Why is this Country obsessed with snooping!!
19 October 2010, 03:50 PM
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Why is this Country obsessed with snooping!!
Driving from work today, off Team Valley. Got to the roundabout and noticed a camera, virtually looking into the windows of the car. I was tempted to give it the 
as a few others did. It didn't look like a speed camera, so no idea why it was there.
Further up on the A1, on the overhead bridge more cameras. One for each lane.
Cameras on the motorway services.
Virtually home and the preverbial "van" watching out.
Then gets home to find, *** neighbour has cameras all over his Travel Lodge of a barn conversion. One even looks as though it is taking in the back of my property. I might take advice on this one.
It seems everywhere you turn, you are being watched
as a few others did. It didn't look like a speed camera, so no idea why it was there.Further up on the A1, on the overhead bridge more cameras. One for each lane.
Cameras on the motorway services.
Virtually home and the preverbial "van" watching out.
Then gets home to find, *** neighbour has cameras all over his Travel Lodge of a barn conversion. One even looks as though it is taking in the back of my property. I might take advice on this one.
It seems everywhere you turn, you are being watched
19 October 2010, 03:54 PM
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19 October 2010, 04:55 PM
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19 October 2010, 08:44 PM
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I do also wonder why we need so many cameras everywhere but then i reasure myself that as long as i'm doing nowt wrong, then no need to worry really, is there??
19 October 2010, 09:28 PM
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Driving from work today, off Team Valley. Got to the roundabout and noticed a camera, virtually looking into the windows of the car. I was tempted to give it the as a few others did. It didn't look like a speed camera, so no idea why it was there.
Further up on the A1, on the overhead bridge more cameras. One for each lane.
Cameras on the motorway services.
Virtually home and the preverbial "van" watching out.
Then gets home to find, *** neighbour has cameras all over his Travel Lodge of a barn conversion. One even looks as though it is taking in the back of my property. I might take advice on this one.
It seems everywhere you turn, you are being watched
as a few others did. It didn't look like a speed camera, so no idea why it was there.Further up on the A1, on the overhead bridge more cameras. One for each lane.
Cameras on the motorway services.
Virtually home and the preverbial "van" watching out.
Then gets home to find, *** neighbour has cameras all over his Travel Lodge of a barn conversion. One even looks as though it is taking in the back of my property. I might take advice on this one.
It seems everywhere you turn, you are being watched
I'm looking at you through your curtains now...........
Just move your leg to the side a bit..........
Bingo, there's my money shot.
Same time tomorrow?
20 October 2010, 12:25 AM
#13
Problem is, as you say, the cost of impounding, crushing and taking the driver to court costs far more money than what the average law abiding motorist's taxes can cover.
Plus it doesn't solve the issue of pikeys of no fixed abode. Although the local plod were rounding up the the transit pickups going to the local scrap metal dealers. Which is about time as they are being a right pain in the **** at the momet...driving 5mph everywhere with a tannoy/loud hailer playing a tape on a infinite loop shouting "Aye Urn, eny ol aye urrrn or aluminioorm or wat ya wunt tay coorn" whilst at the same time, some scoat in the passenger seat eyes up vulnerable property that may provide rich/easy pickings
There is no way they can make a legit earning as the cost of running the van alone would outweigh the amount of metal they collect. If I knew where they were locked up at night, I'd torch every single last one of them - that way it would be alot cheaper to the tax payer in the long run.
Last edited by ALi-B; 20 October 2010 at 12:27 AM.
20 October 2010, 07:13 AM
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Meanwhile the (relatively) honest, law abiding citizen will be snooped on, monitored, recorded, measured, catalogued, have their vehicular movements archived and potentially prosecuted for up to two years after some alleged incident (thanks Staffs
).mb
20 October 2010, 09:00 AM
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20 October 2010, 09:02 AM
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20 October 2010, 09:52 AM
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I'm all for ANPR cameras, with the lack of active policing these days, there are far too many ******* driving road untaxed/uninsured/no MOT.
Problem is, as you say, the cost of impounding, crushing and taking the driver to court costs far more money than what the average law abiding motorist's taxes can cover.
Plus it doesn't solve the issue of pikeys of no fixed abode. Although the local plod were rounding up the the transit pickups going to the local scrap metal dealers. Which is about time as they are being a right pain in the **** at the momet...driving 5mph everywhere with a tannoy/loud hailer playing a tape on a infinite loop shouting "Aye Urn, eny ol aye urrrn or aluminioorm or wat ya wunt tay coorn" whilst at the same time, some scoat in the passenger seat eyes up vulnerable property that may provide rich/easy pickings
There is no way they can make a legit earning as the cost of running the van alone would outweigh the amount of metal they collect. If I knew where they were locked up at night, I'd torch every single last one of them - that way it would be alot cheaper to the tax payer in the long run.
Problem is, as you say, the cost of impounding, crushing and taking the driver to court costs far more money than what the average law abiding motorist's taxes can cover.
Plus it doesn't solve the issue of pikeys of no fixed abode. Although the local plod were rounding up the the transit pickups going to the local scrap metal dealers. Which is about time as they are being a right pain in the **** at the momet...driving 5mph everywhere with a tannoy/loud hailer playing a tape on a infinite loop shouting "Aye Urn, eny ol aye urrrn or aluminioorm or wat ya wunt tay coorn" whilst at the same time, some scoat in the passenger seat eyes up vulnerable property that may provide rich/easy pickings
There is no way they can make a legit earning as the cost of running the van alone would outweigh the amount of metal they collect. If I knew where they were locked up at night, I'd torch every single last one of them - that way it would be alot cheaper to the tax payer in the long run.
20 October 2010, 10:11 AM
#19
If your day to day activities are all above board and so long as the police use it to detect and track possible or suspected illegal activity, it doesn't bother me one iota.
What does bother me is if this data is passed or sold on to other government agencies, quangos or private companies to use for other means, like direct marketing, or to assess the feasibility of pay per mile road taxation etc.
For example; I've got mailshots from companies where I know the only way they have got my address details and know the type of accomodation I live is is via the local council selling my details. I dion't mind the council having such data, like knowing how much rates I pay etc, but selling that information on is a different ball game.
What does bother me is if this data is passed or sold on to other government agencies, quangos or private companies to use for other means, like direct marketing, or to assess the feasibility of pay per mile road taxation etc.
For example; I've got mailshots from companies where I know the only way they have got my address details and know the type of accomodation I live is is via the local council selling my details. I dion't mind the council having such data, like knowing how much rates I pay etc, but selling that information on is a different ball game.
20 October 2010, 10:09 PM
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21 October 2010, 08:58 AM
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I can well believe it. Deep Pan pepperoni, Madam. And what size knickers do you wear
21 October 2010, 09:16 AM
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If your day to day activities are all above board and so long as the police use it to detect and track possible or suspected illegal activity, it doesn't bother me one iota.
What does bother me is if this data is passed or sold on to other government agencies, quangos or private companies to use for other means, like direct marketing, or to assess the feasibility of pay per mile road taxation etc.
For example; I've got mailshots from companies where I know the only way they have got my address details and know the type of accomodation I live is is via the local council selling my details. I dion't mind the council having such data, like knowing how much rates I pay etc, but selling that information on is a different ball game.
What does bother me is if this data is passed or sold on to other government agencies, quangos or private companies to use for other means, like direct marketing, or to assess the feasibility of pay per mile road taxation etc.
For example; I've got mailshots from companies where I know the only way they have got my address details and know the type of accomodation I live is is via the local council selling my details. I dion't mind the council having such data, like knowing how much rates I pay etc, but selling that information on is a different ball game.
This from wiki, an example of ANPR abuse:
John Catt, an 80 year old pensioner at the time and his daughter Linda (with no criminal record between them) - were stopped in 2005, had their vehicle searched under section 44 of the Terrorism Act 2000 by City of London Police and were threatened with arrest if they refused to answer police questions. After making formal police complaints, it was discovered they were stopped after their vehicle had been picked up by roadside ANPR CCTV cameras, after a marker had been placed against their vehicle in the Police National Computer database as a result of them being spotted near EDO MBM demonstrations in Brighton. Critics of police state policies highlight the fact that John and Linda Catt had been suspected of no crime, however using mass surveillance infrastructure they were targeted due to their associations.[9]
Last edited by tony de wonderful; 21 October 2010 at 09:28 AM.
21 October 2010, 11:27 AM
#23
The idea is you restrain police powers not just based on how police may act when they are good men, but worse case scenarios when the police are corrupt or politically biased. If all police were good we could give them unlimited powers and it would be ok right? Unfortunately sometimes bad men get in power.
It is just a shame that people just seem too thick to understand this.
You would think that even the the most basic understanding of the goings on in Germany before and after WW2 would cause concern among those with a modicum of intelligence.
Maybe the teaching of Modern European History is not what it should be in schools these days.
21 October 2010, 12:00 PM
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Driving from work today, off Team Valley. Got to the roundabout and noticed a camera, virtually looking into the windows of the car. I was tempted to give it the as a few others did. It didn't look like a speed camera, so no idea why it was there.
Further up on the A1, on the overhead bridge more cameras. One for each lane.
Cameras on the motorway services.
Virtually home and the preverbial "van" watching out.
Then gets home to find, *** neighbour has cameras all over his Travel Lodge of a barn conversion. One even looks as though it is taking in the back of my property. I might take advice on this one.
It seems everywhere you turn, you are being watched
as a few others did. It didn't look like a speed camera, so no idea why it was there.Further up on the A1, on the overhead bridge more cameras. One for each lane.
Cameras on the motorway services.
Virtually home and the preverbial "van" watching out.
Then gets home to find, *** neighbour has cameras all over his Travel Lodge of a barn conversion. One even looks as though it is taking in the back of my property. I might take advice on this one.
It seems everywhere you turn, you are being watched
It is part of a successful repressive government to have as much personal information on its people as possible. They want to know where you go and what you are doing at all times. They see that kind of knowledge as part of absolute power over the people. They, like the old Soviet government would eventually have laid great store on snooping by neighbours etc. to get even more information. Local councils have already tried this.
You are right to feel uneasy about it Lee.
Les
21 October 2010, 12:21 PM
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All to do with the policies of the last lot of wassocks who were running the country.
It is part of a successful repressive government to have as much personal information on its people as possible. They want to know where you go and what you are doing at all times. They see that kind of knowledge as part of absolute power over the people. They, like the old Soviet government would eventually have laid great store on snooping by neighbours etc. to get even more information. Local councils have already tried this.
You are right to feel uneasy about it Lee.
Les
It is part of a successful repressive government to have as much personal information on its people as possible. They want to know where you go and what you are doing at all times. They see that kind of knowledge as part of absolute power over the people. They, like the old Soviet government would eventually have laid great store on snooping by neighbours etc. to get even more information. Local councils have already tried this.
You are right to feel uneasy about it Lee.
Les
Then when bad people get power they have an instrument that is ready-made to oppress.
21 October 2010, 12:38 PM
#26
It's no necessarily above board though, they don't need to suspect you of anything, they don't need permission from a judge to surveil you.
This from wiki, an example of ANPR abuse:
The idea is you restrain police powers not just based on how police may act when they are good men, but worse case scenarios when the police are corrupt or politically biased. If all police were good we could give them unlimited powers and it would be ok right? Unfortunately sometimes bad men get in power.
This from wiki, an example of ANPR abuse:
The idea is you restrain police powers not just based on how police may act when they are good men, but worse case scenarios when the police are corrupt or politically biased. If all police were good we could give them unlimited powers and it would be ok right? Unfortunately sometimes bad men get in power.
OK, joking aside, I found the same article elsewhere, but knowing how the media copy and pastes everything to get a story, its hard to say where it originated and the accuracy of the circumstances. But lets just assume it happened, we however can't analyse that story any further, other than the ANPR put a marker on their car, and consquentally it was stopped a period after by the Police.
Now there are a few points that should happen:
a) A police officer with common sense would quickly realise this is an error.
b) Police officers should use their own discretion and common sense when using data from the system - i.e to assess other indicators that would pose the vehicle to be dodgy. And not to fully rely on what the computer says. For example, insurance: in the knowledge of how incompeteant the insurance industry can be. In my case they entered my reg number wrong and I didn't know until they finally sent the policy documents and certificate (three weeks). The sysetm is only as good as those who enter data upon it. And officers should know due to that it is not accurate or to be relied upon without corroboratory evidence.
c) Any incorrect information, when found should be corrected immediately upon realisation.
In light of this, there are two outcomes: An officer with common sense would quickly realise the information on the ANPR is wrong, and then conduct/end his enquiry in the according manner with minimal harm or fuss.
Obviously, a failure of the system is a brainwashed imbecile police officer treating it as 100% accurate evidence and then treating unsuspecting innocent members of the public like terrorists, handcuffing a 80yr old with his face on the pavement whilst barking the terrorist act at the detainee like the officer was Judge Dredd.
You see. Its not the ANPR at fault, nor the database in which it is stored. Its the persons using it who interprets and maintains the information. And that is down to training and monitoring of standard.
Last edited by ALi-B; 21 October 2010 at 12:42 PM.
21 October 2010, 12:43 PM
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It may work with say judicial oversight. If the Cops want to track/surveille you they need a warrant for example.
21 October 2010, 12:56 PM
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ANPR is hardly used though is it ... funds don't allow it & I guess there will be less of it during reign of current Govt re dwindling funds. See, it's not all bad news
TX.
TX.
21 October 2010, 01:25 PM
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The force's webpages on ANPR refer to it as a "fast growing technology" which the force uses to its "full potential... at local, regional and national levels together with other agencies".
21 October 2010, 03:09 PM
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True but I don't believe the objective of the Police and Gov is to be oppressive in this country, just this is what happens to any organisation when unrestrained. It grows and seeks to empower itself...empire building...whatever, people make careers out of justifying the growth, of getting more money in etc. It's what any bureaucracy does; seeks to grow.
Then when bad people get power they have an instrument that is ready-made to oppress.
Then when bad people get power they have an instrument that is ready-made to oppress.
I believe that they were putting into place all the items that they needed to run an oppressive government against the day when they had sufficient power to do just that. I just hope that our present leaders don't fall into that way of thinking. Politicians love the thought of absolute power!
Les