LOL
01 July 2012, 07:10 PM
#7
Most of them were my dads, stuff from the 50's to the 80's so things like chuck, jimmy and bob,mostly what was popular with the odd bit of pop and some old school 80's funk and a bit of northern soul, all the stuff i grew up listening to since i were knee high.
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01 July 2012, 07:34 PM
#10
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01 July 2012, 07:37 PM
#11
The state my 45's and LP's ended up in at the end of the 70's you could stick them on a Dansette and weigh the arm down with a couple of pennies and it would get about the right sound LOL
Shaun
Shaun
01 July 2012, 07:46 PM
#12
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DJ turntables are usually direct drive, with the spindle and platter sat on the motor, which is great for instant start when changing tracks. However, this causes a lot of motor noise to be passed through to the stylus, so quality audiophile turntables have always used belt drive, isolating the motor from the platter and reducing vibration, hum and noise. The 1210 is indeed a great turntable for its primary market, but better sound can be had, and for less money.
01 July 2012, 08:11 PM
#13
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DJ turntables are usually direct drive, with the spindle and platter sat on the motor, which is great for instant start when changing tracks. However, this causes a lot of motor noise to be passed through to the stylus, so quality audiophile turntables have always used belt drive, isolating the motor from the platter and reducing vibration, hum and noise. The 1210 is indeed a great turntable for its primary market, but better sound can be had, and for less money.
Sorry but I disagree. Not that the 1210 doesn't have plenty of compromises but that better sound can be had for the money. Tell me which 'audiophile' tt you will get for £200? And I mean one that works.
Also don't underestimate how good the 1210 can sound and the engineering design that went into it. Remember 'Mr Technics' invested £22 million in the design of the 1210. An amount that no other company has ever done or will ever do again.
The only reason Technics could afford to sell the 1210 at the price they did is because they had mass productipn techniques and sold so many.
And belt driven tts have their own set of compromises especially that at the cheaper end of the market the pitch stability is rubbish.
An advantage of the 1210 is that if the op gets into vinyl then another few hundred quid chucked at the deck in choice mods will elevate the deck massively.
01 July 2012, 08:33 PM
#15
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It's a long time since I bought a tt, and these days choice is limited, especially at that price point. So limited that there is only really DJ units and Project left. A decent secondhand Linn, Michell or Pink Triangle might be a better starting point IMHO, although they will be pricey unless you get a low spec model. I just spotted a Manticore Manta for £300. I had a Linn Basik (Ittok & K5) many moons ago, and it wiped the floor with every other tt anywhere near it's price back then, and I did try a 1210 along with models from Revolver, Project, Marantz and Rega to recall just f few I demo'd.
01 July 2012, 08:34 PM
#16
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Remembering the huge flaw with a belt drive turntable is just that - the belt. Over time they stretch, more so if they were used with the purpose of mixing or scratching records but the main fact is direct drive turntables were developed because of the belt drives flaw. I can't comment on the difference in pure sound quality from belt drive to direct drive but in my experience direct drive has the longevity and durability aspects which to me far outweigh any possibility of sound compromise.
My first DJ'ing decks were belt drive and mixing fluently was like spinning plates on your fingers. General playback wasn't much better either due to the belt inevitably stretching. When I invested the princely sum of £1,000 in late 2002 for a pair of SL1210 MK3D Direct Drive Technics decks, both the sound quality and build quality were night and day better. General playback with headphones on was excellent and still superior and my mixes from a DJ perspective suddenly improved (although that's off topic for the OP's requirements).
Also the fact Technics (who were owned by Panasonic as one of their sub-brands IIRC) are no longer making the SL1210 in any guise, the value for well kept examples will only go up. For me it would be a stylish investment and with a good cartridge/stylus give excellent playback. All IMO of course.
My first DJ'ing decks were belt drive and mixing fluently was like spinning plates on your fingers. General playback wasn't much better either due to the belt inevitably stretching. When I invested the princely sum of £1,000 in late 2002 for a pair of SL1210 MK3D Direct Drive Technics decks, both the sound quality and build quality were night and day better. General playback with headphones on was excellent and still superior and my mixes from a DJ perspective suddenly improved (although that's off topic for the OP's requirements).
Also the fact Technics (who were owned by Panasonic as one of their sub-brands IIRC) are no longer making the SL1210 in any guise, the value for well kept examples will only go up. For me it would be a stylish investment and with a good cartridge/stylus give excellent playback.
All IMO of course.
Last edited by chocolate_o_brian; 01 July 2012 at 08:36 PM.
01 July 2012, 08:52 PM
#18
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Remembering the huge flaw with a belt drive turntable is just that - the belt. Over time they stretch, more so if they were used with the purpose of mixing or scratching records but the main fact is direct drive turntables were developed because of the belt drives flaw. I can't comment on the difference in pure sound quality from belt drive to direct drive but in my experience direct drive has the longevity and durability aspects which to me far outweigh any possibility of sound compromise.
My first DJ'ing decks were belt drive and mixing fluently was like spinning plates on your fingers. General playback wasn't much better either due to the belt inevitably stretching. When I invested the princely sum of £1,000 in late 2002 for a pair of SL1210 MK3D Direct Drive Technics decks, both the sound quality and build quality were night and day better. General playback with headphones on was excellent and still superior and my mixes from a DJ perspective suddenly improved (although that's off topic for the OP's requirements).
Also the fact Technics (who were owned by Panasonic as one of their sub-brands IIRC) are no longer making the SL1210 in any guise, the value for well kept examples will only go up. For me it would be a stylish investment and with a good cartridge/stylus give excellent playback. All IMO of course.
My first DJ'ing decks were belt drive and mixing fluently was like spinning plates on your fingers. General playback wasn't much better either due to the belt inevitably stretching. When I invested the princely sum of £1,000 in late 2002 for a pair of SL1210 MK3D Direct Drive Technics decks, both the sound quality and build quality were night and day better. General playback with headphones on was excellent and still superior and my mixes from a DJ perspective suddenly improved (although that's off topic for the OP's requirements).
Also the fact Technics (who were owned by Panasonic as one of their sub-brands IIRC) are no longer making the SL1210 in any guise, the value for well kept examples will only go up. For me it would be a stylish investment and with a good cartridge/stylus give excellent playback.
All IMO of course.+1
I'm still waiting for Corradoboy to tell me us which belt driven tt for £200 will sound much better than a 1210
01 July 2012, 08:52 PM
#19
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In the years that I sold turntables I never once had anyone complain that when listening to the Verve - Bitter Sweet Symphony they snapped or stretched their turntable belt whilst trying to get a re-e-e-wind.
For 200quid I'd get myself a second hand Rega RP-1 with upgraded cartridge which will sound better than a 1210.
For 200quid I'd get myself a second hand Rega RP-1 with upgraded cartridge which will sound better than a 1210.
01 July 2012, 09:06 PM
#20
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I'm not going to get into a p!$$ing contest, but audiophiles will undoubtedly side with my opinion, and dance fans and their DJ's will praise the 1210 until the heavens fall. The fact is that there are very few tt's to choose from, especially at the budget end, so as I said above, a decent audiophile entry level second hand unit from Rega, Manticore, Project, Thorens, Garrard, Michell etc would easily outperform a 1210 on sound quality IMHO. Even new, I'd hedge my bets on this Project. Quite how either of us would win this argument on the net is beyond me though, unless we assemble a panel of subjective and impartial listeners and blind test them back to back in the same system, room, and with the same music. DJ's tend to focus on electronic music which has no life, soul or feeling. It is created in a machine, and only exists when it is replayed through a speaker, any speaker, anywhere, through any set-up. The subtle acoustic nuances of real instruments, influenced by the artist playing them, the room they're in, the equipment used to record it, master and produce it, then the medium on which it is replayed, and the equipment used to do that all contribute to the complexity of audiophile music and hi-fi appreciation.
01 July 2012, 09:27 PM
#22
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I'm not going to get into a p!$$ing contest, but audiophiles will undoubtedly side with my opinion, and dance fans and their DJ's will praise the 1210 until the heavens fall. The fact is that there are very few tt's to choose from, especially at the budget end, so as I said above, a decent audiophile entry level second hand unit from Rega, Manticore, Project, Thorens, Garrard, Michell etc would easily outperform a 1210 on sound quality IMHO. Even new, I'd hedge my bets on this Project. Quite how either of us would win this argument on the net is beyond me though, unless we assemble a panel of subjective and impartial listeners and blind test them back to back in the same system, room, and with the same music. DJ's tend to focus on electronic music which has no life, soul or feeling. It is created in a machine, and only exists when it is replayed through a speaker, any speaker, anywhere, through any set-up. The subtle acoustic nuances of real instruments, influenced by the artist playing them, the room they're in, the equipment used to record it, master and produce it, then the medium on which it is replayed, and the equipment used to do that all contribute to the complexity of audiophile music and hi-fi appreciation.
If you're not an electronic music fan then you won't appreciate it. Trust me, some of the old productions I have with live sounds in them, whether samples or not have real meaning and soul. Just as I hazard your taste in music does. Artists record their tracks live or whatnot but you're naive if you think they don't get filtered and mastered through a machine before going to "press". If electronic music, which is put through the same routine, has no soul etc., then unless I'm misunderstanding you, neither does instrumental music.
I digress, we're going off topic and we both think we're right.
For £200 I personally believe for all roundness you cannot beat an SL1210 set up properly to the correct amp/speakers in simple terms. Audiophiles will possibly disagree but for the minute gains to the average ear on top end stuff, I couldn't and wouldn't justify the excessive outlay over something that is as proven as the Technics
I'll leave it at that
01 July 2012, 09:32 PM
#23
DJ turntables are usually direct drive, with the spindle and platter sat on the motor, which is great for instant start when changing tracks. However, this causes a lot of motor noise to be passed through to the stylus, so quality audiophile turntables have always used belt drive, isolating the motor from the platter and reducing vibration, hum and noise. The 1210 is indeed a great turntable for its primary market, but better sound can be had, and for less money.
Direct drive has been used by all high end audiophiles for years...
Check out EMT's that the BBC used for all there studio broadcasts........
01 July 2012, 09:42 PM
#24
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Taking an educated guess, the fact the BBC was direct drive due to the nature of work it would carry out rather than having pure audio performance in mind. I doubt that a belt drive turntable would be up to the job of doing what the bbc was designed for.
01 July 2012, 09:50 PM
#25
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ALL high end ? Never seen a DD Linn Sondek ! In fact, I've never seen a UK manufactured audiophile grade TT with DD EVER ! Maybe there was one at some time, but I've never seen it.
BELT DRIVE
BELT DRIVE
BELT DRIVE
BELT DRIVE
A little out of budget, but at $650,000, it seems belt drive was good enough here too...
01 July 2012, 10:37 PM
#26
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I'm not going to get into a p!$$ing contest, but audiophiles will undoubtedly side with my opinion, and dance fans and their DJ's will praise the 1210 until the heavens fall. The fact is that there are very few tt's to choose from, especially at the budget end, so as I said above, a decent audiophile entry level second hand unit from Rega, Manticore, Project, Thorens, Garrard, Michell etc would easily outperform a 1210 on sound quality IMHO. Even new, I'd hedge my bets on this Project. Quite how either of us would win this argument on the net is beyond me though, unless we assemble a panel of subjective and impartial listeners and blind test them back to back in the same system, room, and with the same music. DJ's tend to focus on electronic music which has no life, soul or feeling. It is created in a machine, and only exists when it is replayed through a speaker, any speaker, anywhere, through any set-up. The subtle acoustic nuances of real instruments, influenced by the artist playing them, the room they're in, the equipment used to record it, master and produce it, then the medium on which it is replayed, and the equipment used to do that all contribute to the complexity of audiophile music and hi-fi appreciation.
I don't want to get into a p7ssing contest either especially as I'm assuming we are all passionate about our music.
However the more you throw around the term 'audiophile' the less I think you actually know about music reproduction. When you say 'audiophiles will undoubtedly side with my opinion' it's as though you think 'audiophiles' are a religion or ethnic background.
Like yourself many people assume the 1210 is for DJs only and by way of that incapable of producing decent quality sound. This is not true, the 1210 was not designed as a DJ deck but some of it's inherent attributes made it a hit with the DJs and let's say the rest is history.
And by the way I run a modified 1210 through a very revealing system and it sounds better than a lot of the stuff you've mentioned as being 'audiophile'
01 July 2012, 11:12 PM
#28
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The BBC always used to use Technics SP10's mainly IIRC. Some more info here
http://www.soundhifi.com/SP-10.htm
http://www.soundhifi.com/SP-10.htm
01 July 2012, 11:14 PM
#29
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http://theartofsound.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=4
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=17265
Last edited by mike1210; 01 July 2012 at 11:18 PM.
