pslewis

Looking like there may be mass walk-outs during the winter months .....

Some Public Sector workers I have little sympathy for (the overpaid and underworked) - but, some are hard working and low paid ..... they deserve to be treated fairly IMO.

No good the Private Sector moaning about the Public Sector - they didn't complain while they had all the benefits (BUPA, Cars, Bonuses) which the Public Sector never enjoyed

The Public Sector, on the whole, only had a decent Pension to look forward to - surely, we cannot take that away from them ..... just because the Private Sector is feeling pain?

stilover

And they'll be the ones who won't have any changes made to their pensions.

But they'll be the ones out striking as they're to thick to realise they won't be effected.

Let them strike. This way the Government will change the law, and push through the pension reforms anyway.

I couldn't care less that a teacher will go from £37k a year pension to £32k a year pension. It'll still be £25-£30k more than my private pension will be.

pslewis

They will ALL be affected ...... even those earning £10,000 a year - they STILL have to retire later!!

Yes, Teachers can go swing - they are highly paid and will mop up a fantastic pension ... so can the Police and FireFighters - retiring young on a big payout!!

It's the binmen and school assistants who I feel sorry for ... the GrimeBusters and street cleaners, they have been **** on with bad wages, now they have to work longer too!!

tony de wonderful

I hope the public sector unions do this, it will be massive hubris on their part.

The middle classes won't stand for this strong-arming whilst they are feeling economic pain themselves. They will demand the Gov goes to war like in the 80's.

Trout

iTrader: (1)

I was checking out Go Outdoors.

They are definitely having a winter of discount tents.

fivetide

iTrader: (1)

Had to laugh at the news last night - believe they have the support of the public. How deluded.

Aside from the pension, don't forget, shorter hours generally, excellent sick leave and holiday pay, plus very difficult to get fired even if you are remarkably incompetent.

Private sector means salaries and no overtime, work till its done not down tools when you have a regulation tea break coming up and making sure that things are as efficient as possible not paying people to sit about for large portions of the day.

Edit - just to say, my mate, who does work hard bless him is a environmental warden. He works over, he gets the time back, generally he finishes work 90 mins before I do. Recently had an accident, not his fault at all and been off for a month on full pay. Our place does two weeks sick a year then it is stat only.

With unemployment rising to 2.5m today I'd say if they don't like their job then there are potentially a few million who'll be happy to do it for them.

5t.

JTaylor

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

It is too simplistic to just play one off against the other, we need public services and we need private industry, there is good and bad in both.

Basically I see it as the rich (financial sector) sold the rest of us the illusion of being rich as our house prices went up, people borrowed and had a taste of the good life and all the "clever" banking that facilitated this came down round their ears when the ******* they lent to couldnt pay it back, what happens when people are payed commision for signing people up without any realy checks to see if they can pay it back.

So we are left worse off than before with some expensive tastes and they seem to be doing ok, i.e. the banks, ok a few fell and they were slightly chastened for a week or two but now are back in full "Billy Bunter in charge of the tuck shop" mode paying huge bonuses and another round of self congratulation at how clever they are.

So I guess now we will have schools closed, bodies piling up, bin bags in the street, what fun, it isnt the uppity Trotksyite Public Sector, they just want to pay their bills and get what they signed up for. Maybe if all those who deal with cash, all those who can emply high end accountants and tax havens paid their way then we might be better off.

Leslie

Such a shame that we now have a national debt approaching £1 trillion
and we are forced to run a deficit of around £170 billion.

The legacy left to us by your hero's Pete when they started off with a very strong economy is totally unforgiveable.

They have no option but to reduce Government spending in an attempt to regain control.

How would you do it?

Les

Chip

I totally agree with you there Pete.

ScoobyDoo555

As someone who works in Education, some of you lot really need to get a grip on reality.

Just like in EVERY sector, there are bad examples that result in everybody being tarred with the same brush.

I, for one, will not be striking. I'm young enough that by the time retirement becomes an option, Governments will have changed several times, as will policies........ so it's pointless screaming and shouting about something that is fluid.

At present, the only damage (striking) will be to the ones needing the services provided.


But on the flip-side, I feel for those who will be affected. Put yourselves in the same position (putting aside the argument that IF you could do the job affected, you would..... and enjoy the spoils and perks of that position. That's YOUR decision to work the job you work).....

You've worked for a long time, with the assurance that XYZ would be available for your retirement..... then it gets changed.

Would YOU kick off? Fookin right you would.

Don't be hypocrites.

The only thing that is questionable here, is the method of protest. NOT the nature of the protest.




And don't forget - this thread is PS Lewis production: designed to insight heated debate...... like all of his posts.

tony de wonderful

It was us the Public who got all happy about our house prices and borrowed like there was no tomorrow. The banks cannot put a gun to our heads and force us to borrow.

FWIW our financial system is dysfunctional but it is to easy to use ressentiment and blame Bankers. Yes some of these people are tw@ts but blame the game not the player.

Furthermore it was the Labour Government borrowing like crazy which is to blame specifically for the national debt and deficit problems now, which is the reason the public sector are being pressured to take cuts to their total compensation packages.

That was the Government borrowing not the Bankers, just in case you missed that.

Now the public sector does not generate wealth it is an overhead. It's a zero sum game between the public and private sector workers. Not all private sector workers are Bankers, some just sweep floors at Tesco.

If private sector workers are suffering then so should the public sector as far as I am concerned, because if a public sector worker wants to earn £1 more then that is £1 being taken from a Tesco cleaner.

I don't have any sympathy for the position (of the unions) which is nothing short of a kind of extortion. The public sector should bend to the will of the taxpayer not the other way around.

pslewis

Pathetic .....

So, if the Public Sector should feel the pain of the Private Sector - then, it should have seen all the benefits of the past in the Private Sector?!

Like BUPA, Company Cars, Bonus Payments, etc. etc. etc.?

You sound like a Banker!! You want to have Private profits but Public losses!! And that opinion stinks ..... the Banks keep all their profits and reward risk taking, while when it goes **** up THEN it's US the Public who have to bail them out!!!

Sorry ... the Private Sector drove us into this mess - greed, greed, greed and more greed!!

Bankers should swing from the gibbett ...

andythejock01wrx

True, but the banks should have had a far more sensible lending policy.

Yup, that's pretty much how I feel.

tony de wonderful

It was the Labour government fiscal policy actually.

Now the Piper needs paying.

tony de wonderful

The Bankers motif is a red herring.

This is about the taxpayer (rightly) wanting to pay less (because they are hurting), and the public sector unions wanting to milk the taxpayers through the threat of collective action.

hodgy0_2

who canvassed your opinion anyway

GlesgaKiss

Everyone wants to work less and get more in return. Absolutely pathetic, and I have no sympathy for anyone caught out when things tighten. The principle has always been the same with regards to wanting governments to ease, but little did anyone know that, once you've started easing, it's the thin end of the wedge. Now, decades down the line, we've reached an extreme, and people as a whole are unfortunately going to have to suffer the decrease in living standards that they have been putting off all this time.

The layabout parts of the public sector (that would include councils, transport and the like) can get to f*ck. I'd guess at least 75% of the people in them are struggling due to their own stupidity, lack of self-discipline, and imprudence. Actually that applies to the population as a whole, and it always has. There's no point dressing it up by being sympathetic anymore, when it is, IMO, the truth of the matter.

It's time for these parasitic chumps to wake up and get real.

zip106

Those private sector 'benefits' you speak of Lewis - they don't come for free you know.

GlesgaKiss

First thing to do, starting tomorrow: cut all parts of the public sector where the job roughly entails sitting around a coffee table and thinking about how to create 'equality' and such.

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

The NHS pensions thing is a "done deal" increased contributions in 2008 and increases again planned. As is the increased pension age, AFAIK this has been agreed to keep the NHS pensions afloat......Not heard of any strike talk.

The only thing on the table at the moment is when it changes to a "career average".

I'll await what the million or so NHS workers end up doing...

Shaun

pslewis

Strange that ..... I thought the big FAT bonuses DID come free - to the Employee, that is!

The Public Sector have had poor wages and a good Pension - the Pension was the single, only, benefit over the Private Sector ..... and the Private Sector should really pay it in accordance with the agreed terms and conditions.

zip106

Yes a bonus.

Comes with working hard and making your employer money.

Not from wasting it.

pslewis

Well, in that case, we should roll out Bonus payments to the Public Sector then - yes?

You're saying they need to feel the pain, they should feel the benefits too!!!

zip106

Certainly, reward those in the public sector who have performed well. (shouldn't cost much )

But to say that just because those in the private sector get these so called 'free' benefits, then the public should also get them? - No.

If they want them, then go and work for a private company.
Their choice.

And I suspect those that are whinging about these cuts are the ones who decided on an easy life at the start of their careers by thinking the public sector will never have these sort of adjustments made.

And a job for life.

pslewis

I agree .... so, let's stop all this bollox talk of the Public Sector having to feel pain - just because the Private Sector are currently hurting a little ......

They are both different and have ups and downs which are not in harmony with each other ....

dpb

Caring sharing Labour got us into this mess , public sector never had it so good

Now weve rejoined the real world and theyre balling the eyes out

< old news >

pslewis

Indeed ... the UK has never had it so good as from 1997 to 2007 .... the Blair years, never to be repeated.

Where we ALL got rich ..... or should have, as the chances were all there!!

Chip

Pete, we can all get rich by borrowing money, but what the idiots in NL did'nt realise is that you have to pay it back as well.

Chip

Chip

When they become effiecient and stop wasting money then yes.