Trams - what?!
01 February 2011, 11:44 PM
#1
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Trams - what?!
I just don't get trams. I am in Zurich and the place is full of trams and those buses that are tied to telegraph poles by pylons stuck to their roof.
I mean how pointless.
Let's build a road to enable a free flow of traffic.
Oh, we didn't leave enough room for the railway.
That's OK we can just put it on top of the road.
But if a car gets in the way the train won't be able to swerve.
Oh. That's OK the train is really heavy and will just crush the car.
Ver Gut!
Actually, while we are at it, why don't we put lots of wires above the road an we can have buses tied to them as well.
I mean how pointless.
Let's build a road to enable a free flow of traffic.
Oh, we didn't leave enough room for the railway.
That's OK we can just put it on top of the road.
But if a car gets in the way the train won't be able to swerve.
Oh. That's OK the train is really heavy and will just crush the car.
Ver Gut!
Actually, while we are at it, why don't we put lots of wires above the road an we can have buses tied to them as well.
01 February 2011, 11:47 PM
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I just don't get trams. I am in Zurich and the place is full of trams and those buses that are tied to telegraph poles by pylons stuck to their roof.
I mean how pointless.
Let's build a road to enable a free flow of traffic.
Oh, we didn't leave enough room for the railway.
That's OK we can just put it on top of the road.
But if a car gets in the way the train won't be able to swerve.
Oh. That's OK the train is really heavy and will just crush the car.
Ver Gut!
Actually, while we are at it, why don't we put lots of wires above the road an we can have buses tied to them as well.
I mean how pointless.
Let's build a road to enable a free flow of traffic.
Oh, we didn't leave enough room for the railway.
That's OK we can just put it on top of the road.
But if a car gets in the way the train won't be able to swerve.
Oh. That's OK the train is really heavy and will just crush the car.
Ver Gut!
Actually, while we are at it, why don't we put lots of wires above the road an we can have buses tied to them as well.
I get trams. And trains.
They go a long way to paying for life's luxuries and fripperies.
02 February 2011, 12:21 AM
#4
Uh-huh. Works ok in San-Francisco. But they still have cable cars too, so its more of a traditional infrastructure that remained and was kept operational.
Trams I believe were a Victorian invention. And were replaced by what we now come to know as a "Bus".
Somewhere somehow, some feejit in a council/government/planning office didn't go to school on that day they taught the evolution of public transport, and then reinvented the idea of "trams".
Of course the billions spent on the Wolverhamton Metro link couldn't sway my cynicism one single bit, oh no. Why not just make it a sodding bus lane and run buses on there? Ahhh, but that would have involved far to much common sense.
Trams I believe were a Victorian invention. And were replaced by what we now come to know as a "Bus".
Somewhere somehow, some feejit in a council/government/planning office didn't go to school on that day they taught the evolution of public transport, and then reinvented the idea of "trams".
Of course the billions spent on the Wolverhamton Metro link couldn't sway my cynicism one single bit, oh no. Why not just make it a sodding bus lane and run buses on there? Ahhh, but that would have involved far to much common sense.
02 February 2011, 08:18 AM
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There must be some reason to spend all the money to build a tram network that somehow makes it better than running buses. We are not the only country to do this, so there has to be some reason....surely?!!??
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02 February 2011, 10:26 AM
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The Edinburgh one is a silly idea though. Bus travel in Edinburgh is spot on so it doesn't solve any issues.
The trams in Krackow are great though. dead cheap and go all over the city.
5t.
The trams in Krackow are great though. dead cheap and go all over the city.
5t.
02 February 2011, 10:30 AM
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I still don't get the point of trams though. What is the actual advantage of making them run on rails with routes that cannot be easily altered compared to running a bus.
I would have thought that the total cost of running buses would be cheaper overall. I just don't see any advantage in trams, although there must be one somewhere otherwise they would not be used.
I would have thought that the total cost of running buses would be cheaper overall. I just don't see any advantage in trams, although there must be one somewhere otherwise they would not be used.
02 February 2011, 10:55 AM
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I still don't get the point of trams though. What is the actual advantage of making them run on rails with routes that cannot be easily altered compared to running a bus.
I would have thought that the total cost of running buses would be cheaper overall. I just don't see any advantage in trams, although there must be one somewhere otherwise they would not be used.
I would have thought that the total cost of running buses would be cheaper overall. I just don't see any advantage in trams, although there must be one somewhere otherwise they would not be used.
02 February 2011, 01:41 PM
#18
I have to say I had reservations.
But: I parked at Forest Gate, FREE, loads of space even on a saturday. I then boarded a city bound tram and paid £6 for two all-day tickets. That did my return. It dropped us off in the city centre, we had our lunch, looked in a few shops, went to the market and went back to the tram.
Now BEFORE, I'd have parked in the Victoria Centre. It's three miles further on, so more fuel, in traffic. You have to queue to get in and out again, more traffic, more fuel useage. You also have to queue to pay at a paystation, and your visit is timed, the longer you stay, the more you pay. My afternoon would have cost me £6+ Plus you need the right money to pay. Plus you have to find a parking spot which can be a joke on a saturday.
Trams for me every time.
But: I parked at Forest Gate, FREE, loads of space even on a saturday. I then boarded a city bound tram and paid £6 for two all-day tickets. That did my return. It dropped us off in the city centre, we had our lunch, looked in a few shops, went to the market and went back to the tram.
Now BEFORE, I'd have parked in the Victoria Centre. It's three miles further on, so more fuel, in traffic. You have to queue to get in and out again, more traffic, more fuel useage. You also have to queue to pay at a paystation, and your visit is timed, the longer you stay, the more you pay. My afternoon would have cost me £6+ Plus you need the right money to pay. Plus you have to find a parking spot which can be a joke on a saturday.
Trams for me every time.
02 February 2011, 02:46 PM
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Thing is Alcazar, the Nottingham Trams only serve the north side of the city - absolutely useless for those of us living the other side.
It also turns a measly profit compared to what the council promised us it would do.
But as I said earlier, hope countries around the world continue to use them
By the way - was your car still intact when you left it on the Forest?
You were lucky if it was!
It also turns a measly profit compared to what the council promised us it would do.
But as I said earlier, hope countries around the world continue to use them
By the way - was your car still intact when you left it on the Forest?
You were lucky if it was!
Last edited by zip106; 02 February 2011 at 02:49 PM.
02 February 2011, 02:47 PM
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I've noticed that Nottingham has become very anti-car. About 5-10 years ago I spent a lot of time there and had no issue moving around the city centre. Then, once all the bus routes and tram routes and other traffic pedestrianising measures have put in place its a total nightmare to drive around.
They have forced you onto the public transport network, and I am not sure that is a good idea.
Although you are right about trams being larger, so that argument is valid. Not that sure on the rest though, there are low emission buses and buses and trams are just as likely to queue if their routes are not setup correctly.
They have forced you onto the public transport network, and I am not sure that is a good idea.
Although you are right about trams being larger, so that argument is valid. Not that sure on the rest though, there are low emission buses and buses and trams are just as likely to queue if their routes are not setup correctly.
02 February 2011, 03:29 PM
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Importnat to not get hung up on terminology. Low Emissions still = emissions. Electric still has no emissions at the point of use so they don't blast everyone with a cloud of soot when they set off etc.
Hydrogen and things can make a difference but at the moment it is fairly experimental so not really a solution and as pointed out above, a good tram system will be fairly efficient and reduce traffic generally.
That's the problem with Edinburgh's, it doesn't need it. Sheffield's, despite criticism isn't too bad though, especially for getting to events and footy matches etc as you can park for nowt at Meadowhall, saves a lot of issues (although it isn't perfect as it still goes to lots of places that generally, people don't want to go to!)
5t.
Hydrogen and things can make a difference but at the moment it is fairly experimental so not really a solution and as pointed out above, a good tram system will be fairly efficient and reduce traffic generally.
That's the problem with Edinburgh's, it doesn't need it. Sheffield's, despite criticism isn't too bad though, especially for getting to events and footy matches etc as you can park for nowt at Meadowhall, saves a lot of issues (although it isn't perfect as it still goes to lots of places that generally, people don't want to go to!)
5t.
02 February 2011, 05:22 PM
#22
Nottingham has BECOME anti-car? Muahahahahahahahahaha!
This is the city and police force that has the highest number of speed cameras in the UK, trialled and now uses SPECS extensively, has one of the highest number of red-light cameras, trialled the new forward-facing cameras and wanted to trial the so-called tailgating cameras.
Yet they still have HUGE numbers of gun-crime, street-crime, murders, robberies, rapes, etc etc.
Still, they "solve" a lot of motoring crime"
And yes, my car was OK: not many people want to muck about with an 11 year old well-battered Xantia with 142,000 miles on it
This is the city and police force that has the highest number of speed cameras in the UK, trialled and now uses SPECS extensively, has one of the highest number of red-light cameras, trialled the new forward-facing cameras and wanted to trial the so-called tailgating cameras.
Yet they still have HUGE numbers of gun-crime, street-crime, murders, robberies, rapes, etc etc.
Still, they "solve" a lot of motoring crime"
And yes, my car was OK: not many people want to muck about with an 11 year old well-battered Xantia with 142,000 miles on it
02 February 2011, 06:30 PM
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Nottingham has BECOME anti-car? Muahahahahahahahahaha!
This is the city and police force that has the highest number of speed cameras in the UK, trialled and now uses SPECS extensively, has one of the highest number of red-light cameras, trialled the new forward-facing cameras and wanted to trial the so-called tailgating cameras.
Yet they still have HUGE numbers of gun-crime, street-crime, murders, robberies, rapes, etc etc.
Still, they "solve" a lot of motoring crime"
And yes, my car was OK: not many people want to muck about with an 11 year old well-battered Xantia with 142,000 miles on it
This is the city and police force that has the highest number of speed cameras in the UK, trialled and now uses SPECS extensively, has one of the highest number of red-light cameras, trialled the new forward-facing cameras and wanted to trial the so-called tailgating cameras.
Yet they still have HUGE numbers of gun-crime, street-crime, murders, robberies, rapes, etc etc.
Still, they "solve" a lot of motoring crime"
And yes, my car was OK: not many people want to muck about with an 11 year old well-battered Xantia with 142,000 miles on it
02 February 2011, 06:44 PM
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02 February 2011, 07:35 PM
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- The Scottish Parliament. Not opposed to it in principal, but what a ridiculous waste of cash! Oh, and it looks rank!
- The trams. Not yet complete (not even close). Most folk think the bus service is fine and the trams will cover only a tiny area in comparison with the bus network. Haven't met anybody local that favours it, although I met a taxi driver that said he had a passenger that was in support - he was a member of Edinburgh Council!
Bloody waste of money that will only impress the tourists! 
Andy
02 February 2011, 08:57 PM
#28
I have been to Zurich quite a few times to work with my counterparts over there and find that everyone talks like a speak'n'spell machine! I think the trams work great out there and the traffic system works well in that city. It's cheap, punctual, clean and puts our own public transport to shame. Their double decker trains are great too.
02 February 2011, 09:03 PM
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I have been to Zurich quite a few times to work with my counterparts over there and find that everyone talks like a speak'n'spell machine! I think the trams work great out there and the traffic system works well in that city. It's cheap, punctual, clean and puts our own public transport to shame. Their double decker trains are great too.
Thats because we live in a **** hole.
My pet hate are smokers that leave there stinking **** every where.
And chewing gum.
If you travel on a double decker along princess street and have a look at the pavement. It gives me the boke
