Ray_li

the company that I work for currently have 116 employees and they have decided to make 19 people redundant to reduce costs and the MD trying to save his own ***

Everybody from management to shop floor were given their 30 day notice period on the 10th Nov and was then told to sit and wait until the 30 days was up before the company can announce the 19 people.

its now been 17 days and no announcement has been made but management are not letting anything go. We can't even take time off for interviews

Its been said that they are planning to let us know on day 30 then tell the 19 people to leave straight away.

everybody feels **** at the moment. can they treat us like this and tell the 19 people to leave straight away on day 30?

Petem95

That cant be legal! Can only assume a lot more than 19 will be getting the boot after 30 days?

john_s

iTrader: (1)

Could be right... I've not read up on redundancy recently, but IIRC, a company should to give notice to all employees that may be affected that they could be facing a redundancy situation before they are able to announce the actual redundancies.

Yes, they can just tell the selected employees to leave straight away, but they would have to pay them for their notice period in addition to their redundancy payment.

c-o-l-e

I heard a few years ago of a similar thing happening in a food factory.
The staff were all informed that compulsory redunancies would take place in 30 days.
On the 30th day the company paid for a crew of doormen and security staff to assist with any trouble, then gave a lot of people their marching orders.
I don't know what kind of pay the people received but I think it's fair to say they got the bad end of the deal.

GC8

Im sure that they have to give you reasonable time off for interviews too. Im also relatively confident that they still have to give affected employees notice (as opposed to handing everyone their notice!) that they may face redundancy. The MD is far from on the ball...

little-ginge

just did a quick google and came up with the link at the bottom of this post.. the two points below may be of use..

• An employer who proposes 20 or more redundancies within a period of 90 days or less should consult with the recognised union or (if there is none) with representatives elected by the workforce. Consultation should begin at least 30 days before the first redundancy takes effect. Where the proposal is for 100 or more redundancies, consultation should begin at least 90 days before the first one is due to take effect.

• If you have two years’ continuous service at the time your notice from your employer expires, you are entitled to a reasonable period of paid time off during working hours to look for a new job.

FAQs - Redundancy

MJW

No, they can't just dismiss staff that like there is a redundancy process that must happen or it can be classed as instant unfair dismissal. As others have mentioned, the current employer must allow the employee to seek alternative work. The current employer is also obliged to notify people in writing they are at risk of redundancy, then hold a minuted meeting to discuss it ; allow time for both employer & employee to think about it and suggest things at the next meeting. These meetings have to be backed up with letters to prove the employer has explored every other possibility than redundancy. Then there is a final meeting where the results of the negotiations are announced.
Any company that fails to adopt this process can be taken to a tribunal & lose an unfair dismissal case.

boxst

You can say that after 30 days 19 people will be made redundant, that is not their notice period though. So any people then made redundant will be entitled to notice period pay + redundancy.

Steve

Torquemada

Been made redundant from a large American company in the oil and energy industry. I was on holiday and the rest of my team were told that no one in the meeting they attended would be made redundant (they all assumed our dept. had been untouched).

I then returned to work the following week and the code I normally used for the entry system no longer worked, so I thought it had been changed when I was away, no probs. I waited and another colleague opened the door for me and informed me of other colleagues who had also gone, "oh, how terrible" I remarked.
I then sat down, started reading the daily reports and connecting to the clients that needed work doing on them, and then one of the American managers called me into a meeting room. "oh dear", I thought, thinking she'd be letting me know of the current scenario.

The next part of the conversation went something like "you know the guys who have been made redundant?", "yes", I said. "well you're one of them, get your stuff and if you want you can say goodbye to the others when they get in, or you can go now".

That was it, end of, I said goodbye to my colleagues and left.

10% of the global workforce had been made redundant at the time and due to some bizarre employment rulings, they had the right to do what they did.
I got a couple of months wages and my notice wage and that was it (that was generous, for them)

Basically, as far as I know, it all depends on the employers base of operations to a degree. You've been informed of impending redundancies and hopefully, whoever is unfortunate enough to be the one to lose out should get the monies they are entitled too.

I'm not so sure on the 'instant unfair dismissal' though. I'm not so sure that employers have a duty to ensure their employees have a new job (that may be covered under the redundancy pay anyway).

It all depends on many finer points of the circumstance you're in.
CAB, the TUC and ACAS may be your best bets for info

Good luck, any which way!

Tom

tath

Loving the choice of 19 people, wonder why they didn't go for 20? *******s eh.

Yes, to summarise, you're allowed time off work if your under risk of redundancy, and they can chuck the 19 out but will have to pay their notice period + statutory redundancy aka pittance.

Moves like this backfire, because it shatters all trust in the company and when things pick up, all their best people will leave.

On a brighter note, there are some good schemes for retraining going around at the moment. If I was mind redundant (fingers crossed) I'd get ReAct funding for a couple of k worth of CAD courses that I've got my eye on

john_s

iTrader: (1)

As I understand, you are only entitled to time off to look for another job once you have been told you are being made redundant, not at the initial stage when you have only been told you are possibly facing a redundancy.

If, as the OP suggested, those made redundant are asked to leave immediately (I'm presuming that they will be paid in lieu of notice) will have their paid time off to look for work during their notice period.

MJW

The employer is not obliged to actually find you a new job, but they must look within the company to see if any potential redundancies can be re-trained and re-assigned to other areas in the company. If the procedure is not followed strictly it can be classed as unfair dismissal. Having had to make 3 of my employees redundant recently I am sadly familiar with the process.

EddScott

As we are a small company and the reasons for redundancy are that our levels of work have dropped how can a company try to find other jobs within itself if ther are none?


We have had to make redundancies.

My understanding is that you provide an at risk letter to those jobs that are at risk. You discuss the situation with the individuals concerned.

We have a redundancy package in place. Because we deal with sensitive information we use the Payment In Lew Of Notice and send them home the same day.

Its very sad but hard decisions need to be made in these times.

HankScorpio

Bit wordy but loads of info here:

Dismissals and redundancies - BERR

RMA26

Im currently in a 30 day "consultation period" which ends next week, they have to allow you time out for interviews, its a legal obligation for your employer to do so

Found out this morning that i might be kept on till March 09, which has both good and bad elements

Good - Steady income & gives me chance to find something and not rush it

Bad - I will have to stay working for a bunch of *******, doing work which values them and not me

Torquemada

Yes, I know, maybe I'm too used to it all, as I automatically assumed that everyone knew they should try to re-assign you before redundancy is the chosen way to go. Usually, if redundancies are mentioned then they have already found there is no where to put the people anyway.

I work for a trade union (not a negotiator though), so I see it all alot too

StickyMicky

when i was working for nissan in sunderland building the cars, i had never taken a days holiday all year, so near the end of the year i was forced to start taking them, i booked a load in, and only had 2 working days left after my holidays before the christmas shutdown.

came back for my 2 days and was told that somebody was supposed to have rung me and i was getting bladdered

how i enjoyed knocking them back the next 3 (yes three!) times they rang me back up asking me to come back

Ray_li

i'm already making plans just incase I get made redundant so i've got my fingers crossed for a new job and redundancy pay

A guy in the factory was made redundant whilst away on holiday so he never got his notice. After his holiday he came back to work and the company couldnt do ****, so they carried on employing him thats how stupid the company is

SPEN555

Undergoing the same consultatation process as above.

As stated above they are doing it by the book. If they finish you after the 30 days they will have to pay you the notice and the redundancy. Where I am now they are saying anyone on 3 months notice has to work it all

EddScott

Don't you mean if they finish you before the 30 days?

If you deal with sensitive information once you inform someone they are being made redundant they really have to go that day.

You have to pay them their final months salary under PILON rules. Payment In Lieu Of Notice plus the redundancy package - 1 week for every year which can be capped at £330 per week.

Ray_li

I've told my manager I can't be trusted with all the drawings to hand

SPEN555

If you are referring to my post the minimum 30 days is a consultation on the proposal they have put forward. You then undergo consultation to discuss alternatives to their proposal. After the 30 days they can then move to alternatives being exhausted and then starting serving notices. Therefore they will not finish you during the 30 days.

HankScorpio

Mine is being dealt with the same way as SPEN55 with collective consultancy, individual consultancy and then termination notice if no alternatives.

Usually, no one is asked to work their notice and gets paid in lieu and kicked out the first day after individual consultation ends.

I have seen people put on gardening leave during the individual consultations due to the nature of their jobs, they are fully employed, get paid and accrue benefits but are denied access to buildings/systems and only deal with HR and management in looking for alternative positions.

logiclee

If you are made to work your 13 weeks notice then your employer is obliged to give you time off for interviews.

If you are finished the same day and paid your 13 weeks as well as your redundancy then you have every day for 13 weeks to attend interviews while in effect still being on full pay.

You are far better being finished on the day than having to work 3 months notice.

There is no requirement to give time off for interviews during the 30 day notice period although most employers will once you have been informed you are at risk.

Cheers
Lee

Ray_li

i think they all know I'm having interviews during my 30 days notice period because I'm having a lot of sick days all of a sudden